Why are all government workers the same? (Bar the odd minority)

[Cel119]

By government workers i mean council, NHS, police, Ambulance.
Last night we had to go to A&E as relative was suffering from stroke symptoms. He didnt want to go alone so i accompanied. As he was being triaged the HCA asked for the blue folder and i handed it and she looked at me like i handed her a shit and said "ooooooo.... kkkkkk". I am type 1 diabetic and as relative was being assessed I started suffering a very bad hypo. I thought i was going to collapse. I think it was the combination of heat and insulin working too quickly. I said "im really sorry, im having a hypo and I need to sit" the HCA said "how do you know?" Considering I have had diabetes more than half my life I knew the symptoms and my sensor had alarmed me. But for some reason this hypo was making me feel really bad. She replied "if you want to be seen you will have to sign in" no compassion, empathy. Just stone cold nasty. I replied "I don't want to be seen i just need to sit" she did the same "oooo... kkkk" the room starting going really bright and I thought I need to get out. So I stumbled out holding the walls. I sat in a chair. The HCA asked a nurse to do my blood glucose(i think because she didnt believe me). The nurse came along grabbed my hand, didnt clean my hand, did blood glucose (from the wrong finger) and shoved my hand back at me then read out the glucose which were low. Then stomped off. I dont even know if she used a clean needle! I just sat and ate my jelly babies thinking please dont collapse as i didnt fancy that infront of a room full of strangers. It just seemed very harsh and cold to treat someone this way. I saw police treating another mental health patient the same. In my past I have had abhorrent behaviour from ambulance crew. Council workers are rude and dismissive of any issues anyone has. It's like the country has reached a massive disparity in power with the average working man being treated like a turd that would be better off dead. Why is everyone in these jobs like this? They don't think reasonably. You could explain a situation that seems completely reasonable and they will find a reason that it's not reasonable. I have had experiences like this time and again.
I have also worked as an qualified NHS worker(dietitian) and worked amongst them and they are some of the most cruel, uncaring and bullying type to work with. Towards patients and colleagues. It's a toxic environment. Full of bullies. Why? What fuels this? In a career where you are meant to care, you get people devoid of any humanity treating people in need. As I said, you get the odd person who clearly went into it because they want to help people, but not often.

I agree it's stressful ans under paid job. I know i worked in it. But it's a vocation too. People go into this not because of the money, because they care. Or that used to be why. Not anymore. When people are treated as people (whatever their circumstances) that's when the mutual respect will return. Whilst their are people who immediately turn their nose up at someone there will always be this problem. You don't go to hospital voluntarily to sit for hours whilst ill to receive abuse
They also out up these signs saying "we won't take abuse, physical or verbal. Choose your treatment" but are verbally and physically abusive to patients knowing the patient darent stand up for themselves because they could call police and say the patient was abusive. It's all done on purpose to trap people in a complete sense of powerlessness on how they are treated.
I say this because of the man who was seen by this particular lady who squeezed his broken foot so hard he screamed in pain. Then said he didnt need an x ray. Was answering him in a rude tone and said something to the effect of "oh not your type" which he took to mean his type being Irish.
I didnt say anything in response to my treatment or stand up for myself. I just felt way too ill to. I just accepted it and hoped the jelly babies would kick in soon lol. Really scary experience and to be treated like that too was hard.

I can’t say I agree with your sweeping generalisation ,no. I’m sorry they were rude to you but I’m just going to leave this here:

parable of the two villages:
A man who was traveling came upon a farmer working in his field and asked him what the people in the next village were like. The farmer asked, "What were the people like in the last village you visited?" The man responded, "They were rude, unfriendly, dishonest people." "You'll find the people in the next village are the same," said the farmer.
Another man who was traveling to the same village came up to the same farmer somewhat later and asked him what the people in the next village were like. Again, the farmer asked, "What were the people like in the last village you visited?" The second man responded, "They were kind, friendly, generous, great people." "You'll find the people in the next village are the same," said the farmer.

The ‘customers’ abuse the service by not attending booked appointments, turning up at A&E for trivial reasons & not following advice or taking medication as prescribed. We had 5 patients who did not attend for their CT scans today just in 1 site! Nearly 2 hours of appointments wasted. At least one of those was a repeat offender & only 1 called to cancel. The rest were no shows. Hapoens every day , at least 2 or 3 patients just don’t attend. No wonder productivity is low & waiting lists long! I expect in the private sector patients would be charged so would be less likely to cancel last minute or just not bother turning up!

On a personal level - bugger off OP!!
I’ve given 30 years nigh on, of blood sweat and literal tears as well as 100s of 60/65 hour weeks - to public service

In a sweeping general sense you may have a point about SOME workers and the existence in SOME instances of a prevailing culture where the public they serve become an ‘inconvenience’ (largely due to cuts/limited resources/ burn out/ goalposts changing/targers/new initiatives that reverse on a pin head etc etc)
Its very stressful trying to do your job with one hand tied behind your back and a lack of support from senior management ( for whom WE on the front line and our issues are their ‘inconvenience’ who’s attitude is the classic ‘JFGID’ !!!

I mean, I'm glad they haven't had such experiences, but some people don't seem to think such experiences exist. When my grandad was in a nursing home (due to MND, I couldn't have cared for him before people come for me) was at the very few days of his life, I asked the nurse for some more midazolam for him. She didn't return for an hour (I get they're busy etc) but obviously I went to ask again and apologised for being a pain (why I felt that was necessary I don't know) and she said she forgot. It made me so angry. We can't, as carers, administer things like that and have to call district nurses/Marie curie etc and I've never, ever forgotten that someone in my care required such medication. I just don't get it. How could you possibly forget that someone at the end of their life would require comfort medication?!

Have you met the general public recently? I couldn’t do their job.

I would go to PALS and provide some constructive feedback. They need a refresher course.

https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/hospitals/what-is-pals-patient-advice-and-liaison-service/

Tbh the more the OP posts the more sure I am that she is the issue here

Absolutely all the nurses I had in hospital (ward nurses and 24/7 RMN for 5 weeks, so a lot of nurses) were at worst simply professional and a bit monosyllabic, and at best really lovely, kind and had a really nice personality. None seemed cruel or nasty at all.

I'm sorry for your experience but I've never felt the majority of NHS staff are horrible..I think they're bloody saints a lot of the time!

So because of your very narrow view of seeing these incidents in one a&e, all nhs workers are the same?

my husband attended a&e ( for an actual emergency btw) and they couldn’t have been more attentive, professional, kind and caring. The aftercare on the wards and in therapy appointments have been brilliant. I also work in the same hospital different dept and we receive letters of praise for our care regularly

Pension is dependant on salary and what you pay in.

I work in primary care... NO sick pay, statutory maternity pay.

Next....

Ive worked in the civil service and the NHS, and I think your sweeping generalisations are hugely unhelpful.

Having said which, all workplaces have their cultures and there is often a negative side. The NHS does have a bullying problem and also a lot of burnout that can lead to bitter, insular thinking and lack of empathy. Chronic staffing shortages mean staff who should have been moved on get retained, and overuse of agency staff mean crap staff can just keep moving through the system.

But your analysis is back to front. The problem is not that horrible people get recruited into public service, it's that horrendous working conditions will result in poor staff behaviours. I'm not defending that, it's just a fact. And it's a fact in the private sector just as much as the public sector.

@Ketzele Except that most private firms don’t use agency staff and don’t return useless people. That’s the difference. People don’t want to work for poorly managed organisations and the NHS in particular really needs to improve although some aspects are good.

Have you seen how public sector workers get treated by the public sometimes. Maybe that's a good place to start to find an answer to your question.

And your speculating on whether the nurse used a dirty needle? And calling people cunts? How do you explain those? I gave you some context (and yes, I do know what I am talking about) and you just justified what you did in an aggressive way. And then used that to write off all public service workers everywhere. The more you write, the more I think your attitude is part of the problem.

That's not my experience. I can only think of a few times I have had bad care, a couple of times as a teenager and again following my first birth which was 16 years ago. Fantastic maternity care with my youngest. DH was recently in hospital and had great treatment, my youngest has had medical issues and been treated well at all outpatients appointments. I've been in an ambulance twice in my lifetime, the paramedics were great. One of those was when my son was having an asthma attack and the paramedic was so good with him.

So you’re specifically complaining about HCAs who are paid minimum wage for a demanding job in shit conditions dealing with shit patients (google how many NHS workers get attacked, sexually harassed, or the latest, videoed for TikTok) … and , not conincidentally, are women, in the most sexist country of Europe. Because men would not do this work in shit conditions for low pay.

(For comparison look up the Birmingham bin men strikes and train drivers wages, and ask yourself which is the most valuable worker)

You might also want to consider the consequences of doing this kind of work, helping people, in said shit conditions, only to be told in the media that you’re lazy and unproductive.

Anyway I’ll go read the thread now I know what it’s about.

Why are patients ad people who ring up the council so obnoxious? The generalisation works both ways.

Probably because most people who’ve worked directly with the public will have been shouted at, sworn at, spat at, verbally abused and more and at the end of a long shift have very little empathy left. Only a minority of customers/clients are like this but it makes you wary and distrustful. It worse if you frequently have to say ‘no’ to something they want.

I’m a Social Worker in a council. I work my socks off and we are over worked and underpaid! I certainly don’t do it for the money and just want to help people. Social work is also a thankless job!

I’m not quite sure where this oft repeated right wing male trope about NHS low productivity comes from.

Whats known is that the NHS is actually quite efficient for the amount of money spent on it and the numbers of staff that it has. Where it fails is down to the limited number of staff and amou t of equipment. This is all compared to other European countries.

https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/insight-and-analysis/blogs/comparing-nhs-to-health-care-systems-other-countries

What I’ve noticed time and time again is that reason, knowledge, and facts really are not wanted or cared about when ideology is at stake. You can’t reason with either money or prejudice, because they are neither of them founded on reason.

@WaryCrow I’m not right wing. Maybe it’s millions on waiting lists? You look at the balance between inputs and output. The Kings Fund is a good source of info as you say but it backs up what I’m saying.

Oh and NHS England quotes exactly the same data as a reason to drive up productivity. So no one who matters thinks it’s good enough.

You refer to them as an HCA and (forgive me if I’m wrong) they are very junior in the ranking of HCPs - junior to nurses. So they’re probably getting paid bugger all to deal with a large bulk of the work. My perception is it’s a very thankless task, and probably not made easier by those there to support the patients declaring themselves unwell and in need of care.

Wow! Not made easier by patients declaring themselves unwell?!?!? in A&E??? is this for real???

If they are paid so little then why not to get a job at Tesco? or hang on, they wouldn't get their pension then, sickness policy, they could be sacked easily, right? so their jobs aren't that shitty then.
Out of all PS workers I met, 95% wouldn't last a week in private sector.

I know what you mean about hospitals. They have become generally horrific.

But ime it doesnt extend to other public services. It doesnt even extend to my GP practice which is excellent.