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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

SEN funding isn't a bottomless money pit

1000 replies

Sogfree · 07/06/2025 06:31

I'll preface this by saying I really enjoy my job working in a SEN school. I care deeply for the children and families I work with.

I've had 4 different conversations this week with parents where they expect an excessive amount of additional resource to be allocated to their child. They expect this as, in their opinion, it's needed. I disagree with 3 of the 4 parents that this is needed.

All 4 of the parents are going to fight the decisions county have made. Their decision to fight will mean county spend more money arguing the challenge.

Services are already broken with the increase in need. Recruitment fails, as there aren't enough speech therapists/OTs/CAMHS practitioners etc to employ.

One parent demanding extra from one of these services means another child gets less.

One parent demanding a child goes to school X at £100k per year when a place at school Y at £30k is going to meet their needs means the child who needs the place at school X doesn't get it, and extra £70k per year is wasted. And the parent keeps their child out of school for 12-18 months whilst they fight for the place at school X.

That's the reality.

Every parent wants the world for their child. I understand that. But taxpayers can't afford to give every child the world.

AIBU - parents know their child best and we should fund what the parents say the child needs

YANBU - there's only so much money to go around and parents need to accept hard decisions have to be made without challenging them

OP posts:
BlueandWhitePorcelain · 08/06/2025 11:32

Independent SEN schools can be misleading in what actual provision they give and what the outcomes are for children. Money could be better spent in mainstream with better and neutral oversight.

DD1 went a specialist speech and language school, which was in the top 5% of all schools for value added! The children did SATs and GCSEs. The school was inspected by Ofsted and CSCI, as it was then. The school did a range of standard assessments on DD1 like CELF for the annual review, to see what progress she had made. The LA’s specialist Ed psy used to come to DD1’s annual reviews. What more neutral oversight does the average mainstream school get?

We knew exactly what input DD1 was getting. We could go and talk to her speech and language therapist on a Friday afternoon, when we went to pick her up, whenever we wanted. One term, there was the annual review, and the other two terms, there were was a parent teacher consultation with the teacher and several of the subject teachers, one of the class TAs, where we could look at all her exercise books and art work, etc beforehand. We also had a conversation with her OT after it.

It might be your opinion, that money could be spent better in mainstream schools, but the fact is there are some children like DD1, who needed signing, visual support, and symbols to aid comprehension. In a mainstream school, she couldn't understand what the teacher was saying, couldn't read the material and didn't understand what she was supposed to to be doing, despite being a bright child - as were the vast majority of children in her school. It is ludicrous to suggest that children, who need to be in special/specialist schools, especially those with low incidence disorders could cope in mainstream, when the whole environment is wrong for them! How many ordinary class teachers can sign?

Eventually speech and language schools couldn't meet her medical needs. If they could not with a class of ten, a teacher, 2 class TAs, a FT class speech and language therapist and an on-site nurse all waking hours, then how on earth would a mainstream school cope with a child, who needed 999 up to three times a week? I can tell you from personal experience of watching other people, that the staff would have panicked.

She had to go to another specialist school, where they monitored the cognitive performance of the students continuously. If they had noticed DD1’s cognitive performance going down, over 6 weeks, they’d have done an EEG on-site and made an appointment for her with her on-site consultant. Children get sent to these schools, because in the end, its cheaper to have the on-site medical centre deal with most of the emergencies, than have the fragmented NHS dealing with it all!

How many mainstream schools monitor cognitive performance in children, with progressive deteriorating medical conditions (including side effects of aggression, irritability and challenging behaviour) and attempt to change their medical treatment. If you are wondering why bother - because the social care for the adults is so much harder and more expensive, the worse their behaviour gets.

I know someone who had to go to tribunal for the same school. The parents were able to prove to the tribunal, the school with a boarding placement Monday to Friday, plus a quote from his taxi company (to bring him home on a Friday and take him back on a Sunday night) was cheaper than the LA’s proposed SLD school (which was unsuitable for him anyway, as he was MLD), plus the cost of the social care package (£45,000 pa at that time) and the daily taxi. The hearing didn't even start, as the chair awarded the parents the specialist school placement, on the grounds of the most efficient use of resources! This didn't even take into account the extra costs to the NHS of the LA’s school.

School placements like this are either joint funded by education and social services, as DD1’s was, so her social worker was also monitoring the placement by looking round and attending most of the meetings. Some children had tripartite funding from education, social services and the NHS - to reflect the costs to each, of the child having care in their local community instead, including the NHS.

The cost to the NHS of an ambulance plus a bed for the night, which DD1 usually had is £722 a time - so up to three times a week is £2,166 before any education.

Avantiagain · 08/06/2025 11:40

"Authorities want to avoid expensive battles which diverts yet more money from the weakest."

LAs know they will save money on provision during the wait for Tribunal. This is why they concede so many cases at the last minute.

DeftLemonTraybake · 08/06/2025 11:42

It's all part of the individualistic culture that has taken over.

And lack of understanding of the equality act.

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 11:45

Avantiagain · 08/06/2025 11:40

"Authorities want to avoid expensive battles which diverts yet more money from the weakest."

LAs know they will save money on provision during the wait for Tribunal. This is why they concede so many cases at the last minute.

And it’s disgusting

greencartbluecart · 08/06/2025 11:54

Disgusting? Of desperate ? Have you never been in the situation where you are watching every penny and knowing you can’t afford the basics for your family? That’s the case with the councils today

Avantiagain · 08/06/2025 12:04

"Disgusting? Of desperate ? Have you never been in the situation where you are watching every penny and knowing you can’t afford the basics for your family? That’s the case with the councils today"

Have you ever been in the position when your profoundly disabled teenager has had no education for a year and you are having to educate and care for them 24/7 as well as caring for your husband who has cancer?

CluelessBereavement · 08/06/2025 12:06

greencartbluecart · 08/06/2025 11:54

Disgusting? Of desperate ? Have you never been in the situation where you are watching every penny and knowing you can’t afford the basics for your family? That’s the case with the councils today

Oh please!

Not comparable in the slightest. For a start, I'd sacrifice my 6 figure salary in a heartbeat when if I was failing children.

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:07

greencartbluecart · 08/06/2025 11:54

Disgusting? Of desperate ? Have you never been in the situation where you are watching every penny and knowing you can’t afford the basics for your family? That’s the case with the councils today

I work for a local authority. And I’m more than happy to say yes, it’s disgusting.

and doesnt remotely equate to a family having to find a way to feed their child.

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:10

greencartbluecart · 08/06/2025 11:54

Disgusting? Of desperate ? Have you never been in the situation where you are watching every penny and knowing you can’t afford the basics for your family? That’s the case with the councils today

And for the record, yes I have been in that position.

A LA going bankrupt because central government isn’t prioritising funding, is NOTHING like walking around with holes in your shoes and going without food so your child can eat (which I have done thanks to the fucked up housing and benefits system)

Needlenardlenoo · 08/06/2025 12:14

I don't think LAs can actually go bankrupt in the sense that a private business can. They can of course run out of money and central government steps in.

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:15

Needlenardlenoo · 08/06/2025 12:14

I don't think LAs can actually go bankrupt in the sense that a private business can. They can of course run out of money and central government steps in.

That’s right - s114

HMart1n · 08/06/2025 12:16

HollyBerryz · 08/06/2025 10:14

Well you wouldn't get it if there wasn't an evidenced need for it so I'm not sure what your point is?

The point is there are cheaper ways to meet need and if every parent just demanded the most expensive it would not be viable.

Needlenardlenoo · 08/06/2025 12:18

The minimum per pupil spend at secondary is over £6k so even with the EHCP, my LA will actually save money each year because DC is in another LA. They "export" 20% of their SEN DC actually (publicly available data).

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:20

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:15

That’s right - s114

But the point is services are absolutely slashed to the bone at that (and indeed before) point

No subsidised youth groups,.no subsidised bus services, outdoor centres and leisure centres get shut,.roads and pavements go unmaintained, playgrounds get closed, bin collections and street cleaning become less frequent, there are fewer staff to answer calls and process applications quickly...

I would love everyone to have gold plated everything. But if we cant then what there is needs to be shared equitably.

Keepgoing2022 · 08/06/2025 12:24

HMart1n · 08/06/2025 12:16

The point is there are cheaper ways to meet need and if every parent just demanded the most expensive it would not be viable.

They are not demanding the most expensive though they are fighting for the needs of their children if the current system worked they wouldn’t need to ! It’s not the parents at fault it’s the system.

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:27

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:20

But the point is services are absolutely slashed to the bone at that (and indeed before) point

No subsidised youth groups,.no subsidised bus services, outdoor centres and leisure centres get shut,.roads and pavements go unmaintained, playgrounds get closed, bin collections and street cleaning become less frequent, there are fewer staff to answer calls and process applications quickly...

I would love everyone to have gold plated everything. But if we cant then what there is needs to be shared equitably.

Asking for a child to have an education suitable and in line with the law is BASIC - not gold plated.

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:30

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:27

Asking for a child to have an education suitable and in line with the law is BASIC - not gold plated.

So is wanting to be able catch a bus to the shops or doctors as a disabled person.

Or having access to a library.

Or being able to use your wheelchair without being upended due to all the potholes

Or having your bin collected.

CluelessBereavement · 08/06/2025 12:32

HMart1n · 08/06/2025 12:16

The point is there are cheaper ways to meet need and if every parent just demanded the most expensive it would not be viable.

Parents are demanding access to education for their child. Their legal and human right to an education.

You've clearly been fed the nonsense spouted by LAs. None of your posts reflect what is actually happening. You're a caseworker I'm guessing?

CluelessBereavement · 08/06/2025 12:33

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:30

So is wanting to be able catch a bus to the shops or doctors as a disabled person.

Or having access to a library.

Or being able to use your wheelchair without being upended due to all the potholes

Or having your bin collected.

None of those are a legal right. Or a human right.

perpetualplatespinning · 08/06/2025 12:33

The point is there are cheaper ways to meet need and if every parent just demanded the most expensive it would not be viable.

If there were cheaper ways to meet needs, it would be provided instead. Parents don’t get provision just because they ‘demand’ it.

no subsidised bus services

Just to point out this isn’t the case in all areas. I was recently supporting a parent with their DC’s EHCP. They live in Barnsley, who are making bus travel for all under 18s free from August this year until July 2027. A project costing £6mil, apparently. Yet their LA claim they don’t have enough money for SEN provision and suitable school transport.

Keepgoing2022 · 08/06/2025 12:34

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:30

So is wanting to be able catch a bus to the shops or doctors as a disabled person.

Or having access to a library.

Or being able to use your wheelchair without being upended due to all the potholes

Or having your bin collected.

And why do you think they all shouldn’t have that why is it the disabled kids shouldn’t get the correct education adaptions because of those who need that ?

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:35

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:30

So is wanting to be able catch a bus to the shops or doctors as a disabled person.

Or having access to a library.

Or being able to use your wheelchair without being upended due to all the potholes

Or having your bin collected.

Are they enshrined in law?

you carry on begrudging children an education.

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:38

spicemaiden · 08/06/2025 12:35

Are they enshrined in law?

you carry on begrudging children an education.

I don't begrudge children an education. I am just an adult who recognises that there are lots of competing needs and our limited resources need to be shared equitably.

ungratefulcat · 08/06/2025 12:38

I expect you'd all be pretty miserable if your bin bags started piling up in the streets 🤷‍♀️

HMart1n · 08/06/2025 12:39

perpetualplatespinning · 08/06/2025 12:33

The point is there are cheaper ways to meet need and if every parent just demanded the most expensive it would not be viable.

If there were cheaper ways to meet needs, it would be provided instead. Parents don’t get provision just because they ‘demand’ it.

no subsidised bus services

Just to point out this isn’t the case in all areas. I was recently supporting a parent with their DC’s EHCP. They live in Barnsley, who are making bus travel for all under 18s free from August this year until July 2027. A project costing £6mil, apparently. Yet their LA claim they don’t have enough money for SEN provision and suitable school transport.

Well they do. Posters on here are having horse riding lessons for core muscle issues, parents are demanding expensive packages with private education and therapies that many have cheaper alternatives for and schools could provide. Those that can afford the legal representation and time and who are better equipped to argue are getting more than others who can’t.

The system needs to change dramatically with it being fair for all, with more cost effective provision, more pumped into MS and without the private sector siphoning off state money.

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