Is it normal school asking us to pay for additional support?

[OnlyOneBike]

Son is nearly 5 years old and in reception of an independent school. We've been told he has behaviour issues in school such as making silly noises in classes or pushing down other children's lego etc. He is probably sat out two / three times per week. We've observed him playing in groups (birthday parties, clubs, etc). He's definitely the less destructive type but can become overexcited quite easily and do silly things especially among children. He's behaving much better with grown ups. Teachers and we all agree his main problem is impulse control.

We regularly talk to his teachers to make sure we can reflect with him any incidents in school. Now is the confusing bit. One of his form teachers (they have two because of job sharing) who is also school SENCO thinks he needs additional support and has asked us many times to consider additional support from a named therapist at an additional cost. The other form teacher seems to be ok with the current situation and is always quiet when we talked about additional support.

We are not against having more support if that's needed but we feel very unsure. For one, the cost really puts us off. For two, we don't know anything about this named therapist and don't feel very comfortable for our son to have to meet them regularly without us.

We asked the school SENCO if our son needs a diagnosis or can we go through the standard council process and request someone whose qualification is more visible like doctor from NHS to help us (EHC or something I think it's called?). But they said it was nothing like that and he didn't need a diagnosis.

Please can experienced parents share their thoughts on this? Does this sound the right approach? Should we accept what the SENCO proposed? Should we talk to the headmaster? We are definitely willing to work with the school and support our child as needed. But we have zero experience. Nor do our family or freinds. Desperately need some independent opinions. Thanks in advance!

If he’s being so badly behaved he’s being sent out, it does sound like he’s in need of extra support. They do give the reception/y1 kids a lot of leeway and tend to let them have a lot of choosing time/ play time where they have activities to pick from themselves. If he’s being sent out sounds like it’s got bad and he may benefit from the help.

As said by a PP, make sure that any therapist you use is registered with the Health and Care Professions Council (HCPC). They are the regulatory body and ensure that their members have the appropriate qualifications relevant to their protected professional title.

Sorry, but this is a total post code lottery. SOME state schools offer more / better send support than SOME state schools, but in most of the country it is incredibly difficult to get support of any sort when needed. That isn’t just my experience, but a matter of public record. We started in state and moved to indie, and my 2dc (different send with very different needs) get waaaaaay more support at the indie, and support needs are flagged earlier and delivered without delay.

I worked as a SENCo for 26 years and submitted over 150 statement of SEN/EHCP requests. Two were refused - one state, one private. Both were reassessed and given an EHCP when parents said they would go to SEN tribunal. I found that SENCos in independent schools were much less knowledgeable about the 2015 Code of Practice and the 2010 Equality Act than SENCos in state schools.

Some independent schools are better equipped than others for SEN. I think where we live (in Berkshire) the Dophin school has that reputation. I’d be inclined to shop around a bit, look at other schools.

You’d be silly to turn them down. If he’s being disruptive, there’s a need. Let them address the need or they may decide to manage him
out especially if other parents complain. Private schools often will pander to parents and try to meet the needs without telling them they should have the child formally assessed. It doesn’t make the SEN magically disappear. Your son is standing out to them who collectively will have seen thousands of children. I’d definitely get him assessed privately.

OP, I think that you need to have a further meeting with the SENCO and ask all these questions and pin them down a bit more about what their possible concerns are and about assessment options etc. I would think assessment is needed before therapy really.

You need to work with school. It may be that you decide to have an assessment outside school or to access some support outside school, but if he’s in that school you need to work with them too and communication will be very important. Be open to hearing what they are saying and open to possibilities of assessment. It is unusual for schools to raise these issues without there being something behind what they say.

This will be a journey and probably a long one with no instant answers. School will be wary about making a diagnosis (they can’t do this) or being too definite about their concerns. Parents often struggle with it all. In the end, you are in charge. Sometimes parents are approached by school for years with concerns and are not interested and v keen for their DC not to be ‘labelled’ or are sure there is a stigma attached to any kind of assessment. Their child is never asssessed and never accessed the support that could have made. A massive difference to their educational experience and outcomes. Often parents are wary and many want to wait a bit. That’s fine. But if issues keep coming up, it’s worth taking it seriously and seeing that there could be support available that transforms his school experience.

If you’re paying fees, there will always be extras. It’s all part of it and unavoidable. My view is that if an assessment would be useful and you can pay, it’s worth it as the queues for these things are absolutely ages via the NHS. A year or two years of schooling can slip away very fast and kids only get one go of their education .

If he's got SEN you should get him assessed so you don't have to pay. If he's "just being disruptive" they want you to pay for someone to manage him. Which I can understand. Parents pay so their children can be in a calm environment. I got one SEN in secondary state w support and one in private because we wanted for him to be in a peaceful environment without disruptive pupils (whatever the reason; SEN or badly behaved).

Chiming in. My now 15 year old has been at an independent since he was 4. he had extra support via a 1-1 TA for about two terms and we paid for that. £14 an hour and she was with him I think 3 or so mornings a week. After a bit the need was seen to no longer be necessary (he is very delayed compared to his peers and was essentially non-verbal at the time) and the extra support stopped.

So yes, our experience was this is normal.

what strategies has the class teacher already tried with your child?
what qualifications has this 'therapist' got? is it a TA? who will plan the sessions?
He is very young to be bringing in a 1:1 before having tried a wide range of strategies.

Some on here won't agree with what I'm going to say but my feeling is that if you don't think he's SEN and they are not quite channeling that yet, you definitely know he's not.

Run now, run fast and don't look back. We have a clever child who's young in year, our experience at an independent school was horrendous. They made us jump through hoops, we ended up having an autism assessment. The consultant wrote to the school SENCO and head stating in no uncertain terms how wrong they were. We left, we never looked back.

They wanted sporty and compliant. They didn't want independent minded.

This behaviour sounds developmentally normal for a 4 year old. My instinct would be to look for another school.

If your child is struggling, I would seriously consider getting him into a good state school soonish. Private schools vary in their desire and ability to support children with additional needs. They are highly influenced by other parents, who they don't want to upset too, and if your son has behaviour issues in class, this will probanly start to cause you problems, both socially and with the school.

They often don't know how to apply for an ehc and the LA is often reluctant because they will suspect that a state school could meet needs without an ehc.

I used to work in ehc parent support and we had constant problems with children at private schools.

I would seriously look at what is available in the state sector. It will give your son more support and he may find it easier to make friends.

I would also suggest you get him privately assessed by an Ed psych, OT and Speech and Language Therapist. I would recommend you speak to SOS!SEN or similar for advice.

I agree - OP shouldn’t have to pay for a classroom TA for Reception. All state schools will have at least one TA and Reception children should be playing, because they’re 4 or 5 years old.

I agree with this.

Some children take longer to "comply" with all the rules they have at school. Especially true if he's one of the youngest and a bit excitable. Obviously there is more pressure at school so it's more difficult to "behave" but you haven't noticed anything that alarms you with his behaviour outside school.

Does he only get sat out with one of the teachers? Yes they can absolutely be biased. The Sendco said he doesn't need a diagnosis? But he needs extra support from some kind of therapist, for language? But the problem is his behaviour? Hmm. I'm wondering if she is a bit rubbish and can't deal with your son so wants someone else to. The behaviour you describe is pretty standard in reception and they usually grow out of it. I would go with your instincts, ignore Sendco for now and see how he is next year with a different teacher.

Our independent has a TA and a teacher in a class of <15. Nowhere has op indicated that they are asking her to pay for a ‘class ta’.

edited to add that our indie was far more play based for longer than the state school we started with. Stop with the private school stereotypes- there is a great deal of diversity in the sector, and the benefit of paying is that you can pick an ethos that works for your child.

No, they are asking OP to pay for a 1:1 and as a very experienced SENCo, I know it’s unhealthy for an additional adult to be Velcroed to a 4 year old when he’s playing, so as a Reception class teacher I would be making sure the child didn’t feel singled out by having an adult with him. Therefore the TA that one parent is paying for - on top of fees - would be supporting other children. That’s why my advice would be to look for another school.

Ds had an IEP throughout his state primary but the help lessened as he went through the school (mostly because the SENCO had family issues). He also had speech and language therapy via NHS but the sessions were very sporadic as they were always short on speech therapists. In the end we went private and he really progressed. He joined an independent prep school when he was in year 7 and the teachers generally dealt with any problems relating to his ND very well without the need of any support - which we would have had to fund.

I appreciate you sharing your knowledge of additional support at an independent school, but as a senior leader of a primary school, I just want to correct your post.

Many state schools either use the funds from their pupil premium budgets or the money they have because they have lots of children with EHCPs on very well trained ‘in house’ practitioners (who are not TAs).

My school has a very accomplished counsellor and a brilliant speech and language therapist on site. If OP’s child were in our school they would have access to these professionals.

Not all state schools provide the less than adequate provision which you describe.

Just wanting a bit of clarity: You say the "SENCO thinks he needs additional support and has asked us many times to consider additional support from a named therapist at an additional cost. The other form teacher seems to be ok with the current situation and is always quiet when we talked about additional support."

Is the SENCO actually suggesting you child needs additional support IN the classroom, to learn better and/or manage his behaviour in that setting? Or are they saying that you should think about your son having therapy outside of school to help him with some aspects of life?

It is NOT legal for an independent school to charge parents for providing in school support that a child needs because of disability . Since the 2010 Equality Act, additional support to help the child manage in the school setting is generally regarded as part of providing an education to the child. However obviously they can suggest that the child has additional therapy to help the child, not to help the school manage, and can charge what they like for them!

They are asking op to pay for some therapy sessions, not a full time 1:1.

my dc had therapy in school and it was one session a week for a term. Immensely helpful, and grateful for the proactive and attentive teachers who saw the need and put support in place so promptly.

Independent school means you pay for things like this. Yabu to think you dont. Doesn't sound like the school is right for your dc though as they supporting you. Is there more supportive schools near by. Sens provision is awful and takes years to set up. I've friends who got children in year 4 who been waiting since reception for the support their children need.

It doesn’t sound to me as though a 4 year old needs therapy for the reasons described in the original post.

a threshold amount (I think it's £6000 per year) but the process of getting that statement of needs takes at least 2 years.

The school does not have to spend £6k before an EHCP is issued. That is a myth LAs like to perpetuate. The EHCP process doesn’t take 2 years unless that time is because of appeals (whichever I appreciate some do).