To resent the U-turn on winter fuel allowance?

[BlueEyedStarling]

Perhaps I'm existing in a bubble, but all of the pensioners I know, are pretty well off, or comfortable, at least. I live and have older family in the South East, but my dad and his elderly partner, live in the North. Literally, all of them say they dont need the WFA, but happily accept it regardless and shouted from the rooftops when it was taken away from them. Just how long can the working age population keep paying for this increasing, triple-lock section of society who are, as a whole, the wealthiest amongst us? Personally, we fell through the gaps of being able to receive any child benefit (only just!), but have always been willing to accept that we didn't need it and therefore shouldn't have it. Is it that our middle-aged generation just dont shout as loudly about things that affect us? I do want to add that I am very aware that there are many pensioners who should be in receipt of the WFA and that the cut off was too low. Also, that our pensioners fair pretty badly in comparison to much of Europe. It seems criminal that it can't be means tested to benefit those who really do need it.

I'd say you're in a rare position to not know any pensioners who aren't struggling financially.

Means testing benefits costs money in adminstration. If the amount saved by means-testing is less than the administration cost then it makes sense not to means-test.

I work with a considerable amount of pensioners .. There are some that are living the life of luxury but many that aren’t .

I'm with OP.

The means testing happens anyway via pension credit.
The campaign to get more pensioners to sign up for pension credit has been very successful, I hear.

It's not even that much money... it's < a single month's winter gas+lekki bill.

If I get the stupid winter fuel allowance when I'm age 65+ I'm paying it back to the Treasury.

I'm just hoping they do a u turn on disability cuts tbh 🥺

I agree with you op.

They removed child benefit from higher earners..no one seemed to kick up much of a fuss about that. I know plenty of pensioners who are rolling in it and don't need it...why should they get something when we had to pay back CB.

I don't know a heck of a lot of pensioners but like you, I know some who certainly do not need the WFA, including my former boss, who's a millionaire. I've also heard my in-laws saying that they don't need it and they always used to use it to cover some nice meals out. I didnt think they were going to scrap the means testing, only the limits. Will they scrap the whole means testing? I can imagine it would be quite difficult for a lot of elderly people to deal with the forms.

I think it should be means tested. Child benefit used to be universal and is now means tested.

But I think pension credit as a threshold, wasn’t sufficient, and excluded people who genuinely needed it. But we don’t yet actually know what the u-turn will consist of and what it will look like do we?
Indications suggest that they will raise the threshold so more are eligible though, I think this is the right thing.
But I do think it’s right to not be universal and go to those that need it, but it’s hard as with all benefits to know where that line is drawn.

I do understand the frustration though OP - it does feel like younger generations are paying for state pensions and benefits that are triple locked when we will be lucky to still get a state pension at all by the way things are going, despite all the years of paying in.

I can’t see an announcement of what they are actually doing yet so I’ll reserve judgement until then.

I am watching BBC Panorama, ‘Is Britain broke?’ On now.
it is discussing why there is no money. Governments have been scared to tackle the huge demand on money from all Departments. People expect more than ever. The state is struggling to meet our expectations so those expectations have to change,
They case studied a woman, a single mother with a teenage daughter, who had just started a new job as an admin person in a law firm. She explained that she could only work part time because she was a mother ( of a teenage daughter). She cried when she described having to use a food bank but it didn’t appear to make her think she should work full time.
The programme compared the demands on the Welfare State when it was founded, to the demands on it today. It suggested that the current spending pattern cannot continue. It high lighted the cancer treatments that can no longer be funded because the Welfare Bill is so high. We cannot have it all.
There are an awful lot of posters who believe in money trees which don’t exist in real life.

My MIL was complaining loudly about the winter fuel payment having been taken away, DH did point out that is is on a cruise for a month during the winter so it maybe wasn’t critical for her.
I do think that the burden is very unequally shared in the UK.

Just watched the same programme and couldn't believe the woman crying over having to use a food bank. Honestly just get a full time job like the rest of us that are paying your UC have to ! It really is quite a scary situation the mess that the country is in and a spiralling benefits bill.

All the pensioners I know including family and wider family are wealthier that we are working full time. In-laws sat in front of the screen moaning about wfa being ditched and they have thousands in the bank and live in a 4 bed bungalow with double garage. Appreciate NAPALT

I do not know any pensioners who are financially struggling at all...yet they all complained bitterly about losing the winter fuel payment.
When I pointed out that it was still paid to those that need it , and wasn't that money put to better use maybe giving it to any age groups who cannot afford fuel...like families with children? They all said " but I paid my taxes, entitled to it ".
It was seen as a perk not a benefit.
A benefit should be something given to those that need it...

And yet we can fund £16 billion on nuclear weapons that we could never dare to use....There are an awful lot of posters who seem to think funding life and not death is unreasonable.

I think the problem is that it would cost too much to means test it so it was easier to just give it to everyone or no-one.
Yes they had the pension credit to judge it by but there where still a lot of people who just missed out on pension credit but were still struggling financially!

I do benefit checks for pensioners and regularly have people ringing up pleading poverty. When I look at what they have coming in they often have £600+ a week coming in for a couple with no housing costs. I do understand that they need the heating on more because they are generally home more and less mobile but it baffles me as to how people can;t manage on that ( usually 2 x state pensions and often small private pensions). I think they just expect to still be running a massive car well into their eighties too. I appreciate it's harder for single pensioners and do think most should get the wfp.

Whilst agreeing that there are pensioners who live comfortably and have a good income, I think some partial U turn would be reasonable. I also think that the energy companies should be charging less for everyone.

There are often posts on here from posters who are totally exasperated with their elderly parents pleading poverty and refusing to pay for carers, cleaners or other help that would make their lives easier....often they have thousands and thousands in the bank and a large property they own outright.

It should be means tested. My mother didn't need it but received it anyway.

When she died in October a couple of years ago, as her executor I informed the DWP of her death. I received a lovely letter in sympathy and advising me that her winter fuel payment would be paid as usual in December and if she hadn't received it I should get in contact. On receipt of the letter, I phoned DWP and explained that my mother was dead and she didn't need a winter fuel payment. DWP informed me that they knew she was dead but because she was alive in the August she had to receive it even if the payment was credited it to her estate. Madness.

I had one elderly man last winter , I would say he was the only one I saw all winter who was sitting in a cold house with no central heating. Offered to do a benefit check for him to see if I could get him some Pension credit and therefore his wfp back and turned out he had £180k in the bank ! I find it baffling.

So many people seem to live in a bubble of knowing only wealthy pensioners. I guess it's because they're the only ones that are mentioned and more visible.. I can assure you there are probably more living day to day than all these apparent moaning millionaires.

This includes dh and I and pretty much all of the ones I come across at work. (NHS)

I wish people would stop this bloody generalising.
No-one likes it when young people are told they should 'stop buying coffees and avacadoes' and they'd be ok, so why is the assumption that we're all loaded acceptable?

We are not, either, all wholly responsible for the state of the economy today and smug about about our pensions and houses. It grates, it really does

It’s madness. It’s totally disproportionate to the need. There are some interesting statistics about the norms for different age groups, and that is T the group most likely to need help paying fuel bills.

My DM is one of the not so well off but not quite poor enough to claim pensions credit, so it really did really hit her.

But I’m still in agreement, it should have always had the capacity to opt out, and yet it didn’t so we saw millions go to pensioners living in hot country’s, pensioners who can easily afford fuel etc. maybe they should give it based on taxable income? Or some other way of means testing that means it’s fairly distributed.

But give people an opt out!

Younger generations won't get it and the state pension age will keep moving out. In that context it isn't fair but what can you do.

@BlueEyedStarling nothing has been confirmed yet

Shouldn't you wait until there is actually something to be annoyed about? (in your view)