Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think car ownership is out of control in the UK

657 replies

JacquesHarlow · 02/06/2025 13:27

I fully expect to get a vast majority of "YABU" comments, but here goes:

Firstly, before I get flamed - I am a woman, a car owner, and yes I have a driveway now (though didn't before). I am a car enthusiast in terms of the enjoyment I've got from driving and I don't have an issue with "cars" per se.

What I have an issue with is how ridiculous Britain's councils and governments are on car ownership. How cheap car ownership is. How anyone can distort the living environment around them with their choices.

Have you driven down a suburban street lately, or even an urban one?

Small and narrow Victorian streets with lines of cars packed on either side, and only room for one vehicle to drive down it. Why so many cars? The houses have been there for 150 years. Why now?

And because so many people (often fellow women, annoyingly) don't ever like reversing, you find yourself caught in the middle, having to reverse right back to the end of the street to start again.

School runs are chaos - so many cars, parking up in illegal or careless ways, purely to save a short distance walking.

And the size of cars! Absurdly large vehicles which then take up more road space on the kerbside. Yeah it is "legal" but in a decade where theoretically we want to get better as a country environmentally, most people do not give two fucks as long as their precious DCs are "safe" (you're just as safe in a NCAP 5* rated Yaris as you are in a Merc GLS, but try telling that to people where I live).

So this is the madness of today:

Cars are SO much bigger. And thanks to PCP they're cheaper - and this is why I see so many cars where I live ,and up north when I visit, and everywhere else. The PCP monthlies thing keys right into the British obsession of wanting to look and feel wealthy. Years ago a Golf or an Audi A3 would be considered posh for a family. But why would I buy a Golf when my monthly payments could get me into something BIGGER!

The one thing that isn't bigger, is the United Kingdom. I've seen councils in London paint "parking lines" half on the pavement so that people can park up on either side to let cars past. I've seen people in these Discoveries and Defenders mount kerbs at drop off time without a thought or care for who might be behind them or even aware of this being an issue.

And you can have 1 household in a street of 20 houses own 5 cars. You do the maths as to how much of the available parking is then taken away.

Why are people so aggressive and discourteous in their car ownership? What are we going to do about this?

Some of us remember 20 or 30 years ago when you could drive to another street and not have to face a x5 barrelling towards you, parked cars either side? With a tiny woman peering over the steering wheel refusing to reverse back into the space immediately behind her? But powering through so that you, in your little hatchback, have to reverse 10 car lengths to accommodate her ego and lack of driving skill?

Our city and town streets are not made for X5s, Discoveries, Range Rover Sports, and god knows what else, to be parked along the kerbside blocking out the light into tiny terraced houses.

How do we put a stop to this? I love the Japanese principle in certain cities where you have to name a parking space you own or have access to before you buy a car. Could this work here?

AIBU? How will we ever wean ourselves off this 'bigger is better, and every member of my family must have a car' mentality?

OP posts:
crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 10:48

In my experience, the number of long journeys I have undertaken by train that have gone tits up (strikes, delays, cancellations) is about equal to the number of long journeys I have undertaken by car that have gone the same way (traffic jams, roadworks, breaking down). You pays your money and you takes your choice, I suppose.

The train from where I live in the far SW to my parents' near London takes about the same time as driving, and typically costs the same for a single person (train ticket vs diesel), however it's obviously cheaper for multiple people. One thing about train vs car is that if your journey does get delayed you get money back, but I've never been offered a refund for spending hours sitting in a traffic jam!!

CandidLurker · 05/06/2025 10:48

Vroomfondleswaistcoat · 05/06/2025 10:43

I would love to give up my car. I don't have much spare money and it seems to cost me more every month. But I'm three miles from work (walkabout just but I work a late shift and I wouldn't want to walk the three miles home over the fields in the dark or slightly further along the road) and we have no public transport. I'm the same three miles from the nearest bus stop. Annoyingly, I will become eligible for a bus pass in three years time, but if I have to drive to the bus stop I might as well drive the rest of the way...

Rural life is great and I love it and never want to move, but the absolute necessity of having a car is the one thing that spoils it for me. Even a couple of buses a day through my village would make it better.

I don’t even live rurally and the bus service in my town is rubbish. On a Sunday it’s virtually non existent. Unless you actually live within the bounds of one of the big cities, getting around without a car is just not feasible.

Helpmeplease2025 · 05/06/2025 11:04

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 10:39

It's unsafe not to. You should be stopping at least that often.

Also, you clearly are not travelling with children.

Why, clearly?

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 11:11

crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 10:48

In my experience, the number of long journeys I have undertaken by train that have gone tits up (strikes, delays, cancellations) is about equal to the number of long journeys I have undertaken by car that have gone the same way (traffic jams, roadworks, breaking down). You pays your money and you takes your choice, I suppose.

The train from where I live in the far SW to my parents' near London takes about the same time as driving, and typically costs the same for a single person (train ticket vs diesel), however it's obviously cheaper for multiple people. One thing about train vs car is that if your journey does get delayed you get money back, but I've never been offered a refund for spending hours sitting in a traffic jam!!

Yeah. If we actually invested in trains, though, they'd be faster for some journeys.

PinkSparklyPussyCat · 05/06/2025 11:18

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 10:39

It's unsafe not to. You should be stopping at least that often.

Also, you clearly are not travelling with children.

I just want to get where I'm going without faffing around stopping! The only time I might stop is if I need the loo and then I'm in and out as quickly as possible, not hanging around waiting for the car to charge.

And no, I'm thankfully not travelling with children. I can't think of anything worse!

Elbowpatch · 05/06/2025 11:33

PinkSparklyPussyCat · 05/06/2025 11:18

I just want to get where I'm going without faffing around stopping! The only time I might stop is if I need the loo and then I'm in and out as quickly as possible, not hanging around waiting for the car to charge.

And no, I'm thankfully not travelling with children. I can't think of anything worse!

We are the same. Stops are kept the absolute minimum. On long trips we might combine a loo or fuel stop with a change of drivers.

butterflies898 · 05/06/2025 11:53

When I was a teenager the buses to my village from the town where my school and part time job were (and most people’s jobs!) came every 30 minutes until 11pm. Now, they come every hour and stop at 5.30pm - before most people have finished their commute home! It’s not even a particularly rural area but it isn’t walkable and there is no way of getting to a supermarket, to work, to see friends, anything, if you don’t have a car. The infrastructure is getting worse and worse, not better.

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 11:55

@Elbowpatch
@butterflies898

Fatigue has a similar effect on the brain to alcohol (with regards to road safety). It increases the probability of accidents, and the fatality of accidents.

Regularly driving for stretches greater than two hours without proper rest breaks puts you and everyone else at risk.

Please do not drive without proper breaks. Driving tired is like driving drunk.

Elbowpatch · 05/06/2025 12:33

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 11:55

@Elbowpatch
@butterflies898

Fatigue has a similar effect on the brain to alcohol (with regards to road safety). It increases the probability of accidents, and the fatality of accidents.

Regularly driving for stretches greater than two hours without proper rest breaks puts you and everyone else at risk.

Please do not drive without proper breaks. Driving tired is like driving drunk.

Edited

I assume you missed the bit about changing drivers.

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 12:53

Elbowpatch · 05/06/2025 12:33

I assume you missed the bit about changing drivers.

You said "might". Anyway, you should really get out and have a good walk around to stay alert.

Anyway, having a good 15 to 20 minute break every 2 hours or so of driving has made a huge difference to travelling. I arrive far less knackered than I used to back when the only break was standing at a bowser or swapping drivers.

crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 13:22

LameBorzoi · 05/06/2025 11:11

Yeah. If we actually invested in trains, though, they'd be faster for some journeys.

True. I'm going Interrailing with the kids in Europe this summer. "How fast are the fast trains in Germany mum?" "300kph, same as everywhere else in Western Europe apart from the UK, son" 🙄. but then we're going to Romania and Bulgaria, where the trains go pretty much at walking pace

Elbowpatch · 05/06/2025 16:41

crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 13:22

True. I'm going Interrailing with the kids in Europe this summer. "How fast are the fast trains in Germany mum?" "300kph, same as everywhere else in Western Europe apart from the UK, son" 🙄. but then we're going to Romania and Bulgaria, where the trains go pretty much at walking pace

Speed isn’t everything. German railways have a terrible reputation.

Where it all went wrong for Germany’s railways

As Bremen Hauptbahnhof is named the worst station in Europe, here’s how Germany’s rail network fell from grace – and how it might be revived

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/destinations/europe/germany/germanys-railway-network-worst-station-europe/

FatherFrosty · 05/06/2025 17:05

crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 13:22

True. I'm going Interrailing with the kids in Europe this summer. "How fast are the fast trains in Germany mum?" "300kph, same as everywhere else in Western Europe apart from the UK, son" 🙄. but then we're going to Romania and Bulgaria, where the trains go pretty much at walking pace

I believe it’s to do with our built up little island meaning the trains can’t safely get up speed. Like hs2 only saving 20 mins on the current journey. When it was initially conceived it was going to save a lot more, and more so on the ongoing links.
obviously that’s all been lost partly due to the realities of uk geography and spiralling costs.

id love to use trains more, they are just so damn expensive and unreliable

Redpeach · 05/06/2025 17:30

FatherFrosty · 05/06/2025 17:05

I believe it’s to do with our built up little island meaning the trains can’t safely get up speed. Like hs2 only saving 20 mins on the current journey. When it was initially conceived it was going to save a lot more, and more so on the ongoing links.
obviously that’s all been lost partly due to the realities of uk geography and spiralling costs.

id love to use trains more, they are just so damn expensive and unreliable

Cars are expensive and traffic unreliable.

crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 17:38

FatherFrosty · 05/06/2025 17:05

I believe it’s to do with our built up little island meaning the trains can’t safely get up speed. Like hs2 only saving 20 mins on the current journey. When it was initially conceived it was going to save a lot more, and more so on the ongoing links.
obviously that’s all been lost partly due to the realities of uk geography and spiralling costs.

id love to use trains more, they are just so damn expensive and unreliable

Hmmmm....kind of. In that building a brand new high speed line across the SE (rather than upgrading existing lines) was always going to be expensive and problematic. But bear in mind that our only actual stretch of high speed line to date (that the Eurostars don't get up to full speed on anyway) runs from London to Kent, and that got upgraded OK!

I've also been on Eurostars and ICEs reaching top speeds in northern France, Belgium and the Netherlands, which are all densely populated areas.

I think upgrading the existing mainlines to the - far emptier- corners of the UK would be a better plan.

FatherFrosty · 05/06/2025 20:40

I think upgrading the existing mainlines to the - far emptier- corners of the UK would be a better plan.

i absolutely agree. Especially seeing the complete decimation of wildlife for hs2.

MintChocCat · 05/06/2025 21:02

I live in the South East. It’s a 45-50 min train ride into London but that can cost me anything between £27-£40 depending on the time of day (that’s for a return). Absolutely ludicrous, and for a totally shoddy service. Delays. Cramped. No guarantee of a seat. Ridiculously filthy. Lack of working and hygienic toilets.

I echo what everyone else has said on this thread. There must be more investment into public transport, especially trains. I wish parts of our country or the majority of the country COULD be like Copenhagen.

Alexandra2001 · 06/06/2025 07:17

crackofdoom · 05/06/2025 17:38

Hmmmm....kind of. In that building a brand new high speed line across the SE (rather than upgrading existing lines) was always going to be expensive and problematic. But bear in mind that our only actual stretch of high speed line to date (that the Eurostars don't get up to full speed on anyway) runs from London to Kent, and that got upgraded OK!

I've also been on Eurostars and ICEs reaching top speeds in northern France, Belgium and the Netherlands, which are all densely populated areas.

I think upgrading the existing mainlines to the - far emptier- corners of the UK would be a better plan.

Edited

I don't believe is has anything to do with the SE and density, other countries such as Holland can build rail at half the cost it is in the UK....

HS2 proves beyond doubt that the UK has lost the ability to build infrastructure, look at the Bat Tunnel.... £100m!! ignoring the loss of habitat all over the UK... & it's not just HS2, its across both private and public sectors.

Then the project was cancelled, at a cost of £28 billion... UK defence budget is £54billion...

The waste that has occurred with our taxes is beyond belief, done properly, we should have great public transport for what we spend.

Elbowpatch · 06/06/2025 08:30

I don't believe is has anything to do with the SE and density, other countries such as Holland can build rail at half the cost it is in the UK….

Holland is flat…

Badbadbunny · 06/06/2025 10:53

Elbowpatch · 06/06/2025 08:30

I don't believe is has anything to do with the SE and density, other countries such as Holland can build rail at half the cost it is in the UK….

Holland is flat…

It's not just that at all. The Victorians managed to build a World leading railway network a couple of hundred years ago that managed to go through hills and across valleys. Luckily, we had engineers who knew how to build bridges and create viaducts/embankments, etc.

Infrastructure problems in the UK are systemic and nothing to do with geography. We have far too much built in incompetence and fraud throughout all the stages involved.

Elbowpatch · 06/06/2025 15:25

Badbadbunny · 06/06/2025 10:53

It's not just that at all. The Victorians managed to build a World leading railway network a couple of hundred years ago that managed to go through hills and across valleys. Luckily, we had engineers who knew how to build bridges and create viaducts/embankments, etc.

Infrastructure problems in the UK are systemic and nothing to do with geography. We have far too much built in incompetence and fraud throughout all the stages involved.

It might not be just that, but it is mainly that. If you don’t have to build tunnels, cuttings, embankments, viaducts and bridges, the cost falls dramatically.

Luckily, we had engineers who knew how to build bridges and create viaducts/embankments, etc.

We still do.

GRex · 06/06/2025 18:11

Elbowpatch · 06/06/2025 15:25

It might not be just that, but it is mainly that. If you don’t have to build tunnels, cuttings, embankments, viaducts and bridges, the cost falls dramatically.

Luckily, we had engineers who knew how to build bridges and create viaducts/embankments, etc.

We still do.

Edited

This. Also there's also much higher cost of residential land that projects like HS2 need to include.

LameBorzoi · 06/06/2025 22:35

Elbowpatch · 06/06/2025 15:25

It might not be just that, but it is mainly that. If you don’t have to build tunnels, cuttings, embankments, viaducts and bridges, the cost falls dramatically.

Luckily, we had engineers who knew how to build bridges and create viaducts/embankments, etc.

We still do.

Edited

France managed to build a decent network.

Alexandra2001 · 07/06/2025 07:25

Elbowpatch · 06/06/2025 15:25

It might not be just that, but it is mainly that. If you don’t have to build tunnels, cuttings, embankments, viaducts and bridges, the cost falls dramatically.

Luckily, we had engineers who knew how to build bridges and create viaducts/embankments, etc.

We still do.

Edited

Have you been to Holland? huge issues with flooding... and what about all the other European countries that have built rail systems at a 1/3 of the cost that HS has cost the UK?
Yes we have expensive land costs but that doesn't explain the huge time delays we have in almost everything, the 8 miles of A30 recently built in Cornwall.. massively over budget, huge time delays and fuck ups in construction..... meaning further closures to put right these issues, they even laid the wrong tarmac, had to be dug up....

The UK just doesn't have the skills in civil engineering or planning anymore.

Badbadbunny · 07/06/2025 07:37

Alexandra2001 · 07/06/2025 07:25

Have you been to Holland? huge issues with flooding... and what about all the other European countries that have built rail systems at a 1/3 of the cost that HS has cost the UK?
Yes we have expensive land costs but that doesn't explain the huge time delays we have in almost everything, the 8 miles of A30 recently built in Cornwall.. massively over budget, huge time delays and fuck ups in construction..... meaning further closures to put right these issues, they even laid the wrong tarmac, had to be dug up....

The UK just doesn't have the skills in civil engineering or planning anymore.

Yup, we have a new by pass that’s only about 5 miles long but took several years to build, cost tens of millions over budget, and has a badly offset roundabout that causes regular crashes and has a special extra lane that’s never even been opened to traffic. Weird traffic light phasing at each end causing regular crashes. The whole thing was a monumental cock up. Still not properly finished years later!