Why does the UN and other organisations not do anything about women in Afghanistan?

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i just don’t understand, how can it be okay to stop someone from having an education, from speaking, from going out . Why is nobody doing anything, is it because it’s in the name of religion?

Unfortunately you don’t get to invade a country because you don’t like their politics.

you can have NGOs, engage in charity and offer education. You can use economic influence or have certain rules attached to trade treaties etc.

but you can war someone into a western democracy.

@Buffypaws The men in Afghanistan aren’t necessarily any happier than the women.

Absolutely. It's a very small number of thoroughly evil religious and political zealots who run the country. Yes, they're men - but most men are poor, disenfranchised and manipulated by the political system.

Oh look, OP hasn't come back.

I swear to god, every thread now is just a wind-up vehicle.

Heroin seems to be the main export.

More legal exports are fruits and nuts, but the problem is they export to places like Pakistan.

The USA and UK didn’t go in to create a democracy, they don’t care about Afghan women any more than the Taliban do.

And the UN is a waste of space in situations like this. All the UN workers are concerned about is their P grading and their salaries.

The rest are perfectly happy to subjugate their own mothers.

I don’t think that’s fair, there was a thread on here not long ago about WW3 / conscription and there were many mothers on here who were willing to do anything including breaking the law, going on the run and locking up their children if need be to STOP them going to war (sod the greater good). If you were an afghani mum, would you wave your son off to die (beheading is popular) in your name or would you fight tooth and nail against it?

You’ll probably say the son’s should fight anyway but there are cultural aspects to this:

1. Children are raised to have a lot more reverence and deference towards their parents even in adulthood. In practical terms this means they largely OBEY and do what their parents tell them; refer to the many threads on here of mixed cultural relationships where men are unable to stand up and go against their parents.
2. Sons are the providers; they house and financially support their parents and minor / unmarried siblings (again see many threads of mixed cultural marriages and sending money back home). If all the dads and sons go off to fight (and get killed or incapacitated) what becomes of the rest of the family? Who will financially provide given the current situation on women’s ability to work and lack of welfare state? It’s all very well going off to fight for your mother / daughter’s freedom meanwhile your mother / daughter may be starving and living on the streets as they have no money coming in and so you get a catch 22 situation.
3. The taliban routinely go after the loved ones of rebel fighters; raping, torturing and murdering entire families including babies to make an example of them and deter others. If you are a son / father, I’m sure you’d be concerned what would become of your mother / wife / sisters / daughters when death isn’t actually the worst case scenario; being held captive and enduring years of SA is.

Some men will absolutely be happy subjugating women but it’s not fair to say the rest of them are the same just because they don’t go out and fight; there are so many nuances and consequences that you’re not even considering and most people will just be doing their best to get by.

Nothing is Forever. Afghanistan will change over time at its own pace, just as we in the West have and continue to.

Outside agencies trying to force change will never work and usually results in a worse situation as people Push Back.

It may take hundreds of years as it did here - but it will change, because that's the natural order of things.

Thanks. That is interesting about the fruit and nuts.

I had forgotten about heroin. I read a article on how the most impact outside countries could have would be buying all the heroin produced and destroying it. It would stop it making its way into consumption and also destroy the power balance buy reducing the hold powerlords had over producers.

A wind up for what?

Why a wind up? It’s been an interesting debate.

That is a disgusting thing to say.

You’re talking of women who live under permanent house arrest or are only allowed out with a male guard.
Women who aren’t allowed to show their faces in public, or spend time with other women, or even sit near a window so they can see out.
Women who can be beaten, raped or killed with impunity.
Women who are forbidden education and, in many cases, life-saving health care.

That is not their choice.

Edited to add: I can well understand that women living in those cultures vote as they are told to and don’t speak up for fear of violent punishment.

When someone submits to tyranny, it is contemptible for free people to pretend the victim happily supports their own oppression.

Did you quote me by accident? I don't see the connection?

The UN and national governments don't "do" anything because there is nothing they can do that will solve the problem and be morally and politically acceptable.

The Taliban won't stop because they believe they are right. There is nothing another country or the UN can do that will change their mind on this. The only way to give women in Afghanistan the same rights western women have is a military invasion that results in the death of almost all Afghan men and many Afghan women. But mass slaughter, arguably genocide, is not something the UN (or US or UK or anyone else) is likely to think justified, and certainly the public in western countries won't. Many Afghan women wouldn't appreciate the killing of all their male relatives either. Sometimes the cure is worse than the disease.

I agree op and pressure should be brought to bear on them from all local countries as well

Because they use religion to persecute the women, all religious leaders should be clearly defining the koran and why it's wrong.

How would the world react if say a group called the boloban seized control in Afghanistan and forced all Afghanis including the Taliban behind doors purely due to being Afghani??

It's apartheid for women.

Locals vote for him, until local people want to change the behaviour of their councils, nothing changes.

Misogyny is what Norwich people want.

Google pictures of Afghanistan in 1960s people wearing modern for the tune clothes and seemingly doing normal things.

@beAsensible1

It's not necessarily warring someone into a western democracy but rather helping women who have been kidnapped and captured by the people who control afghanistan

What's the difference between one women ordered to stay in and not talk to anyone and be beaten and controlled to an entire country??

The thing is that in many instances it is true.

Because this is how they grow up.

Look at how many cultures subject their babies to FGM for instance. We don’t agree with it because it’s barbaric. But it is other women taking their babies to be mutilated.

Afghani culture is male dominated. We can sit here and say it’s all about control but it’s the culture that is about control.

This isn’t the only country where women have lesser rights, and in almost all of those cultures the women go along with it, even forcing their children into it.

The problem is that we want to westernise other cultures, and while I can see the sentiment the fact is that the women clearly don’t want this or they would be standing up against these regimes and they’re not.

And yes, if someone felt strongly enough about it they would be prepared to die in the name of the cause. But there are 0 women standing up against this.

Perhaps we just need to accept that this is Afghanistan and is never likely to change.

The rest of the world isn’t in a position to change it. Or are posters on here prepared to let their sons die for a change that many of the women probably don’t even want.

Do what exactly?

The UK has fought 3 wars with Afghanistan. The first (1839-42) was the greatest disaster in British military history. The second (1878-80) and third (1919) we just about managed to get out of but they were nowhere near victories.

Afghanistan is too difficult to conquer and virtually immune to any sort of blockade/sanctions.

What can we do?

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9xxklr0070o

On your second point: if the men go off to fight then it would be the women who have to fill the roles at home left vacant. Is this not how women got the vote in Britain? The men went off to fight and the women did their jobs and proved their worth.

I hear what you are saying, but two things - one is that the ultra extremism of gender apartheid that the Taliban impose is not Afghan "culture". Its an extreme political stance in what is already the highly patriarchal and woman-unfriendly culture of Afghanistan, to be sure, but even within that they are extremists.
The other thing is though we cannot impose our culture on theirs, there are some matters of principle that override that - and imprisoning 50% of the population and depriving them of education, health care, music, fresh air or anything else that makes life worthwhile is that principle. Women are half the world and cannot just be shut away and silenced, unable to work, go out, feed their families in many cases, or have medical attention. So although I don't know the answer, I feel we must do something for our sisters there. At the very least put political pressure on, eg. with those cricketers who saw fit to bolster the Afghan regime by playing with them, the international Cricket board, and politicians here to press for change, so the situation does not get forgotton. I wonder what the UN is doing, if anything.

The other thing is though we cannot impose our culture on theirs, there are some matters of principle

Are there ? They may be your principles. Are they those of the Afghan people ?

It's so easy when you're safe from being beheaded or stoned to death or gang raped daily for months on end, to say these women don't feel strongly enough, isn't it?

They'd not just be risking their own lives but also their children's lives. What wouldn't you put up with, to try to prevent your children being tortured, raped or murdered? Your parents and siblings too?If the state credibly threatened to torture your children, or let them starve to death while you were being tortured, you'd be 'standing up' , would you?

Your post reeks of your privilege.

@Nameychangington

"Your post reeks of your privilege."

Look the Western countries spent billions of dollars and thousands of lives to try and improve the lives of ordinary Afghans especially women and children. But this received little popular support from ordinary Afghans other than a desire to personally benefit from corruption and bribes.

Yes the plight of Afghan women is horrendous by Western standards but what exactly do you suggest to change this? A ban on a few Afghan cricket tours that are only watched by a handful of bored middle aged men?

"Your post reeks of your naivety "