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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To kick DP's brother out

111 replies

Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 18:00

Apologies in advance as this will be a long one — but need to properly explain the details to get some much-needed advice! I am not a mum yet but love mumsnet and can't think of anywhere better to get some impartial advice — totally ready to hear that I am BU.

So here is what happened: DP and I (both in our 20's) have lived for 3 years in a 3-bedroom house in a very sought-after area. We each have our own bedroom in the upstairs floor as I usually need to study and work well into the night and need my own space (I also often have family and friends overnight). On a different floor there is a completely independent room with a large terrace and an en-suite bathroom. Throughout the years we have always lived with friends renting that room and have always had a very fun, lively envoirement as we are not couple-y at all and enjoy sharing the flat. Recently, there were some huge probelems with the flat (ceilings etc) which meant a renovation was needed and our dear friend had to move out. Me and DP came to an agreement with our landlord and have carried out these renovations in exchange for a reduced rent. This means the contract is now under our name with a clause which allows subletting and we also have a very very good rent for a 3 bed flat in our area. Whilst we can afford the new rent just us two, we always thought of getting someone else to rent the downstairs room but were in no rush and were hoping a friend would move in a few months.

A few months ago, DP's brother got a job in our city and asked DP if he could move in. We were very happy and immediately said yes. Because he is family, we also agreed on a very low rent, so we shared with him our discount (which we got only through investing thousands in the flat) and gave up the really nice room and terrace as well as one of the bathrooms (the largest one in the flat). This was no issue at all and we were so happy to have him! We got on really well and had some great times. Fast forward around a month and he meets a girl, let's call her B. After going on a couple of dates it gets more serious and she comes over to spend the weekend as she lives in a different part of the country: she is lovely and we all get along. Obviously, she can stay over as much as she wants. One week after this, she gets a temporary job in town and asks if she can stay. DP's brother 'asks' by saying 'B will be staying for a couple of weeks, could be a month because of a job, I'm assuming that's okay?'. For us it was no problem at all since it was temporary. She moved in and started the job which lasted 5 weeks. After the 1st week they started officially dating and by the end of it, it became very clear that she had no intention of leaving and that she was looking for a permanent job in town. They never asked us if she could stay, but did say they would like to talk about rent. She said she didn't want to have the obligation to pay rent until she found a job. We should have seen the red flags (there were others, like requesting we don't use the living room one day so they could have a romantic breakfast) but we didn't and agreed she could pay no rent for another month and then start paying a very small amount (mostly bills) from the third month onwards until she found a job. The catch is she never found one (or really looked for one at all!). She wanted a job in a very hard to get into creative industry, but she has no experience and a degree from years ago (DP works in this industry) and she wouldn't take anything else. I offered to give her my babysitting contacs or put a word in for her in a café and she refused. She said she didn't want to take any part-time work until she found her dream job (keep in mind she has never worked in this industry after university and was working in a cafe before she moved in with us).

DP got fed up with everything and had a chat with his brother asking what she is doing and basically ended up blurting out that she was taking advantage of everyone. This is not how I would have gone about it and it was absolutely the wrong way to approach the subject but, in fairness, it was a brother to brother sort of comment. DP's brother immediately told B, who locked herself in her room and didn't come out for the rest of the day and night. I had a chat with DP and we called a flat meeting the next day in which DP profusely apologised to B, explained himself and all around made amends. We all agreed to move on, accept apologies and get along.

The problem is that ever since this happened they have been ignoring us, eat every meal in their room, come out of the room only when we are out... This is especially B as when she is away we all have dinner and have lovely times. This has made me so incredibly anxious in my own home and I feel a sense of dread everytime I go down the stairs to the common floor. I attempted a conversation and all she asked me was for details of when we will be away. They have also gone for a holiday and left their terrace door open (street facing) as well as kitchen knives outside which was so dangerous as we only caught it a couple days later and have left the kitchen very messy when we were away (we are both very clean and tidy but happy to compromise within reason, we never negged them and do most of the cleaning, we just ask that they clean up after themselves). I don't know what to do but we just want to kick them (or her) out! Especially as we never agreed to live with B! We just feel so unwelcome in our own home and this has really taken a toll on my wellbeing especially as I am studying for very important exams and finishing my dissertation alongside working. What should we do? Would really appreciate some advice as we ultimately don't want to cause any issues in the family.

OP posts:
ZekeZeke · 24/05/2025 18:06

Your DP needs to give his brother notice to leave (assuming the brother has no written contract).
This isn't working for us is enough to say.

GreenCandleWax · 24/05/2025 18:12

This your home that they are misusing, causing you to feel not at home in your own space. They (or at least she) have to go. Treating you like this in your homeis unacceptable. Can you talk to her on your own and explain this?

Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 18:14

ZekeZeke · 24/05/2025 18:06

Your DP needs to give his brother notice to leave (assuming the brother has no written contract).
This isn't working for us is enough to say.

How much notice would you think it is reasonable for us to give? Before he moved in we were hoping to sub-let the whole flat for the summer and go travelling as we can both work from anywhere. We had long given up this idea but if they were to move out in the next 2/3 weeks we could still do it. But I appreciate that might be far too little notice! I just feel at a breaking point and that any extra day with them both is hell for everyone! DP's brother could easily move back home as it is commutable into the city, but we are afraid she would throw a fit and say she has nowhere to go (especially as she thinks she might have a job interview in the coming days). I don't want to act like a landlord or be unreasonable but would also love to go travelling as originally planned!

OP posts:
ZekeZeke · 24/05/2025 18:20

I think one monthe notice would be very generous

Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 18:20

GreenCandleWax · 24/05/2025 18:12

This your home that they are misusing, causing you to feel not at home in your own space. They (or at least she) have to go. Treating you like this in your homeis unacceptable. Can you talk to her on your own and explain this?

I have the feeling she can be quite manipulative (the world is always against her) so am a bit afraid she would deny anything is wrong and promise to be less antisoacial but ultimately I do feel like we are at a point of no return and like she has no interest whatsoever in being friendly and is only using the space for cheap, almost free, rent. Should I approach her alone? Give her notice or just try to understand what is going on better?? Would have for her to run to DP's brother and make me seem like the villain!

OP posts:
Daleksatemyshed · 24/05/2025 18:23

You and your DP sound like lovely, giving sort of people Op but there's one thing you didn't understand - the CFs of this world don't see it as lovely, they see it as you're an easy target- letting your DPs Brother pay as little as possible was your first mistake, letting him move his GF in by stealth was the next. They know they won't get this cheap living anywhere else so they'll make it hard to get them out you have to harden your heart and tell them they're leaving. They have no lease, no contract so you can make them leave asap.
I know you don't want a problem with the family but you can only avoid that if you let them stay, it's gone on too long and they need to go. That's your home, they don't get to live off you

Didshejustsaythatoutloud · 24/05/2025 18:27

You need to get this freeloader gone.
You sound really lovely and she has taken full advantage of this.
Give HER at most a month's notice then bye
Good luck

TwentyKittens · 24/05/2025 18:29

I'd be tempted to change the locks, bag up their stuff and tell them they can arrange pick up.

But I can see how this might not be the best solution for you!!!

Give them both one month's notice and arrange to change the locks on the day they are supposed to leave.

SunshineAndFizz · 24/05/2025 18:31

It’s time they both found their own place. Now.

S0j0urn4r · 24/05/2025 18:32

1 month's notice. You don't have to give a reason. Do not extend it.
Or, if they're away now just pack up their stuff and change the locks.

SunshineAndFizz · 24/05/2025 18:32

A brother to brother chat is best - explaining it’s been nice having them here but it was never meant to be a permanent solution and it’s time they found their own space and you’d also like the space to yourselves.

Octoberdreaming · 24/05/2025 18:33

You do not owe this CF little madam absolutely anything - you are being beyond generous contemplating giving either of them any notice at all after the way they (mainly she) have behaved.

I would speak to her on her own asap and firmly tell her that she needs to get packing tonight and be gone tomorrow and to be sure that no amount of melodrama that she turns on will work this time.
If she has nowhere to go - not your circus, not your monkeys. Brother can pay for a hotel for her I’m sure.

The brother - I would maybe offer a week’s notice or 2 weeks maximum, but it would be a gesture of goodwill for a family member.
If they won’t go - it’s time to start thinking about lock changes.
They sound a bit unhinged anyway - moving in together after a couple of dates. Bizarre.

GreenCandleWax · 24/05/2025 18:35

After the 4 way meeting you had at which your DP generously apologised to B, it was agreed to make amends and move forward with everyone getting on. But they have done the opposite, eating in their room, being monosyllabic with you, asking when you will be going out - of your own home! They have not kept to the agreement, so now insist on another meeting with all of you and tell them they have to go now, as you cannot have this in your home. Two weeks notice in the circumstances is more than generous especially as they don't pay their way.
Get them gone, change the locks, and go off your travels - you deserve it.🌸

Namechangermagic · 24/05/2025 18:36

Why don’t you sublet the flat to DP’s brother while you’re travelling for an increased rent and then tell them the date you’re returning and that they’re to remove themselves by that date?
I suppose you maybe don’t trust them because of leaving the terrace door open? But it seems the most win win solution?

She does sound like an absolute knob though, I wouldn’t like to be in your situation

GreenCandleWax · 24/05/2025 18:36

TwentyKittens · 24/05/2025 18:29

I'd be tempted to change the locks, bag up their stuff and tell them they can arrange pick up.

But I can see how this might not be the best solution for you!!!

Give them both one month's notice and arrange to change the locks on the day they are supposed to leave.

A month is too long for OP and her DP to live like this. There is no tenancy or formal agreement, so they should asap.

arcticpandas · 24/05/2025 18:41

Give the CF one week to move back with her parents. She doesn't have a job so doesn't need to stay in the city. You are very nice people and unfortunately some people will take advantage...

CalicoPusscat · 24/05/2025 18:42

B doesn't sound very nice.

I assume the brother has the money for a deposit and first month's rent. Brother might hold it against you if B goes.

They're both showing a lack of understanding that the tenancy is in your name and B can't dictate your plans.

Meadowfinch · 24/05/2025 18:48

TwentyKittens · 24/05/2025 18:29

I'd be tempted to change the locks, bag up their stuff and tell them they can arrange pick up.

But I can see how this might not be the best solution for you!!!

Give them both one month's notice and arrange to change the locks on the day they are supposed to leave.

This.

Nanny0gg · 24/05/2025 18:48

Namechangermagic · 24/05/2025 18:36

Why don’t you sublet the flat to DP’s brother while you’re travelling for an increased rent and then tell them the date you’re returning and that they’re to remove themselves by that date?
I suppose you maybe don’t trust them because of leaving the terrace door open? But it seems the most win win solution?

She does sound like an absolute knob though, I wouldn’t like to be in your situation

They'll come back to the flat trashed/rearranged and the locks changed!

Nor would they pay the correct rent

Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 18:50

Thank you so much for the advice everyone! I find it very helpful to know I am not being overly precious!

We most definitely will do something about it soon. There is an extra complication which is that they went to meet DP's parents last week and parents have ringed us the day after saying they are very concerned as DP's brother is clearly being taken advantage of and they did not like her at all (he is also in his very early 20's just out of uni whislt she is in her mid 20's — not that this is an issue in itself but they are worried she is in some way manipulating DP's brother). They have asked us to not encourage them to move together and are very worried that they do (+ have also stated that they will not help them with any deposit money or being guarantors etc). Considering this, there is absolutely 0 chance they could get a place for themselves with a deposit and first month rent unless they both moved back home and saved (like the rest of us). I know it is not our business but we are also worried about DP's brother as when she was away on holiday we had really lovely times and no issues whatsoever, we believe he is just immature and a bit careless but not a mean bone in his body. Is there any way to handle this so as to not antagonize him? Could a white lie about max occupancy be appropriate or should we be absolutely honest?

OP posts:
Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 18:55

Namechangermagic · 24/05/2025 18:36

Why don’t you sublet the flat to DP’s brother while you’re travelling for an increased rent and then tell them the date you’re returning and that they’re to remove themselves by that date?
I suppose you maybe don’t trust them because of leaving the terrace door open? But it seems the most win win solution?

She does sound like an absolute knob though, I wouldn’t like to be in your situation

They could never afford the full rent of the flat as only DP's brother works and it is a first job (which is why we were keen to help at first, it is tough out there and I would have loved to have an older sibling who could have helped me out when I was starting). We would also feel uneasy leaving them alone for that long which is why we gave up on the plans early on!

OP posts:
CalicoPusscat · 24/05/2025 19:00

I'm shit at things like this so don't know if you should make something up about tenancy or put your foot down. All I know is that B needs to go.

There is still September if you want to travel after you've sorted this out.

Doesn't brother NOTICE how she is with you @Penelope55?

Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 19:03

Octoberdreaming · 24/05/2025 18:33

You do not owe this CF little madam absolutely anything - you are being beyond generous contemplating giving either of them any notice at all after the way they (mainly she) have behaved.

I would speak to her on her own asap and firmly tell her that she needs to get packing tonight and be gone tomorrow and to be sure that no amount of melodrama that she turns on will work this time.
If she has nowhere to go - not your circus, not your monkeys. Brother can pay for a hotel for her I’m sure.

The brother - I would maybe offer a week’s notice or 2 weeks maximum, but it would be a gesture of goodwill for a family member.
If they won’t go - it’s time to start thinking about lock changes.
They sound a bit unhinged anyway - moving in together after a couple of dates. Bizarre.

They sound a bit unhinged anyway - moving in together after a couple of dates. Bizarre.

Yes — this is why we are so worried! At first it looked like it was going to be only 2-3 weeks and her termporary job was right in our area so kind of made some sense as we are all young but when it became permanent there was never a conversation with us and we get the impression it just kind of happened to DP's brother too (he obviously is more than willing but possibly young and lost?)

OP posts:
Penelope55 · 24/05/2025 19:08

CalicoPusscat · 24/05/2025 19:00

I'm shit at things like this so don't know if you should make something up about tenancy or put your foot down. All I know is that B needs to go.

There is still September if you want to travel after you've sorted this out.

Doesn't brother NOTICE how she is with you @Penelope55?

Edited

I am sure he does and they do it together (eating EVERY meal in their room etc) but I think she just says she feels unwelcome, like a failure etc and cries about it all the time (purely speculative impression). The whole reason we were so lenient at the starts is that she has sick family and seemed like she really needed a break so I wonder if he feels responsible in some way (I know I almost do!) I have accidentaly overheard her say DP put a lot of pressure on her to get a job and she feels horrible that he said she was taking advange — this was now months ago and as I said DP profusely apologised at the time and we all agreed to move on. I feel as though she is punishing us — crossed her once and she will NOT forget!

OP posts:
CalicoPusscat · 24/05/2025 19:08

@Octoberdreaming I like your approach 😆

Like ripping off a plaster. The brother can't be the only person she knows if it's recent.