Was I wrong to refuse sale at work urgent advice needed

[LemonBlueberryX]

So this morning at work (I work in retail - but not a supermarket, think along the lines of b&m), someone came in and tried to buy an item. I was working on the till. When they came to the till I felt frozen on what to do as I didn’t feel comfortable selling this item in these circumstances (based on a stereotype of what this person looked like). I asked for ID (it’s a look25 item) hoping they wouldn’t have it so I could refuse sale but they did. After that I felt I had to make a choice and so I refused sale. Because of things that have happened in my area recently I felt that by allowing this sale I would be personally contributing to bad things.

They kicked off and asked for the manager who came over and asked me why I refused the sale and I just froze and couldn’t answer. Manager took over the till and served the person. The rest of my shift went on as normal but Managers just whatsapped me an hour ago asking me to come in at 10 tomorrow for a chat. I don’t work saturdays so not usually in. What do I say?

I dont really want this getting back to my manager so have tried to be vague about said item

You did the right thing OP, well done. Like many in this thread I have worked in retail and I absolutely used my discretion to refuse sales of tinfoil/eggs on Halloween or whatever. It's not easy when they kick off and you must have felt intimidated. Your manager shouldn't have undermined you, they should know your word is final if they've completed their personal licence training. Tell them you thought the ID was fake. Good luck with your meeting.

And of course you should discriminate by age when selling an age restricted product, it goes without saying!

Age & sex are also protected characteristics. If she's refused based on the fact the customer is young (but has proved he is old enough) & male but allows the same sale to a middle aged female then that is discrimination.

The shop either needs to remove certain items from sale entirely or change their policy - eg no sale of single knives.

Did anyone actually say this? If that's what you think people fear you're the naive one. It's not going to be on the telly, stabbings (officially recorded and not) are so common they are non issues in many areas, which I assume is what OP is worried about, rightly or wrongly.

I'm with you on this. I think you tried to do exactly the right thing. If you thought the ID was fake, then tell this to your manager. The fact that he went on a served him is on him.

Did the OP genuinely believe the ID was fake? Was the lad actually aggressive, before the sale was halted?

I think it's rather dangerous to suggest embellishing things frankly, for all parties sakes.

If the OP is confident that they acted within laws / guidelines etc then that's all that's necessary.

Law enforcement used to "fit people up" because their "gut instincts" gave them tunnel vision. Innocent people have rotted in prison for years due to this. It probably still goes on, but we don't just shrug because it might have been "right".

Try being falsely accused of something and seeing the snowball of "groupthink" gather momentum. It ain't pretty, it ruins lives, makes a mockery of justice and mud sticks.

I've worked in retail and pharmacy for many years, and have absolutely refused sales before for gut feelings like this, and been backed up by my manager. They can try and purchase it from somewhere else and it can be on someone else's conscience.

Always one has to bring race into everything. There are many possibilities: Not wanting to sell alcohol to someone you think may be alcholic...

@LemonBlueberryX
It was an 18 yo boy buying a single kitchen knife. I can't say I thought the ID was fake as my manager then went on to serve them so would ask why I didn't say anything at the time. It may be discrimination but morally I don't feel comfortable selling a knife to someone who may be involved in knife crime.

Completely agree. The cry of discrimination is designed to trump all reason, common sense and moral responsiblity. If a guy comes into the shop smelling of weed and buys a knife, you're judgement is well founded irrespective of what the shop's policy is.

I haven't read all the replies, but it could just have been a university freshman having to buy his own knife for the first time.

But that’s exactly my point! And it certainly doesn’t make me naive.

More than one poster has trotted out this mawkish “How would OP have felt if she’d seen on the news the next day that he’d murdered someone with the knife SHE sold him?!” I made the very valid point that, even if an assailant is caught that quickly, the first thing they say to the police is very rarely “I bought the knife from the Discount Kitchen Emporium on Whiteley Street and was served by Sharon on till 7”.

If it was your own shop, you can refuse sales to whoever you like.

But it's not is it? The shop you work for was happy to sell this guy a knife. Maybe he's involved in knife crime, but maybe he needs it for a legitimate reason, like cutting up food in his kitchen? I know it's a shock to MN but some 18 year olds have left home and can cook their own food.

I'd come up with an excuse for your actions pretty quick, as you may be disciplined tomorrow. And in future maybe just do the job your paid to do?

Did the OP genuinely believe the ID was fake? Was the lad actually aggressive, before the sale was halted?
I think it's rather dangerous to suggest embellishing things frankly, for all parties sakes.

Exactly. It’s all been done on “a feeling” - and “Mumsnet says we should trust our spidey senses” won’t wash.

OP has a personal responsibility for age restricted sales and is at risk of a fine or prosecution if she sells an age restricted product to an underage person.

She saw ID though. There was no risk on the age front.

I disagree with PPs. I wouldn't come up with an excuse. I'd tell the truth - it raised your suspicions and you didn't feel comfortable, they can do what they like with that.

I wouldn't have been comfortable either - I have an 18 year old and it would be bloody weird for him to go and buy a single kitchen knife, or any kitchen knives.

@MistressoftheDarkSide I see your point, however the training I provided to colleagues in a business operating a challenge 25 policy asked us to take a holistic approach in our assessment of whether a customer is underage. He doesn't need to kick off - if he is furtive, doesn't make eye contact, doesn't say hello, appears to be under the influence, is buying a single age restricted item and not, for instance, a 175ml bottle of wine with a weekly shop - these should all be taken into account. This isn't my editorial as a trainer - this is all in black and white in the training documents. It is the OP who is at risk of a fine or imprisonment of she makes the wrong call.

No wonder people like self checkouts!

Would still need approval for a knife.

That purchase would have been flagged and a member of staff would come to verify the sale.

True, but you don't need it for tinfoil or eggs, or whatever else the cashier has decided they aren't selling you because of reasons.

Someone going off to University would be unlikely to be buying a knife in May. I'd expect that in August/September time.
A budding chef isn't going to buy some crappy B&M/equivalent knife.

Also, the stretched nature of staff on self-checkouts means they mostly get on with it I find- if you show ID they flash the little card and on to the next customer.

So if you're young and haven't got much money you can only buy a knife in September?

Sounds sensible. Thank God most retail staff I've met aren't on this kind of power trip.

Retailers and staff have a responsibility to protect the health and wellbeing of young people. The OP obviously found the encounter uncomfortable - are you telling me in good faith you believe she did it on a power trip?