To not want to take feral 16 month old to toddler group?

[ToddlerMum1222]

My 16 month old little boy is quite a handful at times and has started having tantrums if he wants to do something and is told no.

I try really hard to take him to different places but wherever we go he never wants to actually do what he’s supposed to do there. For example at the messy play class all he wanted to do was play with the bubble machine, or sit in the water tray and had a tantrum when he couldn’t. At a toddler group he found the one place he wasn’t supposed to go and kept running there, then all he wanted to do was climb up the slide and kept having tantrums when I took him off. I get so flustered and think other parents are judging me. He eats amazingly well at home but when I gave him a banana at toddler group he mushed it everywhere, all over himself and my trousers and I was chasing him round with a wet wipe. I honestly wanted to cry as all the other children were playing nicely.

Does this sound normal? Part of me thinks he might have ASD because he’s behind in his communication skills and not talking yet. My husband thinks I should carry on taking him to all these different groups but I just want to stop and wait until he’s abit older?

Also I don't think any of this indicates autism.

My son is autistic though and would have done all of this but I know plenty of neurotypical kids who were also just wildcards, and picked up communication later rather than earlier.

I think they're good examples to keep hold of for later on if you still suspect autism and want to look at a diagnosis but I don't think you necessarily need to worry.

My cousins kid only started talking at 3 and a half, she's not autistic, she's just fiercely independent and strong willed.

Mine was exactly the same and he’s now at primary school and doing brilliantly - he also has no neurodiversity or learning needs. At your stage I too was worrying “what’s wrong with him” as everyone else’s kid seemed able to play nicely and I felt the judgement. The reality was that he is an explorer and always has been. It’s a sign of intelligence! He’s his own person and wants to do what he wants to do!

Some other mums will never get it - sorry to gender it but so often they had girls sitting playing or drawing quietly while my boy ran out of the fire exit or whatever. They will never understand. I now surround myself with mum friends of energetic boys, and they get it!

I moved away from those stay and play sessions as they didn’t work for us, and instead I used to take him to places where he could run free - the park, soft play, museums with kids sections etc, and swimming which he loved - and still does. He was “feral” as you put it until aged 4 and then he started learning what’s appropriate- but he was still a pure adventurer, explorer and an energy bunny! At school he settled in really well and loved the variety of activities.

I think your boy just can’t wait to try everything, that’s all!

Avoid situations where you feel judged and seek out places where he can be free and you can feel relaxed.

One of mine was like this (not ADHD as it turns out, although I did wonder at the time!) and I think it's about choosing which groups to go to. Mine was a nightmare at soft play, but we found a music class that he loved and he behaved better there.

We got asked to leave the library rhyme time!

Stay & play was much better for DS at that stage, he calmed down a lot after about 2.5

It’s an exhausting age - don’t give up, the work establishing rules now will pay off later. Go for less time if it’s a nightmare. I don’t miss it, over 3 it got so much better

I would still go to all these places - but I would try to change your mindset about them. Stop seeing your son as a problem, the only ‘naughty’ one etc .. try to see him as inquisitive, imaginative, looking for something different to do. Forget what you think others are thinking about you - they’re probably not! Children are all different and do things in different ways and at different times - try to embrace who he is. You then might start to feel less stressed and pressured, this in turn could have a positive impact on his behaviour.

I agree 100% with this - it seems quite common that a toddler's brain will focus on walk or talk, so they're either practising their running, climbing, mayhem, etc or their communication is better than their gross motor skills and they're focused on that.

I never judged a parent at the mums and tots groups I went to, unless their child was running riot and they were sitting talking, drinking coffee and not keeping an eye on the kid at all. You could see some mums/grandmothers were being run ragged, constantly having to jump up and sort the dc out, if your child was more docile you felt sorry for them rather than judging.

I think you should keep going to activities but like PPs suggest, find ones that are more in tune with your child's current energy levels and less focus on sitting in a circle singing Wind The Bobbin Up. You could suggest going to the park afterwards (if there's one helpfully near) to any other friendly parents there.

Something we learnt with our 2 older autistic children is that no, especially alone, is generally the least effective word and a trigger to meltdowns.
If they're fixated on something then no sends them into a stressed state that they can't do it, whereas distraction, suggestions eg "can you walk up the steps, look there's big steps, then you can go down the slide" instead of "no you can't climb the slide" is more likely to work.

It's the same now they're older, if they ask to do something and it's a no then phrasing it as "you can have/do _ instead" works better than just "no".
I think often because they're not very good at transitioning to a new activity, so if they're focused on something having the suggestion of what to do instead helps them accept that it's not happening more than just being told no and having to process things not happening as they were expecting at the same time as trying to think of an alternative.

Just take him to the park/outside and let him roam around

If you aren't enjoying it then don't go. My eldest the only thing I took her to was rhyme time at the local library. The youngest I took to a toddler group once and didn't enjoy it so didn't go back. It's not compulsory.

Just a big hug for you! Op I could have written this 13 years ago because that was my son. Wild and uncontrollable. Hated taking him anywhere. Didn’t start talking to over 2 years of age. I went to formal child care setting at 2 and that was the making of him. He is a fine teenager now!
My advice is do not take him to these things if it stresses you out. You get stressed and then they sense it. I hated all those things with a bloody passion. I am not saying keep the child locked up but don’t attend things for the sake if it at that age. You are only annoying yourself xx

😂 , sorry I'm laughing because this was my youngest 20 something yrs ago.
They are mortifying, aren't they?
Perfectly normal wee boy though.
Big deep breath mum
Good luck

My daughter was the same. Other mums would sit there looking perfect while I was a sweaty mess trying to stop my DD climbing the walls or running away. We went to lots of those groups and I hated it. Went to an incredibly expensive forest school group and she did the same, ran away from the activities to do her own thing. Climbing a tree or rolling in the mud.

She’s a perfectly well behaved teenager now. I did have my doubts when she was a feral toddler.

My 19 month old just wants to wander and climb etc. We go to a Hartbeeps class once a week and I have just accepted that he might wander off to play with the door handle or look out the window or play with some of the toys to the side of the room and the person running the class is happy for him to do so.

I have however not gone to rhyme time at the library since he could walk as I think he would just wander out and it would be hard to keep him contained as it’s not in a closed off room.

Hang in there you are doing well.

I think this is probably for all little children, whether autistic or not - just 'no' on its own doesn't really tell them what behaviour you do want or allow. DS2 can get on board with 'don't bang that on the window, why don't you bang this chair instead?' and then lots of happy praise when he bangs the soft, non-breakable thing.

That's exactly what we do too 😊 sorry I'm so used to referring to how we have to phrase things in order to counter his PDA as "saying no" so that others can understand the nuance of what we're saying, I just naturally don't go into detail about how we actually get around saying the word no! It's encouraging to see we're doing the right thing though! We're now so used to avoiding declarative language and giving plenty of warning and transitions aids between tasks that I don't even know of another way!

We used to have a toddler gym class, was great for toddlers with lots of energy, lots of nice thick mats so very safe. Not sure they still do it here, which is a shame. It was a paid for activity. A quick google shows there are places that do it.

Have you tried any outside activities? My son was not into any of the singing / playing / inside / artsy stuff but thrived in anything outdoors.

My DD never really liked being around other children. I didn't either.
I stopped thinking I needed to take her to these types of things and we were both much happier.
She's learnt social skills nonetheless.
She's also autistic.

I think I must have been very lucky with groups much less structured and much more supportive other parents than you seem to have found OP.

If it's stressing you out - try parks or other places to go to then re-try when he's a bit older.

Distraction - instead of outright no might help - do this instead - though it may not depends on the situation.

"My husband thinks I should carry on taking him to all these different groups"

When was the last time your husband took him to the playground on his own? Or to the supermarket, or to great-Granny's house (the one with all the china ornaments)?

It's totally normal but also understandably stressful. He will learn as he goes. Honestly we didn't go to many structured activities, they're not really necessary imo. Going to the park first thing in the morning when it was empty and letting her run up the slide as much as she wanted was good!

Honestly, I would try to let go of the stress and embarrassment and continue to take him. Not at all saying it is not challenging, but a toddler group is a safe space for toddler-like behaviours, which is what these are. I suspect that there is not nearly as much judgment as you think (I'm sure everyone is more worried about their own kids' behaviour) and even if there is, you have to do the best for your son, not for the random judgy person you come across. Good luck.

I also would gently encourage you not to think of your child as 'feral'. I guess you are joking but the language you use about someone matters and can impact how you treat someone, and I think you would be upset if he (one day) refers to you in a disrespectful manner.

Also - why isn't he allowed to play with the bubble machine/climb on the slide etc? These sound like ok things to do?