Junior Doctors Unemployment in August

[PurpleFairyLights]

Name changed but long term poster. Have a child that is in this situation with 100k of student debt.

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2025-05-07/bma-we-could-potentially-see-thousands-of-unemployed-doctors

Unbelievable this was allowed. Most countries protect their medical graduates.

You lost me at the mummies comment tbh, unnecessarily condescending to presumably a fellow female

Unfortunately Wannabe is back. Who comes on a thread talking unpleasantly about other people's children and making derogatory remarks about women?

I noticed there was someone similar on @Needsmoresleep's thread.

Also only experience is married to a doctor.

Exactly. Shows the level of ignorance about the situation.

@PurpleFairyLights some people are just odd 🤷‍♀️. I’m actually v v proud to be a mummy of a doctor.

@wannabewitch what makes you think that IMGs are superior? I’m interested in how you formed that opinion? Is it based on experience or perception?

In my experience some are excellent but some are awful.

Id be interested in how many young UK doctors leave the profession. Last time I looked, admittedly a decade ago, it was one third. Those are the people who have self selected out, for a variety of reasons.

@PurpleFairyLights why cant the IMG's get jobs in their own countries??

Absolutely me too. @wannabewitch on this thread is odd as she said her children are not doctors but husband is a doctor.

@allthemiddlechildrenoftheworld they can. But the NHS offers better training opportunities and also means they can apply to work in many other countries which like NHS trained staff. Some (weirdly) prefer the UK as a place to live, but this means we are depriving the poorer countries of their own medical staff.
Unfortunately many get here not realising the shit show that is the NHS and find it v v hard, some do not speak English too well and some are wonderful. But many of them agree that it’s madness that they can get a job and a UK trained grad can’t.

@PurpleFairyLights don’t think she likes her husband v much 😂. Or maybe he’s one of those consultants who thinks screaming in the face of an F1 at 1.30am is acceptable behaviour.

@mumsneedwine I did think her description of the NHS made it sound like doctors were at war with each other and having to fight for your patients very dramatic. Possibly due to what is being fed back to her.

This thread has become completely insane. For the record I am not @wannabewitch she must be someone else who disagrees with you. Why do you invent scenarios such as 'she doesn't like her husband very much'? Based on what?
I stopped commenting when various other insults started flying around.
Oh, and my husband has never screamed at anyone. If he met any of you be might well be tempted.

It is also absolutely true that my husband is a doctor, a successful one, and my children absolutely are not. I don't know any doctors whose children have gone into medicine. And before you start that's not because they couldn't do it but because they wouldn't choose to. They had far better options.

Love the stealth boast. My DC actually WANTED TO BE A DOCTOR.

@oddandelsewhere maybe educate yourself by talking to young doctors as you are v out of touch. Which is sad. I assume your husband had F2s, tell him to ask their onion and job opportunities. I assumed the derogatory remarks about doctors from the other poster meant they didn’t like doctors. Weird if you are married to one.

Most doctors I know have at least one child that has followed them. It’s sad yours didn’t feel it was worth doing - I wonder what they have seen ! Most doctors love their job, they just want a job to keep doing it.

I never understand why players come on these threads and think they are right. You can disagree with opinion, but not facts. The facts are 33,000 applicants for 13,000 jobs, 70% coming from abroad, is madness.

My DD loves being a doctor. Would hate to do anything else.

Onion 😂 opinion

I am not sure but think there may be a bit of confusion. The person with the doctor husband is oddandelsewhere whereas wannabewitch is another poster who appears to be against the prioritisation of UK doctors. Of course, we can't be sure. I recognise the language & style from previous threads when we have discussed RLMT or a similar legal safeguard being introduced as a possible way of prioritising UK doctors.

@mumsneedwine I have seen this a few times. Wives of doctors having an elevated opinion.

One woman I know is married to a professor and thought the doctors at the dinner would be deferring to her because she was married to their boss.

@PurpleFairyLights it’s so weird. I have no clue what goes on in my husbands job/company. Being a consultant’s wife means your husband has no student debt, had free accommodation for his F1 and has a nice secure job (unless redundancies start hitting soon). It’s so sad that senior doctors (& their wives) have no idea what it’s like to be a young doctor these days. Or that they don’t seem to care.

Many doctors are going to be unemployed. Fact. Not because they are not fantastic doctors, but because they have been busy working rather than running extra audits and QIPs.

Ireland? 2024;
Almost half of graduates from Irish medical schools fail to get place on GP training course.

This year, 349 graduates from Irish medical schools applied for 350 GP training places but 161 of them were not accepted...

Breaking it down by citizenship, the 1,311 applicants included 408 Irish citizens, 68 citizens of the UK and EU countries, and 835 from non-EU countries.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41419162.html

The “mummies” thing is a barely veiled insult implying that us mothers of young doctors/med students are just over protective of our little darlings and unable to untie the apron strings to let them find their way in the real word, and that our unprepared offspring are crying over a bit of healthy competition.

The fact is, we are concerned parents who are beginning to realise that current policy means that after 5 years’ of university and 2 years’ hard slog in foundation training, our children are staring down the barrel of unemployment, because positions they are qualified for are increasingly being given to doctors who have not trained here, do not live here, have no NHS experience, and are not citizens.

Increase In MBBS Seats
There has been a 6.30 per cent increase in MBBS seats, rising from 1,08,940 in 2023-24 to 1,15,812 in 2024-25. Over the last decade, MBBS seats have surged by 64,464 (125 per cent), growing from 51,348 in 2013-14 to 1,15,812 in 2024-25.
Increase In Postgraduate Seats
Postgraduate medical seats have increased by 5.92 per cent, from 69,024 in 2023-24 to 73,111 in 2024-25. In the past ten years, PG seats have grown by 39,460 (127 per cent), up from 31,185 in 2013-14 to 73,111 in 2024-25.

The statistics above relate to India and I have quoted them from an article from 2024 linked below.

India hasn't got training capacity for all its medical graduates so IMGs seek training opportunities abroad. The UK offers an easier route to globally recognised qualifications so naturally they would look to the UK as an option.

Even today, it appears that an IMG lobby group, through the use of the sponsorship licence that their academy holds, is offering to place IMGs in the NHS. Only several hours ago, I saw that they were offering courses to overseas doctors to train and build their careers in the NHS. How is this happening with all the cuts and job losses in the NHS? There is no way that their leadership is unaware that UK doctors are facing employment especially given the influential positions they hold in NHS workforce planning and in UK medical schools!

It seems that the NHS and politicians here need to do a deep and thorough analysis into exactly what is going on rather than accepting that all recommendations made by lobby groups (with interests back in their home countries) align with the interests of the NHS or the UK workforce. The expensive training courses sold to IMGs, some with fast tracking and licensing exam exemptions, is surely a conflict of interests.

https://www.ndtv.com/education/60-medical-colleges-set-up-across-india-in-a-year-health-minister-jp-nadda-6628306

It used to seen as quite racist to complain about immigrants coming over here, stealing our jobs. I’m surprised this thread is still going!

It really was and the ignorance of the situation is breathtaking.