Junior Doctors Unemployment in August

[PurpleFairyLights]

Name changed but long term poster. Have a child that is in this situation with 100k of student debt.

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2025-05-07/bma-we-could-potentially-see-thousands-of-unemployed-doctors

Unbelievable this was allowed. Most countries protect their medical graduates.

Is it worth adding something about the IMGs having much more experience (ie overqualified) and with the points based system, home grown grads have no hope of competing?

Is anyone a member of BMA? Been looking on Reddit and some very concerning information about BMAs role in this disaster. Need to have facts checked.

BMA campaigned for removal of RLMT in 2019.

Some IMGs are overqualified and take jobs to get their foot in the door to get British qualifications that enable them to compete globally. In their home countries, working conditions are worse and they earn a few hundred pounds a month. However there are also many IMGs that get in because the PLAB is easier than the UKMLA or because their documents (CREST) have been signed off overseas to a different standard. Also the best IMGs don't bother coming here given the state of the NHS.

Another quick fix suggested on Reddit was ban CREST forms for higher specialty training unless they are signed by UK consultant that has worked with applicant for 1-2 years.
I read somewhere there was a whole industry in these forms abroad as they are a gateway to UK training.

Just read that 195 countries worldwide prioritise their own medical graduates. Does anyone have information on this? Would be interesting to know which countries prioritise and which do not prioritise

https://academic.oup.com/pmj/article/100/1184/361/7513585

Interesting

But for some reason it makes every reccomendation other than the most obvious one....

Yes. It recognises the problem but needs to go further. Prioritisation of UK MGs by bringing back the RLMT or a similar legal mechanism to achieve prioritisation is urgently required.

Posters on Reddit seem depressed about it as 41% of BMA membership are IMGs so cannot see BMA supporting anything that would upset them.

There is also a mention of grandfathering needs to be stopped. I have never heard of that term but assume it means IMGs already here will not get same priority as UK graduates because otherwise there will always be a backlog. Apparently there were 15000 IMGs without a training place last year.

The conversation on Reddit were from last year and things have got even worse as even more IMGs applied this year.

Why was a stable eco system of number of medical school places matched with foundation jobs and training places trashed?

It is really worrying

Also surely these IMGs can work in their own countries but doubt UK graduates could work/train in their countries and even if they could likely to be a language barrier. So less likely to be facing unemployment like UK graduates. They have another option.

https://www.bma.org.uk/advice-and-support/international-doctors/studying-and-training-in-the-uk/ukrdc-uk-graduate-prioritisation-policy-faqs

This is what the RDC of the BMA was trying to achieve. It has faced opposition.

BMA shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted.

To sort the mess out they would need to prioritise UK graduates first as suggested by the Reddit doctors and stop grandfathering otherwise year after year there will be too many doctors chasing too few jobs (UK graduates and IMGs already here) and UK graduate unemployment will be a thing year after year as so much damage has been created by that 2019 deci. All those involved should hang their heads in same. Selling young people down the river while they were working their socks off in med school.

IMGs already here should be the next priority with easy access to visas.

Or is there a better way for both groups?

Yes, given the limited number of training spaces, it seems that the only way to be sure that all UK doctors can be accommodated is if they are allocated training first before the IMGs working in the NHS. Possibly why they pushed for prioritisation in that manner.

They won’t do that, because they want to flood the market to create competition, and more flexible doctors. In my opinion, anyway. It’s wrong, though.

I have been thinking about how many people have been let down.

It is very sad that some IMGs here would not get a training place due to UK doctor prioritisation but then look what the decision did for UK graduates?

Two sets of hard working dedicated people let down spectacularly.

Any UK doctor without a job in August is going to be less likely to get a training post next year as they will have had a year out of the NHS. Not really a competitive edge.

Sorry who wants to flood the market? Once a doctor is in the NHS they all have same working conditions and right so don't think one set of doctors would be more flexible than another...

If you have a surfeit of anything, then the market is flooded. In HR terms, you have a tight or loose labour market, meaning few or many potential employees. If you have a wide pool of possible employees, then it inevitably puts pressure on those who want to compete. Those pressures could include flexibility, and willingness to accept unattractive jobs, or low pay rises, or various conditions issues.

Because sme of us would rather be treated by a briilliant IMG who has bust their balls and sold their life to progress versus someone on an "unpopular" deanery ( dont know any of those) who has made the grade just and not gone a little bit further to get ahead.

There are 1000s who make the grade, I want the one who went the extra mile IMG or home to stand out, develop outside of the box and will be the best doctor.

Medicine is a dog eat dog world, competitive, bitchy and riddled with setbacks along the way how you fce deal and over come those is the doctor I want not the one on run through trainee who got it given as a gift becuase they went to a GB medical school.

Sorry to many emotive mummies here who do not get the reality of treating patients. Life does not give a shit where you trained, it gives a shit fi you are good fought to get there and will therefore fight for your patient

You are assuming there are no "mummies" on here that are also doctors. Why is that?

It’s the same with nurses, my sister and her classmates have no jobs to go to. My sister and her friend are applying to supermarkets until they can find something. It’s ridiculous

I am so sorry to hear that. Did you see the link someone posted about someone planning to bring in 5000 nurses from India?

How this situation has been allowed to develop is shocking.

They should write to their MP. It's ridiculous.

Ah the derogatory ‘mummies’ is back, like that’s all we are, not educated professionals. Some as has been said, also doctors.

From what I’m hearing the pay offer has not gone down well, but the foundation doctors are much more worried about jobs. Would have been an easy win for Wes to couple the pay award with a promise if UK Grad (whoever they are from) prioritisation. For doctors and nurses. He’s missed a trick there.

Yes. This idea that IMG doctors are the cream of the crop is nonsense in a lot cases. Some do not hold the equivalent RC exams and are holding posts that the UK doctors wouldn't have been able to apply for without them. Some IMGs working in the NHS - Registrars and Consultants have been taking these posts without the recognised qualifications for at least a decade now.