AIBU to say that not everything can be inclusive all the time?

[Summeriscumin]

A former student has asked for advice and I'm a bit stumped.

She has been running a drama club for 11 - 16 year olds in the village hall. The aim is an introduction to various theatre and circus skills.

These include vocal skills, breathing exercises, trust exercises, mime, juggling, acro, improvisation, script reading aloud, devising scenes and basic contemporary dance skills. It's been going very well and the subs are paying for the hall hire, so she isn't out of pocket.

But she's afraid she's going to have to give it up. A mum came along her son, a wheelchair user, asking to join and he was welcomed. My friend (C) explained what the sessions entailed and said there may be some that her son may not be able to participate in. Specifically she meant the energetic dance stuff and some circus skills and there was an issue with some trust exercises. - DCs have their eyes closed and move around and the wheelchair could prove dangerous.

The lad came for a couple of weeks and seemed to really enjoy it and C tried to make it as inclusive as possible without depriving the others of their skills training. They work in small groups so she always made sure there was a group he could work with.

However, this week the mother has said that her son must be included in everything or it's discrimination and that she should stop the exercises that he cannot participate in.

C says she may as well just give it up as that's just not fair on the others.

AIBU in thinking this mother is BU? I feel so sorry for C who has done her best to include the lad.

This is a good idea, providing there is enough demand to fill a second session of this nature and the leader has the time to give to another set-up (and skills), seeing as it isn’t a business and is entirely voluntary.

@Summeriscumin earlier posts suggests the subs are just at the point where the costs are covered and the group leader isn’t running at a loss.

Your friend sounds like she’s doing her best @Summeriscumin and as pps point out, ‘reasonable adjustments’ are being made.

I don't know the law so probably talking out of my arse. But surely you're allowed to say something like "some activities may be unsuitable for those with limited mobility/vision/hearing" (whatever). I mean, what if it was an amateur rugby team or a rock climbing club. There must be some caveats you can put in place in order to run groups. Does everything have to be inclusive by law?

I have a dc with significant needs.....I think the mother is being ridiculous!
I'm all for inclusion but I wouldn't take my child to a football club and insist everyone else had to play at his level in order for him to be able to
join in!

The problem is if people start saying the reasonable adjustments someone has made to make sure most things are inclusive aren’t good enough, and it turns into a huge issue to have to try and change the entire group and the activities then the volunteers who run things will just stop doing it completely.

If someone set up a table tennis club, and someone with no arms wanted to join, but they could use their feet, great! The organiser may be happy to look at techniques for using feet and train with the individual to use their feet. If the person with no arms said they want to be able to join in every training technique taught and it was discrimination to run separate training groups teaching with your hands, and they want every person in the class to only use their feet then that would not be reasonable.

If this table tennis teacher had to go away and learn techniques for the entire class to use their feet only, quite frankly she would likely give up. And I wouldn’t blame her.

You can just say no to people like this.

I'm just doing a course in a physical activity and there's a section on creating inclusive environments.

The NGB use a framework called an inclusion spectrum, so activities can be open (simple tasks for everyone), modified or parallel, so activities are changed to suit the person and they can pick something suitable or separate, an activity just for them.

The key is reasonable adjustments but no, not everyone can do everything. That goes for people without disabilities too with physical activities.

The mum can wish her DC can do everything but that's not possible.

The actor on Glee said it was almost impossible for him to play that part because it was so physically demanding. He fell out of the chair all of the time, and as he wasn’t disabled he could just get back in. As he was a fully grown man at the time at least he had some decent upper body strength. Unlike an actually disabled child.

I used to belong to a circus school for people with disabilities. I have a neurological condition, but there was a whole host of different people there. The leader was great, he worked with us individually to see what we could each do, so in an average session there would be 5 or 6 activities but very few of us did them all. It worked brilliantly. I really don't see the mum's issue here.

Years ago I had issues with a drama club trying to discriminate against my dd who has autism and diabetes. They didn’t want her there as said her insulin pump ‘may be dangerous’! Then said they couldn’t look after her so I explained I had a carer , they refused as said the carers enhanced dbs and specialist liability insurance wasn’t adequate. I argued and argued and the owner said ok. I thought that was the end of it but they then told us the session finished at 12 when it was later and they just didn’t want dd there all
day so she missed doing the performance at the end. When I complained the owner tried to justify her actions and her behaviour towards diabetes in particular and said she had advice off her dh as he had been ‘an extra in casualty so has medical
knowledge’ 🤦😂 I gave up and found a different group for her to attend !

Well in general…you are right…but in this instance I feel it can be. She has to think of ways around it. However there are scenarios where inclusion etc is not possible. There are some roles in my workplace where you cannot do them if you are in a wheelchair or need walking aids.

I mean, unless the wheelchair is going at 20mph, I'm not sure how it's any more dangerous than them walking slowly? Or maybe he puts something soft in his lap that protrudes. The kids adjust the height they hold their arms to account for the fact there is a wheelchair user. Or each child has a sighted guide with them to keep them from serious harm - so that's another trust aspect.

But this is what I mean, there are ways he can participate in that exercise and she's not taking the time to think about them. Does she give modifications for the movements he can't do?

Honestly, saying that she "always puts him in a supportive group" sounds a bit patronising. I'm really not sure she's being as inclusive as she can be.

All that will happen is it’ll become too difficult (or she’ll be scared of getting sued) and she’ll stop doing it. Then everyone misses out. The mother is clearly making a point, she’s not being fair or reasonable

I agree that the example you give isn't a reasonable adjustment. But the equivalent to this example sounds like it would be a multisports club where the person with no arms never plays table tennis, rather than allowing them to play with their feet.

As this is a volunteer-run group, perhaps his Mum could also volunteer and develop some new activities that her son and other children in his situation could participate in?

I think that she's asking alot of your friend who's trying her best to be inclusive- I wouldn't blame your friend if she stops volunteering completely.

The other thing to keep in mind is unless she has experience of supporting someone in a wheelchair then trying to change things has an extra issue. It doesn’t sound like the Mother in this case is necessarily working with her to help more saying “include him” which also doesn’t help

Honestly I think the mother is absolutely at it.

@Sirzy Yes, it sounds like his Mum wants the friend to make changes, without acknowledging that she's running this class in her free time as a volunteer and could use some additional help.

Exactly. DS goes to some great groups now but I have worked closely with the leaders to help make it possible. One has since set up a SEN friendly group as a result of helping me and a few other parents but it’s been very much about group work.

That’s easily adaptable for a wheelchair. If they are walking about slowly the risk of an accident is very minimal.

I see no reason he can’t join in dance activities. Depending on the reason he uses the wheelchair, there are loads of ways to adapt dances, lots of examples online.

what kind of circus skills are we talking about? If it’s trapeze or tumbling then I can see the issue, but most other things can be adapted. It just takes some thinking on her part.

Thanks for the contributions. The majority seem to agree the mother is U. I hope C feels able to carry on.

If I was your friend @Summeriscumin i would suggest she speak to the mum and be honest. Say she isn’t sure how to adapt the class and ask the mum if she’d be willing to help work out some ways to make the class more inclusive, get the boy involved too, he might have some ideas!

You’ve asked a bunch of able bodied people. That’s like asking a bunch of men if it’s unreasonable for women to take time off during their period.

I can't believe how entitled the mother is. Your ex student is kindly welcoming her child and try to adapt when she can. Instead of being greatful the mum is not happy some activities are not possible to adapt. No good deeds as they say..

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