To think Starmer is utterly reprehensible

[Thegreyhound]

I know everyone will disagree, that’s ok- But I just have to say that Starmer today seems to have sunk lower than I ever believed he would with his incendiary ‘island of strangers’ and ‘incalculable damage’ rhetoric.
I find it particularly shocking because he has calculated this and decided it’s worth it to throw immigrants under the bus and essentially give all the ground in the debate to Farage, Tommy Robinson and Enoch Powell types.
Policy can be altered without making statements that are designed to impact race relations and make life even more difficult for people who are just trying to get along and make a living here.
Starmer is vile. This country does indeed feel like an island of strangers these days but the strangers are not the immigrants :(

These people are coming to do a job - ie work paying tax and social security. Thats all fine in my book. Is it that you don’t like them because they’re not from hereabouts?

Yeah I was going to say, maybe she should have researched the implications a bit more and had her baby here - her choice her consequences

But how many of them are actually doing a job? 500,000 care visas have been issued but the vacancies fell from 150,000 to 130,000. Open your eyes.

I agree. But I think they’ll say what they need to to secure votes then once in (if they stay in) will not be as strong on this issue. They’ll then have a few years to build up to the issues ppl are then concerned with (maybe return to this one) and the cycle continues

Hmmm, they're 'left' are they?

Funny how they have such strong and rigid immigration laws, and will turn the vast majority of people away at the border. 🤔

Where do you get that info from?

Well that is another connected issue. That is why immigration is an issue within the wider context of society. It isn’t an issue in isolation.

the fact is the population of our nation is now too big for it to be manageable and as a result we have a massive disparity between the haves and the have nots. The importing of labour is effectively papering over cracks and in effect just kicking underlying issues into the long grass for future generations.

once upon a time only a few people had second homes and it barely registered as an issue. Now it is an issue as we have limited land and limited stock. Should people now be allowed second homes? No, not really but then there are areas completely dependant on the revenue those second home owners bring in. It is a vicious cycle of no solution.

Well aside from the only real solution is a managed steady reduction of the population to release the strain on future generations. ‘But the pensions’ they all cry - who is gonna pay my pensions?!!! - we need more and more people to pay them and then we need more and more people to pay those extra pensions. The economy is a giant Ponzi scheme let’s face it that is completely out of control.

are immigrants a scapegoat for that- perhaps. Rightly or wrongly some might be the cause and some the solution. It’s a complete mess tbh.

100% this. Hardly a 'handful!' 😂 The way some people (on the left) will twist and bend and minimise facts to make them sound reasonable and correct is hilarious.

I am ethnically Indian. I and the rest of my family many of whom have lived here for decades have noticed an uptick in racism. It makes us more wary when we travel and in workplaces we are seeing more open racism. Starmer's messaging will not help this. The reality is we are moving to the right as a country, following on from the US and life for anyone of colour will get harder over the coming years.

I have no doubt that there will also be a backlash when the lack of migration starts to really bite (which it will), on care costs/provision and on hospital waiting times.

No one seems prepared to actually plan to deliver the roles required which might could the need for migration and I have not seen any party come up with a credible option of stopping small boats.

Go do the research and realise what you’re advocating for.

I expect the poster refers to countries and cultures where women aren't allowed out without a male chaperone, where women have to cover up their entire body and sometimes their face. At the extreme regimes where women aren't allowed to be spotted through windows or in their own back yard they are so opressed. Why would we assume that men that have grown up in these cultures support British values?

’They’re not’

Which is why Reform are leading. Going back to the Tories constantly won’t help Labour at the next GE.

It’s a different threat.

Me too. It’s a horrible feeling. I feel very isolated now and adrift.

Ah so you don’t know where you got your info from? Reform much.

Is that the only argument you’re capable of putting forward? That you have not got a clue what you’re advocating for, but anyone who disagrees with you is far right and evil!!! The oh so tolerant left

Did you consider this before you came here and had a child?

Why are you calling it social security?

Surely it’s tax and NI contributions?

It’s all about balance, and integration in my opinion. Voters in the majority do not read the manifestos. It was clear when it came to brexit that it would not solve immigration and would force us into a cost of living crisis, but people voted for it anyway. Having read it in depth, I voted remain (for what it was worth).

I work for NHS England and before I voted I read the Labour manifesto. Did it say NHSE would be scrapped? No. Did it talk about immigration? Slightly. So Starmer is doing things that wasn’t part of his plan, most likely due to public opinion. And this is what is happening here, that he’s seen the growth in reform due to their stance on immigration and has responded in what he thinks people want to hear. What voters need to realise is that Farage was the main steer when it came to Brexit and it did indeed go his way. But did it stop the boats? No. And it was never going to.

As an nhs employee we rely on immigration to keep our health service going. But as we move in the DHSC, Labour have seemed to overlook that immigrants cannot work in many roles for the civil service. So what happens to them? What happens to our dual nationals who also cannot work in the DHSC?

And then there’s the balance part. My daughter is in a school with a large Polish population. They do not integrate, and speak in their native tongue which makes my daughter feel isolated in some of her lessons. But, the majority of their parents will be working in the local ASOS factory, which struggled to recruit locals when it opened despite a high level of unemployment in the area. Many see immigrants as “stealing” local jobs, whereas in this case, the locals weren’t willing to work there.

You ask yourself that question. I never said you were far right and evil- is that something you feel comes from yourself?

Wow.

32 MPs is enough to swing an election.

Also our government is Labour. You think the Senedd going to reform wouldn’t affect the whole of the U.K.?

Speaking objectively, it's interesting because in London, which is the most diverse place in the UK with the most immigrants, people are actually way more tolerant and more generally supportive of immigration.

I visited a regional town recently for work where there were a lot of migrants hanging around on the high street. The same high street was also incredibly run down with empty shops etc. I wondered if people conflate the two problems somehow?

That said, I do think integration is a huge problem, and that we have made things worse by Brexiting - I kind of agree with Blair that we swapped single European hospitality workers for entire families from South Asia and African nations, whom people in towns find it harder to integrate with, possibly due to less English spoken, cultural, religious, food culture differences, and sometimes racism.

Actually, here in Australia we have even more overseas born than the UK - around 30% to your 17%. Legal immigration is very high and plenty of brown faces to be seen. I was very relieved by the recent election result here and in general, Australians have a less negative attitude towards immigration. They seem to understand how it is economically beneficial to the country despite housing shortages etc.

You are condescending and rude to everyone who disagrees with you. You sum up the position of the left and why so many people are turning to parties such as reform.

Came here? You know what country I’m living in?

I left UK to start paying tax in another country. For what it’s worth my tax bill for the last 5 years is over 250k - all money in the treasury that isn’t going to the UK treasury which is a shame isn’t it.