To think my husband is wrong for reporting my sister for benefit fraud?

[Rockyhardplace25]

So back story:

My sister is a lot younger than me. There is a 15 year age gap- so I basically raised her as my mother was struggling with an alcohol addiction and wasn’t fit to until she went into rehab when my sister was 9. We have a very, strong close relationship.
Sister has also had her own issues with drugs- but when she found out she was pregnant with my niece 8 years ago, went to rehab and has sorted her life out. To some extent.
She has a much older partner, the gap is nearly 30 years, who she met in her addiction who has also, again to some extent, sorted his life out. In that aspect- I take my hat off to both of them.
This man was married with adult children and got my sister pregnant after a one night stand. He left his wife and moved in with my sister. His “other family” have completely cut him off apart from his eldest child- who, from what I can work out, uses him as a bank.

Me and DH have one child, DD who is now a 11, Children are expensive- there’s no two ways about it. With clothing, school trips, days out etc it does add up. DSIS has a 7 year old and is now pregnant with a second child who we are all very excited about.

DSIS doesn’t work and claims sickness benefits, her partner does. Up until recently we assumed she was reporting his income as part of her claim- but we have found out through a slip of the tounge she isn’t. She isn’t even declaring he lives with her, which he does full time. His bank account, car and other things that could link him back to DSIS house is registered to his son’s address. A son he gives £1500 a month too.

DSIS was brought a house when she turned 18 (we have same mum, different dads) so solely pays the mortgage and a lump of the bills herself topped up by her partner. If he/the kids need anything he will go out and buy it but doesn’t directly contribute to the monthly running of the home. Which has pissed me off if I’m honest.

DH is even more pissed off- feels she is taking the piss, as is he, she is committing fraud and why is it fair we both work our arses off to pay our monthly bills when she’s getting it handed to her on a plate but wouldn’t if she was honest. DH thinks if she does that then her partner will leave her because at the moment he’s pretty much living the life of Riley with no expenses.

Hes admitted to me over the weekend he’s reported her for benefit fraud. I don’t know how I feel- I keep flitting from one thing to the next- but ultimately she is my sister and I am worried she will get into serious shit.

He's left his wife and moved in with OP's DSis because he got her pregnant after a one-night stand. It looks as though he wants to 'act' like a caring father, even if the reality is quite different. If his motives were genuine and he was actually prepared to support his imminent child and the mother of that child, it would save the tax payer, most if not all, of the UC DSis is currently receiving.

@boiledrice - genuine question - why do you feel that benefit fraud shouldn't be reported? Obviously, I do think it should be, but I am trying to understand opposing views. Can you elaborate?

Your DSis and her complicit DP should not be claiming, of course not.

But what a nasty thing for your DH to do, to go behind your back and not discuss this with you. I would be furious and very upset.

No honest, I know, but had he done it anonymously and secretly at least he wouldn’t have put you in the horrible and impossible position you are now in.

Does he care if you lose your relationship with your DSis and her children? If your kids lose their cousins?

My SIL did the same thing. Claimed as a single parent for ten years while her partner (dad of their child too) lived with her and earned a good wage 60k a year. She tried to justify it saying they kept their money seperate and he didn’t help towards the bills.
Anyway, DWP found out don’t know if she was reported or if they picked up on it - She is now paying back over 100k in benefit fraud and has had to get a job to repay them.

I would warn her and tell her to get a job because it’s not pretty having to go to court and pay that back and she will - my SIL can no longer claim benefits she’s been banned from claiming for ten years.

@BangersAndGnash "... had he done it anonymously and secretly at least he wouldn’t have put you in the horrible and impossible position you are now in." I think this is the essence of the problem and why OP has started this thread. Once her DH decided to make an anonymous report to the DWP, there would have been nothing OP could do about it after the fact, but I agree, her DH has put her in an impossible position by telling her now because, if her DSis were to contact her in a few months' time in a panic saying that someone's "dobbed her in", OP will know it was her DH that's done it. If he hadn't have told OP she would be none the wiser and would be able to sympathise with her DSis (even if she doesn't agree with what her DSis has been doing).

Is she aware of the aspect of financial abuse and coercive control where women are left in a position where they feel they have no choice but to commit benefit fraud - or could she have been trying to protect herself and her child/ren by maintaining financial independence because he doesn't pay his way and insists it's not his responsibility?

It's clear that many posters aren't.

https://idas.org.uk/16-days/economic-abuse/#:~:text=Economic%20abuse%20can%20also%20involve%20limiting%20access%20to%20the%20benefits,pay%20child%20maintenance%20following%20separation.

I suppose at least the children won't be placed into the care system, as I'm sure the OP will take them in if her sister is imprisoned or unable to support and house them as a direct result of her husband's actions.

Thanks for sharing. I wonder how many people criticising OP's DH will think what your SIL was doing was just fine? 🤔

I'd do this. It's not gonna be easy but is better for her than the alternative

I can completely understand why she continued to claim UC, that's perfectly understandable, but he got her pregnant after a one-night stand and then left his family to move in with her in her mortgaged home. The mistake she made was letting him do that. She should have used a benefits calculator to work out how much UC she would lose by having a cohabiting partner and made it clear to him that unless he was prepared to contribute to the household expenses an amount equal to that loss, he couldn't move in. Maybe she is a victim of his financial coercion - if so, she will be able to argue this to the DWP (and the court should it come to that).

Not so for me.

I think what I object to is the moralising around this.

Why did the husband report the sister? Is he simply an upstanding citizen who reports any possible criminal activity he becomes aware of to the relevant authorities? If so, perhaps I have more sympathy for him as he is simply a stickler for the rules. How frequently does he find himself reporting potential crimes he thinks may have been committed? If infrequently, what has motivated him to report this particular potential crime? I would suggest that there are likely to be a range of potential or alleged crimes he could report. Self employed people he knows who may or may not be paying taxes, groups of people on the street corner who may be engaging in anti-social behaviour, other benefit claimants who happen not to be his sister in law.

Unless he is the stickler for the rules to the extent he will report any potential or suspected crimes to the relevant authorities for investigation, he has chosen to report this for reasons other than his personal commitment to crime prevention and justice.

He is reporting this for personal reasons - and therefore he is a petty and meddling bastard.

Your sister shouldn’t be doing this obviously and I don’t condone fraud of any kind. The consequences for her and any children could be extremely serious though and it would have been much better to have persuaded her to have him move out. I have known people limit how much their partner stays in order to avoid exactly this scenario.

Totally agree with this.

Also, there's every chance he's done this knowing the partner will think somebody else is to blame - the wife he left.

Hope this man isn't the violent kind or prone to retaliation. Many years ago my neighbour's partner wrongly accused me of reporting his gf for a similar form of benefit fraud. He kicked my front door through and put a brick through my window, narrowly missing my teenager, who was sleeping downstairs as his bedroom was being decorated. I found out recently who actually reported them, it was the partner of another neighbours brother - she barely knew them but didn't like them. Of course she kept quiet though and watched us take the flack 🙄

Isn't reporting her making her more vulnerable by making her more financially dependent on a man?

Perhaps his wife kicked him out because he got someone pregnant and moving in with OPs sister was an easy thing to do. Regardless, he might genuinely want a relationship with the sister and be happy to support his child but few people would be happy to support a woman they have only known a couple of months (even if in a relationship with them) and a child that is unrelated to them.

I agree. I doubt this has anything to do with being "moral" and more to do with jealousy,

This is classic Mumsnet… Benefit fraud, which is illegal, should be allowed because ‘family’. Tax avoidance, which is legal, should not be allowed because ‘not fair’ ;)

That's quite a massive oversimplification of the issues here.

Obviously, yes. If he gave a shit at all he'd be warning her if the consequences of benefit fraud, not bloody reporting her.

Does this not make your character 'shady' too?

If we want our tax money to be going to those in genuine need we need to report tax evaders and benefit fraudsters. There is no excuse for this behaviour.

She is committing benefit fraud. She should be reported however it's unlikely to help her by doing this. I would warn her first that if she doesn't declare it. The. He will report her

That's awful. There should not be rules that your benefits get lowered/taken away if you live with a partner. It both makes a vulnerable person more vulnerable, and it's basically the state forcing the partner to financially take care of someone!

But yes let's all get the pitchforks out for the rule breaker, when the rule shouldn't be there in the first place.

Good for your dh. I'm absolutely sick of these people defrauding taxpayers. Always too sick to work but can manage to keep having babies as well. hope she has to pay every bit back.

Any coercive control she reports to DWP will be taken into consideration. But let’s not infantilise women here. She knew what she was doing.

Why shouldn’t the rule be there in the first place ? If you have a partner and they are contributing towards the household then you have a duty to inform the DWP. The benefit claim for a single person is based on the fact that you live alone and when you claim, it’s made clear that any change in circumstances must be reported. If you choose not to, then you have to face the consequences.