Reform winning big

[Keirawr]

Reform had a good night, winning county councils, probably will win a mayoral seat and won the parliamentary by election also.

You don’t have to be a Reform voter to acknowledge that they are taking votes off Labour. Or that they are being electorally effective.

No doubt the ‘basket of deplorables’ crowd will be along in a min with their usual quips calling reform voters names, having learned absolutely 0 from Brexit. Insult the voters at your peril.

These same people also totally miss the point that winning is winning. Feeling all moral and superior about ‘oh well, what will they actually do’ changes nothing.

Perhaps those who label everyone that wants immigration limiting as ‘racist’ Will think again. But likely not.

‘Insult the Reform voters at your peril’ - well only slight, slight consolation is that it will be at everyone’s peril, including those Reform voters, when there’s voting for leopards will eat your face. Very sad and scary for my kids and grandkids and their generations.

Oh and it should be mandated that everyone in the UK has to watch ‘Years and Years’

Yep they’ve attacked nearly everyone.

I think it's really important to point out that whilst Reform did get votes, turnout was so low! So for example, I voted in the West of England mayoral vote and turnout was 30%!! Reform got 6000 less votes than Labour... not exactly a 'big win' for Reform, or Labour in fact, who did actually win. Reform didn't exactly smash it. I don't know anyone who votes Reform, their MPs are criminals. If anyone really thinks Reform are the answer to their problems, they unfortunately lack critical thinking skills.

Indeed there is no way that this soon after the general election that Labour voters would switch back to the Tories -"oh maybe they weren't so bad after all" is a not going to happen for many years.

Despite having over 70 MPs there is silence and tumble weeds from the LibDems.

Voters see that the UK is in a state of managed decline and that Labour don't seem to be that different to the Tories. To be fair they have realised that once in power they have limited room to manoeuvre given the high level of Government debt and can't increase taxation without further harming economic growth.

So Labour voters wanting "real change ", (whatever that is and whether it is even possible given the above constraints) are switching to Reform and the Greens.

People that voted for Brexit equally have obviously learnt nothing. They fail to see how much Brexit has harmed our economy and hence their day to day lives.
I only know a few Reform voters in real life and sadly they stand up to the stereotype and are racist. Not because they are worried about immigration but because they use racist language (n word/p word) and say openly racist things.

I am 20 and have 8 known conditions/disabilities. includes developmental delays and an autoimmune disease that could lead to inflammation in my brain and was brought on by stress - the figure doesn’t include diagnosed and debilitating mental health ones. I’m sure you know this but it’s not everyone who has done it to themselves.

Not just read and understand but be able to critically assess it as a list of impossible promises vs a plan that can actually be implemented.

Reform’s manifesto promised the moon and all the cheese on the moon. Only a lunatic would believe it could be implemented.

I love how people who voted for the brexit shitshow are still trying to blame people who voted remain for brexit happening. Nice try but no one's falling for it. The blame lies squarely on the shoulders of the people who voted for it, then allowed it to proceed by voting tory in the next general election.

Because (in 2000), the Labour government created a two-tier system for accommodating people who were destitute. Instead of people seeking asylum (who were destitute) being accommodated by the local council alongside everyone else, the Home Office became responsible for accommodating them via the National Asylum Support System.

NASS procured ‘dispersal’ accommodation in areas of the country where it was cheap. Places with few employment prospects, high crime, poor public transport and/or social deprivation (e.g. former industrial towns destroyed by Thatcher’s policies). Local people were already struggling and angry. Refugees were forced to go there.

Plus (in 2002), the government made it unlawful for people seeking asylum to work and for employers to employ them.

So, instead of being like everyone else, getting a job, paying tax and finding somewhere to live while awaiting their decision (which can take years), people seeking asylum used up any savings they’d arrived with and were left destitute in large numbers. And therefore dependent on the state.

I agree everyone in England who’s destitute should be entitled to accommodation. It’s inhumane and brutal for anyone to be street homeless in a very wealthy country like England. In most cases of street homelessness it’s because people (including many British people) have no rights to accommodation.

An increasing number are newly legally-recognised refugees, who’ve spent years in the asylum system awaiting a decision, unable to work or contribute (which they desperately want to do), then get their decision and are asked to leave asylum accommodation with short notice (28 days) and with no income or savings. It can take ages to get an NI number to get a job. They end up street homeless, which makes it even harder to get a job.

We need to allow people seeking asylum to work. End the two-tier system and give responsibility for accommodating everyone who’s homeless back to councils. And accommodate everyone by investing in decent, permanent council housing instead of selling it off. Otherwise, the Home Office will continue to compete with councils to procure temporary accommodation for both (i) people seeking asylum and (ii) British people (as well as foreign nationals with leave to remain in UK) who’re homeless.

Who benefits? The private ‘accommodation providers’ they procure it from, who are making millions. They sit back and watch the state outbid itself for the same limited pool of accommodation. Disaster capitalism. Crazy economics. Flawed political decisions to posture being ‘tough on immigration’. Taxpayers charged millions by private companies.

Your own homeless are put into these hotels. It is emergency accommodation. If you are talking about the homeless you see on the street there are overnight homeless hostels etc. Generally single males/ females are not prioritised whether they are asylum seekers or British citizens so are often sleeping rough but of course there are a whole host of complex issues as to why people sleep rough and are homeless which has absolutely nothing to do with asylum seekers. It is ,mainly families that get housed in hotel emergency accommodation. When you say "foreigners" who are you referring to? International Protection Applicants? Migrant workers? who?

As a lifelong Labour voter, I am so disappointed with this Labour government. I agree with you about their stance on Gaza, but I don't think that voting for right-wing, islamophobic, anti-immigrant candidates is the answer. All that will do is push Labour further to the right and they will increase their anti-immigration rhetoric in the vain hope of winning back these voters by out-Farageing Farage.

I think that the Muslim voters in the US who either abstained or voted for Trump as a protest against Biden's Israel/Gaza position have massively shot themselves in the foot. They have helped to elect a fascist government.

It seems that you expect everyone to agree with you? Interesting. Last I knew, we are still in a democracy and people are allowed to disagree with Farage.

Considering the ones 'with experience' couldn't have made a worse job of Absolutely Everything - then maybe that's a good thing?

To be fair, the power for councils these days to even address their stated responsibilities is pretty much nil. A huge percentage of their budget goes on things they're mandated to do (social care, SEN transport, public sector pensions, schools grants that are passed directly down, etc). Aren't there a whole set of new councils about to go bust, regardless of who wins these elections?

We need to allow people asylum to work.
Yes agree with this, there will be certain scetors they cannot work in such as with children or the vulnerable because they cannot perform adequate background checks but plenty of other roles they can do

and give responsibility for accommodating everyone who’s homeless back to councils.
Not sure I agree with this one, it is centralised system because they have not yet been given leave to remain their applicants are being assessed and a majority will end up being sent back because their application for asylum has been denied so if they are dispersed in accommodation managed by different local authorities this may further complicate things. The asylum process needs to be speeded up massively so those that are not eligible get dealt with swiftly and sent home and those that are eligible can get processed and supported properly and granted leave to remain so they can get on with things and start working etc

You've totally misunderstood what I meant about Thatcher! I meant that she was a key figure in starting the rot with her 'there is no such thing as society' line. As you say, so many people don't care, don't listen and are just plain nasty to others. It's very sad.

I don't agree with you that New Labour really righted many wrongs. They were and are just another Neoliberal party, making the majority of workers poorer and making the elites richer. There has been a gradual, societal decline. It has, admittedly been far more visible following the GFC, under the 14 years of the Tory party.
I do agree with you that these are dangerous times and that we will see a lot of changes, many of which may be negative ones. It doesn't just involve the UK either.

Ah.. the turkeys are voting for Christmas again.

I hope none of those voters are women, Farage is notable a supporter of US Republican policy... kiss goodbye to women's reproductive rights if that lot get in.

No-one with a functioning brain or iota of intelligence should be touching that party with a barge pole.

They're taking votes from the Tories more than they are from Labour. Though yes, many protest votes against Labour.

The headline news from the results overnight is that the Conservative Party is on its arse.

I agree with you but you've missed my point.
People who don't do this and can't do this still get the vote and they are not happy with the current state of things!

So black men and muslims are the problem?

Will the silent majority benefit from Reform?

Tice has been very clear in his support for privatising the NHS, providing tax rebates for families that pay for private schooling. He has spoken of his desire to reduce unnecessary use of GPs by charging a fee for appointments. Will this benefit the silent majority?

As a higher rate taxpayer, married to a higher rate taxpayer, with just one child, I think we would be financially better off with Reform (not that we’d ever test that theory by voting for them). But our household income is not that of the ‘silent majority’. I don’t see how lower paid households will benefit from Reform, maybe I’m missing something.

Reform have mentioned raising personal allowance to £20k, which would be hugely beneficial to all workers, but as with all headlines, the devil is in the details and how this will be financed has not been forthcoming.

The reality is, Tice is financially astute and knows that the biggest cost to our economy, surpassing the NHS, is social benefits. Both he and Farage have been vocal, at fundraisers to high net worth attendees, that worker’s rights are a barrier to growth and that the country needs to get back to work - any form of work. I’m not sure the ‘silent majority’ quite appreciate how this will impact them.

"Labour have won 3 out of 4 mayoral elections."

There are still two more mayoral elections to declare. Labour are very likely to lose the Cambridgeshire & Peterborough election (they only narrowly won it last time). That seems more likely to go Conservative.

There is also the first ever mayoral election in Hull; it looks like that could go Reform.