To shriek from the rooftops that there is No Such Thing as “preferred pronouns”?

[Ddakji]

That’s it.

They don’t exist - any more than preferred adjectives, adverbs or nouns exist.

Even people who don’t like them still seem to think they exist.

Language is a shared, collective endeavour that belongs to all. It’s not a pick’n’mix for individuals to choose and change at will. For words not to be garbage they have clear definitions - in this case she for females, he for males, they (singular) for sex unknown.

Saying my preferred pronouns are she/her, even if that doesn’t fly in the face of reality, is no different to saying my preferred species is human, my preferred adjectives are sporty and lush.

It’s nonsense. Nothing to do with being kind or they don’t affect me, or I don’t mind if others do but I won’t. It’s nonsense.

Let’s make 2025 the year we kick this nonsense into touch.

Why are “preferred pronouns” helpful? Does your work require you to know the sex of all your colleagues on the call?

It’s incredible how gender ideology has mangled language and understanding.

I would argue that volunteer work is performative kindness in a lot of cases and no none goes around telling people that they are kind, there are many ways to be kind with out having to give away all your wages and volunteering

Anyway giving away all your wages isn’t particularly kind or sensible if you have a family to provide for and bills to pay,

Sorry but the person I responded to originally said they were kind because they used preferred pronouns. Therefore People do go around telling others how kind they are

the point I am trying to make is:

if some says I don’t use preferred pronouns, there is someone who bleats ‘it is kind to use them, what harm does it do you? You are unkind and mean.’

someone else goes, ‘I have no money, I’m really hard up this month, would you give me you spare salary this month?’ When some says no, no one goes ‘but you are so unkind and mean’

I have made this point before and a Lot agreed - only used in this one situation.

and no volunteering isn’t performative kindness unless you tell all and sundry about it. Most don’t tell anyone.

I get what your saying but doesn’t it all boil down to whether you are going to behave in a respectful manner or not, treating colleagues / people with respect etc

and no volunteering isn’t performative kindness unless you tell all and sundry about it. Most don’t tell anyone

I would argue that it can be as a lot of people do tell others about it and some make quite a big song and dance about it

Again #bekind

if you don’t do what I tell you to do, you are unkind.

manipulative in my opinion, particularly to women who are conditioned to be people pleasers

But why have you deemed this is 'respectful'?

We don't think its respectful to affirm an anorexic's belief that they are overweight. We don't think it's respectful to affirm someone's belief that they are Jesus or Napoleon, or even another race or age. So why this?

The Cass report was clear that social transition is not a neutral act and can hasten people down paths that may not be right for them. Ultimately some of these paths can be very harmful for the individual.

And that's before we get into the wider implications for society in prioritising 'gender' over sex and the implications that ultimately has for women's rights and safeguarding.

So personally, I strongly disagree that using preferred pronouns is respectful or kind if we look at them wider picture.

Well, my argument in this thread is specifically that “preferred pronouns” are a nonsense on a number of levels, which you yourself have shown. Anything that you can’t refuse without consequence isn’t a preference, unless you’ve decided to redefine what prefer means.

Along with that, you seem to be redefining what “respect” means, given that it isn’t the slightest bit respectful to demand, with consequences, that others deny reality, and to deny them the correct language to describe that reality.

A preference isn’t a demand, and respect isn’t a one-way street.

No, it’s respect, not kindness
I expect people to show me respect but by the same token I show respect, you cannot expect to be treated respectfully if you don’t show it
It has nothing to do with people pleasing

With trans, it absolutely is. The person who demands with consequences that you use the wrong words to describe them isn’t treating you with a shred of respect.

Ultimately, I don't even think it's respectful to the people asking for preferred pronouns to do that without question or any thought to the wider consequences. For them as much as for anyone else.

Respect isn't about just giving people what they want.

But it isn’t a demand it’s a preference, you don’t have to use it if you don’t want

Would you insist a child shows respect in this way? Would you say use she dear even if the child can see the person is a biological male.

How would you square asking a dc to lie about what they see?

You are insisting that you are shown respect by compelling someone’s speech though. Doesn’t sound very respectful to them

Nobody calls themselves a pronoun (except I).
You have no control over what other people refer to you as (especially since you won’t even be in the room while they’re doing so).

I wouldn’t insist, I would explain that it was this persons preference to be referred to in a certain way and we should respect that

I’m not insisting on anything or compelling anyone to do anything

If you say someone is disrespectful if they don’t do it, you are insisting and compelling them

No if someone told you it was their preference to be referred to as Archduke Napoleon do you think we should respect that too?

We should? Why?

If they can clearly see the person is male wouldn’t you feel bad asking your dc to lie about an adult’s sex to validate them?

You could say to dc the blue sky is not blue and it would be wrong and damaging, not respectful.

If there is a consequence attached, it’s not a preference. It’s a demand. And not respectful.

A quick google gave me this: Preferences tend to be healthy and adaptive, while demands are maladaptive and lead to emotional problems.

I never said ‘we should’
I said, I would

Why should your child respect someone’s demand to have reality denied?

You did say should. Your words, should underlined below.

I wouldn’t insist, I would explain that it was this persons preference to be referred to in a certain way and we should respect that.