To think there is a poor understanding of a healthy diet?

[LivelyLemonQuoter]

I think most people think they know what a healthy diet looks like, but in reality they do not. I see so many comments on MN that demonstrate this.

The most common one is that fruit should be limited because of its sugar content. This is very bad advice. Sugar in fruit has little impact on our blood sugar levels. And most people in the UK do not eat enough fruit.

The other is concern over eating any carbs. Wholemeal bread and pasta is fine, carbs in pastry and doughnuts is not great though.

And most people need to eat more nuts. Nuts are very good for you and should be part of your regular diet.

exactly. plus, blood sugar isn’t the only reason for limiting fruit, any sugar negatively affects the microbiome so people with digestive issues will sometimes benefit from limiting it.

You’re sharing meta studies that look at trends among healthy populations and conclude that their daily habits/foods are contributing factors. That’s not particularly rigorous research.

It’s also not very wise to make generalisations like “eat nuts” - if you’re talking about cheap packaged nuts found in supermarkets, what most people will get from those is a whole bunch of omega-6 fats (which we already get too much of, and which contribute to inflammation unless the person has a very high intake of omega-3), and mould.

Just missing a lot of nuance here.

But more than anything, why come into this discussion with such an attitude? Most people haven’t been taught principles of dietetics and biochemistry at school, so if you personally want to educate them, not sure a scalding is the best approach.

I think I'd rather eat Turkey Twizzlers at every meal if eating super-healthily makes you this pious. 🤷🏻‍♀️

But for someone who's body can process sugar fruit can form part of a healthy diet. It is often coupled with fibre which slows digestion and many fruits are fructose which is metabolised slightly differently to refined sugar. Sure, it raises blood sugar levels, but less likely to have a 'crash' due to these factors, and you also benefit from the vitamins and nutrients. Like anything balance is important, I'm sure if someone tried to sustain themselves on fruit alone it wouldn't be good; but a portion or two a day as part of a balanced diet is on balance beneficial. Of course someone who has diabetes has different considerations to make in regard to their diet.

Not diabetic but have tested myself years ago and definitely does raise blood sugar levels immediately after eating. It might not be for long as insulin kicks in and keeps everything on a relatively even keel. But it does raise them.

Having said that I could not go without fruit.

only 3 portions per day!!!

I had more than that in one sitting last night

1 whole pineapple, 6 peaches, 3 bananas all blasted together in a nutribullet with plain yogurt to make several large smoothies

I was craving fruit and didn’t eat anything else last night

Thank you.

There’s no real evidence that they are helpful to people who aren’t diabetic….nut lots of evidence they are making lots of money for certain firms https://www.theguardian.com/wellness/2024/mar/11/diabetes-monitoring-glucose-blood-sugar-products

@LivelyLemonQuoter

The most common one is that fruit should be limited because of its sugar content. This is very bad advice. Sugar in fruit has little impact on our blood sugar levels.

Could you explain this please

I got myself round a 20km run yesterday on two crumpets and a coffee. As a runner I live off carbs 😁

Did you read the academic articles that you posted or just find the links? They don’t refer to three portions as being beneficial. One says one and a half servings are sufficient for example. But they are all inconclusive on portion size.

It makes me think someone asked you to back up your argument and you just googled and dumped the results here.

Who is obsessing about everything that goes into their mouth? I like cake and donuts

If someone wants to keep their weight down it's common to limit carbs, and that does include fruit. But I wouldn't say people are doing it to be healthy. More they want a flatter stomach.

I think people vastly underestimate the amount of calories they consume unless they are actively counting or dieting.

People confuse a "healthy diet" and weight loss. On a healthy diet you should maintain your weight unless deliberately eating a calorie deficit. A healthy diet is about blood sugar regulation, energy levels, gut health, bowel motility, brain clarity and all those other bodily functions we totally forget about in pursuit of being thin. A thin person with a dreadful diet is more likely to be unhealthy than a person who has a good diet but is carrying a bit of extra weight.

I would guess it's anecdotal. My own experience with vegetarianism and veganism is that many years ago it was quite healthy. There were no vegan chocolate bars, and the only processed food I can recall is Tofu, Tempeh and those awful soya chunks. Oh, yes and there were those sugar free carob bars an early chocolate alternative. They seem to be discontinued now.

There were some really nice vegan restaurants in London that were cheap - Food for Thought in Covent Garden was excellent and Cranks also in central London both served lovely cheap vegan and vegetarian food that was really wholesome. These days it is hard to find vegan or vegetarian places that are focused on what we used to call wholefoods.

I do find that a lot of vegan stuff is very processed these days. Vegan sausages are so salty and tasteless in my mind. Vegan "chocolate" is so sweet I can't eat it. I am no longer vegan because I find eating meat does something to my body and mind that makes me feel better - I am not sure why that is, but it just does. But I do still have several vegan meals during the week, which I cook from scratch.

I’m obsessed with cakes and donuts

Of course it raises them but not for long, if you are healthy and not diabetic. My parents are in their late 80s and have always eaten a lot of fruit due to having apple plums and pear trees in the garden. Their Hba1c levels are well below the diabetic range.

I think there is a very poor understanding of "balance" and that the occasional cake or steak is not going to kill you. And that living your life according to following a very strict regime which you have deemed healthy, often makes you tedious and irritating to be around.

I am guessing op puts milk in the porridge and in teas and coffees.

I find that when I eat "well" - lovely generous portions of healthy foods - I have no desire for cakes and biscuits, which for me is a wonderful thing as I am prone to bingeing.

Not true about the longest lived people.

If you look at the studies done on the ‘Blue Zones’ each and every one has a different diet. And only one is fully vegetarian.

The Greek Island folk eat the lambs, pigs, goats, chickens and rabbits they raise along with oily fish, olive oil, homegrown veg and red wine. They just use the meat sparingly and eat no processed meat.

The Seventh Day Adventists in California are vegetarian.

The Okinawans eat fish (it is an island) with their vegetables (especially sweet potatoes), soy/miso and rice. They also eat small amounts of meat.

The Sardinians eat lots of dairy especially goat and sheep milk and cheese, pasta (it is Italy after all!) fish and vegetables, meat on a Sunday/special occasions and a daily glass of red wine. Pork and lamb are favourites as they raise them and they eat the whole animal.

What they all do have in common is that they all focus on real unprocessed food (free from additives and chemicals) as well as community and fun, movement (not exercise) and meaningful work. They also found they only eat on average to 80% full. They also get outdoors a lot.

i doubt my relatives who lived past their hundred birthdays were vegan
i doubt there are many vegan octogenarians let alone nonagenarians or centenarians

I feel there are too many "rules" out there, so people like me just throw in the towel and eat what we FEEL is a reasonable diet.

My bloods are spot on with the exception of platelets, which has to do with an illness I had. Nothing to be concerned about though according to GP.

I am mid 60s now and live alone. Consequently most of the time I don't cook a full dinner or lunch either. However, what I do have is good stuff IMO, and even more importantly I like it!

Daily I have either Greek yogurt, fruit, milled chia/flax and protein powder, or Weetabix with the seeds and protein powder. Lunch is whatever I find in the fridge/cupboard, cheese, beans on toast, poached egg. I make my own wholemeal soda bread with added seeds. I use olive oil and real butter. Other stuff is omelettes, salmon, plaice, cod (all steamed) no spuds. I don't eat enough veg but it doesn't seem to have made that much of a difference so far. I don't eat much meat at all, but am not veggie.

Thankfully I don't have a sweet tooth, but enjoy the occasional dessert/pudding when out. I do eat a lot of yogurt, mostly Skyr variety. I am 5.5 and 10st7. That'll do me. I'm lucky not to have any joint/mobility problems either, so walking is easy for me and I do that a lot, but I'm not religious about it either!

I advise reading Ultra Processed People to understand about bread. Most supermarket bread is not healthy, even wholemeal.
Best to get bread that's just wholemeal flour, salt, water and yeast. Anything with emulsifiers, steer clear.
I don't think you're correct re fruit either. Berries are the best fruit to consume, the least sugar. But yes, fruit is still better than chocolate/cake etc as it has vitamins and fibre.
Now the thinking is 30 different plants per week, not 5 portions a day.
No-one needs 'extra' protein unless you're an elite athlete, but you should eat protein with things like oats so you don't get a sugar spike.

Agree re nuts - 30 g a day. I eat a lot of nuts!

Both my GMs lived into their late 80s (and a GGF well into his 90s) despite never having heard of chia or flaxseed, and ‘berries’ probably being limited to a few strawberries during the formerly very short UK season. As for nuts, even when I was a child they were largely limited to a treat at Christmas,

The trouble with a lot of modern diets is all the UPFs, and comparatively little cooking of basic, fresh ingredients from scratch.

Greece or Sardinia it is then!