To be upset that the police didn’t do anything? Dangerous dog

[Koulibiak]

I can’t sleep and can’t stop thinking about what happened and what could have happened.

I had just stepped out to walk my dogs (both small, placid dogs - one is a toy breed and the other a beagle mix) this afternoon. We crossed path with a woman pushing a bike with a front trolley thing. I assumed the trolley was for a child (the type you see in Amsterdam), I didn’t have time to see that there was something inside. Suddenly a dog jumped out of the trolley and attacked my dogs, one after the other. The dog was a female Labrador, she went straight for my dogs’ necks and on top of their backs. My dogs yelped in pain, started going in different directions and tripped me.

It all happened so fast, as I fell on the pavement I thought the Labrador was going to kill us all.

Eventually the woman got her dog back, I asked her to stay while I called the police. I got my dogs back inside the house, checked that neither of them was bleeding, they are both fine.

The police arrived, the woman turned on the water works and started sobbing. I said the dog was dangerously out of control, and at the very least the woman should receive a FPN for not having her dog on a lead.

The police were so dismissive - they said they wouldn’t issue a FPN because the woman had not realised the dog wasn’t tethered in the trolley, so she had no intention of breaking the law. I pointed out that intent is not part of the offence, but they said the poor woman had a flat tire on her bike, she was very distraught, she was going to have to walk 25 minutes home (like it’s a massive ordeal?) and they “didn’t want to make her day even worse with a FPN”. They said the dog is not an XL bully or Rottweiler, so it is not a dangerous dog (obviously that’s not true).

There were so many little aggressions in the way the constables spoke to me, I actually reminded them that I was the victim and she was the perpetrator. Like they implied that my dog was also out of control (absolutely untrue), or that they have discretion and can do whatever they want. Also that they now have my details on file, like I was a suspect.

Honestly it’s made me feel so sad for all the women who try and report assaults, the mix of dismissiveness and superiority and “we don’t owe you an explanation” and “I can see there’s nothing we can say that will placate you”. Just because I was asking them to enforce the law and protect the public. It was also obvious they didn’t understand the DDA at all.

I did ask the woman why her dog wasn’t muzzled and whether she was prepared to live with her conscience if her dog killed a child or another dog. She replied “absolutely”.

I just keep reliving the few seconds when the dog leapt out at my dogs and I fell on the pavement, not knowing where the dog was or how to protect myself or my dogs… it’s like a nightmare on repeat. 🙁

Dog wardens have incredibly limited powers - they are not going to be remotely interested in taking note of a dog-on-dog scuffle in which nobody was hurt (by the dogs) and in which no dogs were injured.

In an ideal world, maybe there would be some kind of database where these things are noted, but there isn't. As PP have tried to point out, dog-on-dog attacks are a civil matter - even in cases where dogs have been killed, nothing is actually done and the owner doesn't face any consequences.

Dog aggression is only (legally) an issue where humans are bitten. Someone tripping because they got caught up in their own dog leads won't even cross anyone's radar.

Whether that's morally right or not is a whole different issue, but the police (and the dog warden) can't act on morals, they have to follow the law, and they can't go round making notes about dog scuffles with no evidence of what happened.

@faerietales for some reason I can’t copy a small part of your post but I absolutely did not realise a dog can KILL someone else’s dog and there be no consequences! That’s TERRIBLE

@EineReiseDurchDieZeit it happened here last year - a pack of off-lead lurchers killed someone's dog (I think a shih-tzu or similar) and the dog warden didn't even attend. The poor woman had to carry her dead dog home covered in blood - it was absolutely horrendous.

Maybe other parts of the country are different (and I hope they are!) but I honestly have no faith in the police, dog warden or RSPCA to deal with any kind of dog or animal related issues anymore.

Very well said 👏🏻
I'm so sorry @Koulibiak it sounds awful and made even more awful by the very disappointing and insulting response of the police🤬👎🏻👎🏻👎🏻

Read my previous post. I said the OP should complain if she wishes to.
Like a lot of people on this thread though it doesn't look like it meets the threshold for out of control, and police don't deal with dog on dog attacks.

Yes, my friends small dog was killed by a labrador who just ran up to it on the beach and attacked it. No consequences.

It was just a scuffle or there would be injuries.

Just because a dog has been involved in an incident with another dog does not mean that any children are at risk.

Okay - what do you think the police should have done?

Bearing in mind the dog didn't bite OP or her dogs, and there are no witnesses or cameras to provide any evidence of what happened.

Should they just arrest the other owner based on OP's say-so?

Scuffle implies minor fight, ie two sided. The aggression in this case was entirely one sided, therefore it was an attack.

Give over.

Dog-on-dog aggression is a civil issue, not a legal one - and nobody is going to take the slightest bit of interest in three dogs who had a fight in which none of them sustained any injuries.

Should it have happened? No, of course not, but legally speaking this is a non-issue, sadly.

I wasn’t talking about the law. I’m just frustrated with so many people claiming that it’s not a big deal. I see too many owners of bigger dogs allowing them to terrorise smaller dogs. If their big dog was bowled over by a dog three times the size of them they’d have an issue, but since their dog is never going to encounter a dog with such a massive size advantage over them it’s not a problem for them.

We have a Staffy, he’s a big dope of a dog. He’s been attacked 3 times (by a greyhound, a Labrador and a Jack Russell) and just hides behinds us. Our next door neighbours have a Shitzu that’s really aggressive and tries to jump the wall to get to our dog yet our dog is the one that people are wary of 🤷‍♀️

I agree with you, it's shit.

But OP's post was all about the lack of police response and the reality is, there won't be one in a situation like this. No evidence, no witnesses and no injuries - there's nothing to be done, sadly.

Morally it's a whole different issue and dog owners really ought to be held accountable in situations like this. Hopefully the owner of the Labrador has learnt a valuable lesson.

I doubt the lab owner has learned anything sadly. We can but hope.

I wasn’t really responding to the OP, just the countless posters who were minimising the situation and implying that it was a two way encounter when it clearly wasn’t.

Raise a complaint against the police. Their action were unacceptable. You were the victim.

The breed might not be a dangerous breed but the individual dog is

The police will do absolutely nothing.

Raise a complaint AGAINST the police, not with the police

About what?

If two preschoolers, one of them disabled, are living with a dog that has almost killed a bigger than a preschooler dog while their mother keeps saying “he’s soft and anything” on repeat and that dog was off lead in a busy public area despite having only been “given” to the family a week earlier then the children are vulnerable by virtue of age, disability, and having a mother who can’t adequately assess risk. I had to carry my dog away from the scene with the help of a stranger and could look back several minutes later and still see the dog was dangerously out of control. There was no interaction between the 2 dogs before the incident - their dog came from behind and gripped my dog from underneath before we even knew he was there - it wasn’t an “incident”, it was a near fatal attack. I can assess risk and at no point did I claim any incident between 2 dogs automatically put children at risk but those children were at risk from that dog.

The most surprising thing about this story is that the police attended. We can't even get them to come for violent assaults or burglary

I've met a few aggressive labs recently, trying to attack my Spaniel. If these lazy arse entitled owners don't keep them under control they're also going to end up on the dangerous dogs list. I love all dogs but can't stand crappy owners!

The dog that did the attacking jumped out of the trolley and did not have a lead. The ones being attacked did, and it's usually that way round.