To be upset that the police didn’t do anything? Dangerous dog

[Koulibiak]

I can’t sleep and can’t stop thinking about what happened and what could have happened.

I had just stepped out to walk my dogs (both small, placid dogs - one is a toy breed and the other a beagle mix) this afternoon. We crossed path with a woman pushing a bike with a front trolley thing. I assumed the trolley was for a child (the type you see in Amsterdam), I didn’t have time to see that there was something inside. Suddenly a dog jumped out of the trolley and attacked my dogs, one after the other. The dog was a female Labrador, she went straight for my dogs’ necks and on top of their backs. My dogs yelped in pain, started going in different directions and tripped me.

It all happened so fast, as I fell on the pavement I thought the Labrador was going to kill us all.

Eventually the woman got her dog back, I asked her to stay while I called the police. I got my dogs back inside the house, checked that neither of them was bleeding, they are both fine.

The police arrived, the woman turned on the water works and started sobbing. I said the dog was dangerously out of control, and at the very least the woman should receive a FPN for not having her dog on a lead.

The police were so dismissive - they said they wouldn’t issue a FPN because the woman had not realised the dog wasn’t tethered in the trolley, so she had no intention of breaking the law. I pointed out that intent is not part of the offence, but they said the poor woman had a flat tire on her bike, she was very distraught, she was going to have to walk 25 minutes home (like it’s a massive ordeal?) and they “didn’t want to make her day even worse with a FPN”. They said the dog is not an XL bully or Rottweiler, so it is not a dangerous dog (obviously that’s not true).

There were so many little aggressions in the way the constables spoke to me, I actually reminded them that I was the victim and she was the perpetrator. Like they implied that my dog was also out of control (absolutely untrue), or that they have discretion and can do whatever they want. Also that they now have my details on file, like I was a suspect.

Honestly it’s made me feel so sad for all the women who try and report assaults, the mix of dismissiveness and superiority and “we don’t owe you an explanation” and “I can see there’s nothing we can say that will placate you”. Just because I was asking them to enforce the law and protect the public. It was also obvious they didn’t understand the DDA at all.

I did ask the woman why her dog wasn’t muzzled and whether she was prepared to live with her conscience if her dog killed a child or another dog. She replied “absolutely”.

I just keep reliving the few seconds when the dog leapt out at my dogs and I fell on the pavement, not knowing where the dog was or how to protect myself or my dogs… it’s like a nightmare on repeat. 🙁

It is when no injuries occurred. OP wasn't bitten. Her dogs weren't hurt. She tripped and fell when her own dogs tried to run in different directions and she got caught in their leads.

Of course it's unpleasant and scary, but legally it's a non-event.

My on lead (big) dog was attacked and seriously injured (requiring surgery) by a smallish off lead staffy cross. The other owner had a child about 4 and a toddler in a pushchair. I reported it to the police and dog warden and neither of them gaf despite the dog living with 2 pre schoolers. I reported it to social services in the end who also didn’t gaf.

The dog warden where we live is much more proactive and does deal with these type of issues.

I hope you are ok OP it must have been very frightening and shocking for you. If you feel you were treated unfairly by the police (they do sound very dismissive and the comment about her having a bad day would have made me very angry) I would make a complaint. They probably won’t take it very seriously but at least it is on file that they acted this way. I’m not sure who on earth is carrying a young fit lab around in a basket? Surely labs love a good long walk, it sounds like she is not a very good owner and had no control over her dog, training classes and a basic understanding of her breed would be very helpful to her.

You're very lucky - we have one warden covering the entire county. I don't believe they've ever come to our town unless with the RSPCA on a severe welfare case.

A Labrador having a disagreement with a small dog that results in not even a graze most certainly is a minor scuffle. The lab has clearly used no force.

Whatever it may be regarded as legally, a much larger and stronger dog deliberately attacking smaller dogs that could not physically defend themselves is not a minor scuffle. The fact that OP tripped over her own dogs leads is entirely the fault of the Labrador owner. OP was a responsible dog owner with her dogs on leads, her dogs trying to get away from danger is not the problem, the fact that they were in danger was the problem. No injuries requiring treatment does not mean her dogs weren’t hurt. What happened is completely unacceptable and should not be brushed off as a non-incident.

It did not “have a disagreement”. It deliberately attacked. If you are walking along the street and someone just walks up to you and punched you in the face would you feel that you’d “had a disagreement” with them?

Honestly, people make mistakes. Not every little mistake needs the police involved.

THAT IS HOW DOGS HAVE MINOR DISAGREEMENTS.

It wasn't an attack. That is very different.

I'm not saying I think it's acceptable - I'm just trying to explain why the police aren't interested and didn't take any action, and why a dog warden likely won't bother getting involved either.

Three dogs had a scuffle - whoever started it, nobody got hurt. The dogs aren't bleeding, they don't have bite marks and they didn't need veterinary treatment. OP tripped and fell as a consequence.

Yes, it's unpleasant. Yes, it's scary. Yes, it's not nice at all when things like this happen and it can leave you feeling very shaken, but none of that means the police should get involved, which is what the OP was asking about.

As I've said above, I work with dogs. If I was to ring the police every time an out of control dog ran over to me, or I saw dogs have a scuffle, I'd be on the phone to them several times a day. Dogs often communicate in ways that look very aggressive to us but that are just very normal to them.

Unless someone is bitten or a dog requires vet treatment, then it really just "one of those things", a bit like when a driver cuts you off and and you have to slam on your brakes, or you have a near miss on a tight corner. It can be really scary but unless there's an actual accident, nothing is going to come of it (legally).

@LameBorzoi This. The police probably shook their heads in disbelief on the way back to the station, that they had been called out for this incident.

Heaven knows what would have happened if the fog had been tethered in the bike basket!
I am surprised the police did nothing. A dog does not have to be a legally dangerous breed to be dangerous in practice. It is the offence of not keeping the dog under control that is pertinent rather than its breed. You were knocked over FGS!

She was not knocked over.

She tripped over her own dogs.

I dispair at the hysteria regarding dogs on here recently.

The police can't go around acting on someone's say-so, though. They need evidence. Unless there's CCTV footage, a witness, or evidence that OP or her dogs got badly bitten, what can the police actually be expected to do?

It was an attack. The dog jumped out of the trolley and very deliberately attacked the two smaller dogs. A disagreement implies some element of responsibility on both sides. The two smaller dogs were minding their own business and the larger dog attacked them. I own a dog, I know perfectly well what dogs having a disagreement looks like and this is not it. A disagreement would come from two dogs already interacting with one another and one doing something the other didn’t like (some unwanted bum sniffing perhaps) and the other snapping at them. The incident described by the OP is entirely one sided, there was no prior interaction, there was just immediate and unprovoked physical violence from a much bigger and stronger dog against two much smaller dogs. That is an attack.

She was tripped over by the actions of the bigger dog attacking her dogs. Stop trying to pretend it wasn’t the Labrador that made her trip.

From experience, the police only care about dog on human attacks.

There is an dog owner that goes to my local park who has an absolute beast of a dog. I don't know what breed it is, but it's back is higher than the owner's waist. It attacked another local dog (a lab) so badly the poor lab had to have his spine pinned back together (he is fine now though). It has also attacked other dogs. Had them by the neck.

He still goes to the park with his horse dog. Several owners have gone to the police but they just say it is a dog on dog thing.

No, that's not how it works. You are thinking like a human.

It shouldn’t be “one of those things” though. People should keep their dogs under control.

That post was way over dramatising the situation.

They should. But people make mistakes, and you need to give them a little leeway.

I mean, have you never in your life accidentally caused anyone a little inconvenience?

I don't disagree with you, honestly, I don't. My own dog has been attacked several times and it's awful.

But the police can only act within the law. An incident between three dogs that didn't result in anyone being bitten just isn't going to be taken seriously, especially with no witnesses or evidence to prove anything either way.

Would the incident be captured on a Ring Doorbell do you think?
I would be asking all the neighbours.