Feel this country has become rotten - benefits

[She11y]

A studio apartment in my area is about £800 per month.
A minim wage job is around £1500 per month net.
After you've worked in a hard and demanding job - most minimum wage jobs are demanding - you've got £700 to pay for food, travel, bills, clothes.
You might end up with £100 left over each month. Working hard all your life with no hope of owning your own home or having any sort of financial stability.
No wonder people don't want to work. Make owninf a house affordable and over night 1/3 the people claiming benefits will stop.

My point is that a lot of people are on benefits because they're depressed at the hopelessness of their futures, and try to avoid working.

The ferry contract was awarded to a Polish firm because Ferguson completely ballsed up the last contract they were given. Ferries over budget, late delivery, not fit for purpose. The most recent ferry they just built is now back in for repairs because they found a cracked hull (it has only just been delivered). It's cost Scottish taxpayers (& UK) extra millions.

And the SNP are the governing party in Scotland, not Labour. It was the SNP that agreed on the contract.

The Polish firm have built ferries in use by CalMac before.

Good grief. I don't think I even know where to start...

@ilovesootyat the beginning is always a good starting point

I'll begin by saying you know absolutely nothing about addiction.

Single people on minimum wage cant really expect to have their own single accommodation really though. Shared housing is usually the way with this and then if you imprive your earnings or live with a parter it becomes affordable. Two people on min wage is 3000 then which obviously goes further.

This is so true. Let’s be clear, benefits for low waged working people aren’t really a subsidy for them, they are a subsidy for employers enabling them to pay low wages. We need the work done by people on minimum wage, and not everyone will be able to do other jobs, nor would we want them to or the things they do won’t get done. So squeezing this group still harder is incredibly disrespectful and cruel. We shouldn’t need to subsidise people in a full time job, but we do, and then forget it’s not their fault the system works in this way.

@ilovesootyyh your right i don't,all I know is it's self inflicted where as a disability is not self inflicted,am I wrong? I'm guessing you know alot about it to get so defensive about,why should anyone with an addiction to drugs or alcohol be given extra money? so they have extra drugs and alcohol that's all they see it as

I think you’re doing a Trump on this - taking a hugely complex issue and making it seem very simple.

Housing being too expensive is a problem, but for those who have already joined the system of home ownership - either occupiers or landlords - can’t afford for house prices/rents to drop dramatically overnight. You could say so what - it needs to happen. But these people vote and it would take a very brave political party to attempt to get elected while alienating homeowners. So it needs to be a long term solution - saying slash rents is too simplistic and can’t happen overnight.

Benefits wise are there people who abuse the system? Who could work and choose not to? Yes. But stopping that is hugely complex. Lots of people who haven’t worked (in some cases their entire lives) wouldn’t be ready to start full time work overnight. Also once you have given benefits out taking them back or reducing them is cruel - people become reliant on that money. And again the politics of that is extremely problematic. It seems nice to give money to people who are struggling and that’s what voters like to hear. And successive governments have created a poverty trap - if you start working your benefits get cut so you’re not really any better off - so why bother. Also can’t take the money away and force people to work because again, that can’t happen overnight it needs long term thinking.

Unfortunately the nature of all governments is they’re only thinking at most 5 years ahead to the next election. So long term strategy is never achievable.

I think you're so ill informed it's not worth my while engaging in debate with you.

@ilovesootyi don't worry about been miss informed I can see it with my owns eyes,begging people for money when we probably have less money than they do,anyone who turns to drugs and alcohol it is all self inflicted by themselves or someone they got close to encouraging them to do it,bad experiences in life I get that but turning to drugs and alcohol isn't they way forward is it then expect other people to pay for there addictions while people thay are trying to earn a proper living can't coz we miss out coz of these scum bags

House prices are crazy and the social contract has gone for the youth. You are not wrong in that respect.

Agree also wage stagnation

System is broken. I had a look on another forum. Shocked to read that someone was quoted as 'lucky' and 'happy' because they qualified for PIP. They were morbidly obese and needed a mobility scooter. that is not a genuine disability it is self inflicted. Less money and they would eat less food.

Another was awarded a £20K PIP back payment and the person wanted to also claim interest. Unbelievable.

Society is levelling down. A disgrace.

socio economic factors do impact health though

@Secretmeetingswell said

What job do you do where you're financing people whose lives you disapprove of?

Do you actually know that this person is morbidly obese due to overeating?

Nothing else was mentioned.

I sympathise with lots of what you’re saying but if you’re about to go down the some people take medication etc excuses for obesity then let’s get real.

I’m sure there are other reasons for a small number of people but for the vast majority of people poor diet and overeating are the reasons they are obese. I don’t think we can solve a problem without at least being honest about the cause of it.

On NMW, take home pay is £1721 based on 37.5 hours of work per week.

So actually £221 per month more than you state.

All they want is a reaction, denying that is the most satisfying approach.

Well he would be a beggar on the streets most likely and may well end up dead at a young age. Is that what we should accept then ?

It's more complex than that. Some disabilities could be seen as self inflicted - someone eats and drinks too much, gets heart disease and has a stroke, someone does an extreme sport and fractures spine and ends up paralysed, smokes and gets COPD. Some addictions - such as heroin, can link to inappropriate pain relief prescriptions by drs following an injury - think the oxycodone crisis in US. A soldier gets PTSD following being in a war zone defending our country, can't get mental health support they need, so self medicates with drugs out if desperation.

It's not always so clear cut as 'unlucky' and 'self inflicted', there can be many complex factors at play. People need to be supported, whether that's with addictions or disabilities, to make positive change. If they refuse help after many attempts, that then becomes challenging, but help rather than punishment should always be first option.

I do take your point here. However there are medical conditions that make obesity more likely and poverty and poor diets tend to go hand in hand too.

Let's not lie to ourselves and each other here, there is literally no other way to pack on so much excess weight you're morbidly obese other than overeating. Overeating means eating more calories than your body burns off. People who are morbidly obese don't need to disclose to anyone they got there by overeating, everyone already knows by looking at them.

But minimum wage should cover all expenses, as you say. So it’s not minimum wage that has a lot to answer for - it’s still not high enough - it’s employers not paying more to experienced workers. Everything is way too much balanced to businesses making massive profits (and yes, I know this isn’t always true of small businesses).