Feel this country has become rotten - benefits

[She11y]

A studio apartment in my area is about £800 per month.
A minim wage job is around £1500 per month net.
After you've worked in a hard and demanding job - most minimum wage jobs are demanding - you've got £700 to pay for food, travel, bills, clothes.
You might end up with £100 left over each month. Working hard all your life with no hope of owning your own home or having any sort of financial stability.
No wonder people don't want to work. Make owninf a house affordable and over night 1/3 the people claiming benefits will stop.

My point is that a lot of people are on benefits because they're depressed at the hopelessness of their futures, and try to avoid working.

Not really. A lot of disabled people do not claim PIP. The whole process is stressful and some of us feel the risk to our mental heath is too much to even try. Some people earn good money and feel they should not apply, but they are still disabled.
We are still disabled though.

Both conditions are awful to live with. Do you think he has not tried all he can already?

You’re not very good at empathy are you?

30 years ago, plenty of people were struggling but the stigma was even worse than it is now. So a lot of people suffered in silence and poverty as they hid themselves away. Not wanting to admit the extent of their problems even to themselves because of the shame. I know this because there were people in my family living this sort of existence and every week there were stories about what scrape or injury they’d got that week.

I find it disgusting that some people think that it should still be that way.

I'm not familiar with his situation. But if you take the healthiest adult (or child for that matter) and put them to bed with no activity and make them browse/watch Netfix for months with no end they will end up depressed with severe MH issues. This lifestyle does not support mental health, it's vicious cycle.

Surely the next step will be different rates of National Insurance for employers based on what percentage of their payroll is going to employees who have documented additional needs for reasonable adjustments to help them be employed, with a weighting for how onerous to the employer those are. e.g. providing you with an extra bit of equipment as a one-off cost = low impact, high flexibility due to regular hospital appointments and regular episodes of being unable to work = high impact. Any employer who isn't doing their fair share of providing employment to people with additional needs has to pay more NI, and suddenly the autistic and awkward interviewee who can clearly do the job brilliantly but will struggle to integrate with the team socially looks a lot more attractive!

Oh good god, don’t be ridiculous……if you want to have a better lot than you have now, you’ll have to earn more!

Min wage should be enough to live on. It used to be. What changed?
The ability for some people to earn more has not changed.

If everyone just goes off to better paying jobs….who is doing the minimum wage ones?

In an ideal world being caring and sharing would be the solution BUT there are not sufficient resources to go round. Excessive, spurious benefit claims are rampant and this is impacting the lifestyle of everyone else.

We have also reached a place in society whereby people appear to be proud of their difficulties, imperfections and life mistakes. People think it is their right to expect others to fund them. We need to unlearn that thinking.

Previously people acted with dignity and pride. Family, neighbours helped when they could and those in more difficult situations appreciated it and showed gratitude.

This is what we have lost.

The young people entering the job market would be perfect

Not all young people will be able to progress.
What about older people who have been out of the job market? If the government are bumping people off benefits, then there will be a lot of older people looking for a first role.
So middle aged and young people after the same jobs.

Somebody on one of these threads suggested that people should qualify for PIP, as now, but the PIP payment should go to any employers they work for to help fund allowances the person might need. I thought that might be a good idea.

That's terrible. There's loads of things that people might need PIP for that have nothing to do with employment. By all means an extra payment to employers who employ people who get PIP but ffs the idea of diverting the PIP money to them is horrific!

WHat if you are not on PIP?

I have to admit I'm not very sympathetic to depression/anxiety. I've mentioned on one of these threads, I lived with someone for years who used mental health and suicide threats to manipulate, control, and make me do what they wanted. Maybe this is why a seem to lack sympathy.

Is OCD your disability?

That is sad to hear. I have also had that experience with some people. They have used it to get their own way.
But I really don't think people that are expressing how low and desperate they are feeling after hearing about the benefit cuts are doing it as manipulation. I am one of them, and we are scared.

Then you’ve been assessed as not needing them.

I have never been assessed. The whole process scares me. I am not alone in that.

Which is not surprising as there’s still a lack of clarity.
All new taxes and changes are stressful for those that will be affected

Appreciate that. But surely you can’t expect to receive something you haven’t applied for.

I havent and am not expecting anything. My care needs are met by my mum and boyfriend.
But the gov are now saying I have to have PIP to be declared not fit to work. I am not on PIP. I know people on PIP and they claim it so they are able to work. It makes no sense.

No.

My idea is better. Have it as a solution focused conversation like they do for disabled student allowance. Give the person the money to enable the support that has been identified to help them.

The next assessment asks how the money was used to support the person and in certain cases looks to identify steps of improvements. The money might get more or less depending on how things have changed. If someone has made no progress at all (in certain conditions) then it might lead to questions about how they are spending the pip to meet the expenses related to managing their disability, and potentially a reduction.

Example - my DC was in their room not getting up and dressed, not washing, not eating anything unless I brought it in. We used our pip for PA support twice a week and now DC goes bike riding, which has rekindled their interest in plants and animals, and they have been able to help our neighbour look after their cat when they went away. There are still lots of issues with personal hygiene, use of washing machine etc.

Next pip review we can show the efficacy of that money in helping DC, and show that there is lots still to go, but with the PA support the future is looking better and we may even move towards voluntary work or part time paid employment. This would mean the money continues or increases to support the PA's wages. In other words, they don't take money away automatically if you admit there has been progress.

If you have spent money but there's been no change - eg the PA hadn't helped at all - then you would try to work out what needs to be different (eg meds review, different support worker, different focus of support).

If we hadn't spent any money on the disability supports except to buy a new bed (because the other was worn out from DC being in it 24/7) and just say "no change" at review, the assessor could reduce the money as it's not being helpful if literally nothing has changed in their mental health condition.

Obviously this system wouldn't work for some conditions but I think it might for some of the more mental health ones.

I does make sense that you need to be declared unfit to work officially by some means.
Im sure you would agree with the logic there…..wouldn’t you?

Of course if you are completely funding yourself with nothing to you or others to care for you then of course no one can make you do anything.