Teachers who have watched 'Adolescence'- what are your thoughts?

[Fstt1978]

Had an interesting experience this week after watching this at the weekend

sanctioned 4 boys this week with a demerit each - for pushing and shoving in the corridor- swearing loudly and generally being gobby to me.
All 4 boys parents have written emails to say it's unfair/ I'm picking on them etc etc. As it was 4 of them- none of them can be singled out.
We also have a boy caught on CCTV physically assaulting a much younger student unprovoked - it is categorically an assault- with the victims parents pressing charges. He has been permanently excluded and his parents have instructed a solicitor to contest this.

What is going on with parenting boys? Girls sanctioned rarely have parents like this - this is NOT a goady thread- I am genuinely really interested , and open to discussion about it

A poll commissioned by the charity Hope not Hate in 2023 found that 80% of 16- and 17-year-old British boys had consumed content created by Andrew Tate, a well-known member of the manosphere. In contrast, only 60% of boys in the same age group had heard of the British Prime Minister. A poll by Internet Matters, also in 2023, found that 56% of young fathers (under the age of 35) approve of Andrew Tate.

Adolescents are drawn into this online world at a developmental period in which they are disproportionately concerned with their peers' opinion (Crone & Konijn, 2018). Furthermore, these boys are often about to experience the disappointment, embarrassment and rejection that almost inevitably accompany dating for the first time. The manosphere offers them a lens through which to understand these difficult experiences. It thus engages teenage boys with a deeply discriminatory world view at a point in development when they are likely to be particularly vulnerable to it.

Seventy-six percent of secondary school teachers and 60% of primary school teachers in the UK are extremely concerned about the ways in which online misogyny is influencing their pupils (Over, Bunce, Baggaley, & Zendle, 2024).

https://acamh.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/camh.12747

If you have children and didn't know about this, you need to learn. Fast.

As mentioned in Adolescence, radical influencers target users of online game content, fitness training, military interests, sport content etc, and draw them into conversations where they feel understood and 'validated'. From there they are led towards increasingly extreme discussions where negative feedback is immediately removed, which normalises the extremist ideology and creates a feeling of community.

Reading female teachers' stories of sexualised abuse by pupils and homework submitted with catchphrases like MMAS (make me a sandwich) scrawled all over it, I wondered why they didn't refer those students to Prevent. Now I guess the scale of the indoctrination means they'd be referring half their class!

I watched with 16 year old ds. He felt it was an accurate portrayal of a lot of schools, he recognised the attitudes. He is at a small independent day school, a small handful of boys in his year need excluding to be honest. One boy has been suspended 3 times in 12 months ffs! Mind you the bullying amongst the girls is vicious at times!

We used to hang out with the boys from the local private school. Good Lord the drugs and the wandering hands, they were a nightmare. The school is still in the top 20
in the U.K. as it was back then, but my god all those boys the absolute worst.

Private schools has its own issues. And of my siblings only one of us had one detention and we went without argument and we got a bollocking. Private schooling is not the answer, we need to look at what the deep rooted problems are within parenting and education and work on them.

Pressing charges is a colloquial term to mean the parents have raised a complaint to the police. Although now it’s technically not the correct term I’m pretty sure everyone knows what the poster means by this.

The main message I took away from Adolescence was that this could happen to a bright kid in a decent hardworking family anywhere.

Jamie was from a loving, imperfect, decent family doing their best. He had lots of books on his shelves. Dad got it wrong when he took Jamie to football “to toughen him up, but he was crap”. Mum probably got stuff wrong too, as we all do. But the main thing was that they had no idea what he was being exposed to in his online world when he shut himself away in his room.

Similarly, the school environment showed staff doing their level best but facing real challenges. Not the universal experience, but probably recognisable in all sorts of places around the country. Again despite best efforts on behalf ofthe children, those dedicated staff had no idea of the toxic undercurrents circulating on social media.

I took Adolescence not to be an attack on modern parenting or the state of our schools, but more a wake-up call. However well we think we are doing, we must all do better to understand the world our children are growing up in, especially those aspects of it which are alien to our own experience of adolescence.

I'm not a teacher, but my youngest is at a comp in a leafy suburb that is considered good and just got into the 'top 50 happiest schools in the UK'. My youngest runs with the rough kids (and is on Alternative Provision) whereas her older sister was top sets, excellent behaviour and attendance.

It's like they were at two different schools. Dd1's experience of school is nothing like Adolescence, whereas dd2's daily stories make my hair stand on end and make me want to send in a rescue party for the teachers.

Fighting, stabbing, sexual assault, police, social workers are all part of life for dd2's friends, and absolutely unheard of for dd1's friends. Dd2 seems to be surviving, though, and is liked and well supported by her teachers. She gets notably fewer punishments than her friends, despite very less than ideal behaviour, and I reckon it's down to three things.

First, she's not a bully (thank god). In fact, she takes a lot of pride in protecting kids from bullies. (I say this while touching wood, none of us can ever be certain our kids won't ever bully, given peer pressure.) Second, she has learned that going back and sincerely apologising to teachers goes a long way. And third, I make a point of backing the school - I never query their right to discipline my daughter, even if it seems a bit over the top (more commonly, it's under the top - they have the patience of saints). I'm an older mother and that's the old fashioned way!

Fstt1978

Its interesting that you believe that the parents of girls don't do this.

They do but maybe in not such large numbers.

I will also put forward that girls will also retaliate by putting basely claims in against teachers more often than boys but that is just my experience of schools.

Didn't the '#everyone's invited' movement (similar to #me too), start at london private schools?

I am a mum of a boy teen and his behaviour is significantly worse during term time as he copies other children's poor behaviour at home sometimes (and gets told off for it) and because he is stressed because of the absolutely appalling behaviour of not only some of the kids but also some (not all) of the teachers. In relation to some teachers it is mostly picking on other kids unnecessarily and being humiliating or cutting or inflicting a lot of small punishments all the time which is stressful and this doesn't directly involve DS but he finds it extremely depressing and demotivating and I spend a fair bit of time getting him back on track.

To try to answer your question I think more info is needed - the boys who you punished - are they normally okay, or normally very rude? Do they do badly at school work or do well? Has punishment ever, ever had a positive effect and are you aware that research indicates that punishment and demerits will not have a good effect and often will have a detrimental effect? Are you aware that a lot of teens bahaving badly are doing so out of fear because they can't do the work because they have fallen behind and no one is helping them? Does the school try to give positive talks a lot of the time, motivating children to do their best and treat each other well? Does the school give talks about healthy relationships, problems with too much screen use, etc? Does the school give talk sessions to parents about what parents can do to help children achieve what they want in the future? Does the school invest in wellbeing initiative for stressed teachers (especially the lovely ones!) The parents who complain - are they interested in their child's education? Do they see value in education? Do they model good behaviour themselves?

I have teenage boys. If they were gobby to a teacher, or swore at them, or assaulted someone, I’d go absolutely ballistic - at them.

The problem with boys now is that they naturally need discipline and structure, and that’s gone out the window. Every boy I know who is not thriving is because they have soft parenting.

Boys need very firm boundaries and to be kept very busy otherwise they just become destructive.

@Fstt1978

I work with teenagers years 10-13 in a difficult capacity. I am an academic and I do university out reach in areas that are traditionally considered deprived (I say traditionally because some areas where I do outreach are now very gentrified).

I have met around 1000 teenagers from ~15 schools. However I admit there is a huge of amount of sample bias. Most kids are keen engaged and well behaved.

However the behaviour of students from different schools was highly variable. I've seen one school where the children did not move a single muscle during my 90 minute presentation, not even to fidget or scratch their nose. It actually made me uncomfortable.

Ive also had kids throw the CRP dummy out of a three storey window onto students walking below. Their teacher behaved very appropriately, he took control of the situation immediately and sanctioned all 3 teenagers.

Over the years I have actually seen the behaviour in these sessions improve significantly, and also outreach sessions getting larger and larger.

I think compared to my school days, behaviour in general across most schools is better. Having said this its highly school/academy chain dependent. There are still definitely schools where bad behaviour is the norm.

As to parents, I don't have contact with them directly, but I have noticed a generally increase in violence against NHS staff and not by patients who are drunk/on drugs. I feel there has been a huge surge of anxiety and anger since COVID. People are less good at regulating their own emotions because they are under a lot of emotional and financial pressure all the time. I think our mental health and cohesiveness as a society as taken a nosedive. This is probably whats being reflected in the parents of those boys you mentioned.

I did question whether a boy from such a loving relationship (asin the drama), would be such easy prey for the 'manosphere', but i don't know how the stats play out

My DC1 goes to a very strict state school. It's actually notorious and often when I mention the school to another parent it's met with "Oh God I've heard it's so strict" - like it's a bad thing.

I think most children benefit from rules, regulations, sanctions and rewards, but sadly I seem to be in the minority these days.

Weird, I hadn't realised until I read your post that I just assumed that they were whacking a video on for that particular day. Knowing the police were going to be on site and teachers/pupils maybe having to duck out and be spoken to.

I've no idea if that was the writers' intention though!

Ashley Walters and his colleague slagging the videos off sort of made me think, 'Well, it's only because you're here and it's not exactly going to be a normal day...'

It’s very similar to where I work. Kids get their phones confiscated and their parents are in reception shouting at the receptionist that they want it back.

Their kids get caught bunking off in school and the parents tell them they don’t have to go to the detention.

One student falsely accused a teacher of assault because he asked her to do something. Won’t say exactly what but it was a reasonable request. She lied and her mum went fucking mental. The school showed the mum the cctv to prove the teacher was innocent. The mum still called the police. She backed her child even after it was proved to be a lie.

Honestly, in my experience look at the parents and you’ll see the reason why the kids are the way they are.

Yes from what I understand the misogyny and rape-culture in male-only private schools is horrendous and they’re aren’t dealing with it. It doean’tt surprise me, having seen it first hand. Shame it hasn’t changed in all these years though.

Tell the parents to fuck off. This is a big part of the problem. Feckless parents pandered to by weak schools and kids who feel invincible with no discipline.

That's not my experience although i appreciate i may be in the minority

I've not seen it (so carefully trying to circumnavigate spoilers) but intend watching it with DH and 14yo ds.

I should think that the inner city comprehensive experience is a world away from the experience of those attending and teaching at grammar schools, private schools, faith schools and more rural/ suburban schools.

I've always been perturbed that working hard, being studious or ambitious is almost viewed as an antithesis for many teenage boys, who are often tripping over themselves to compete with their peers over who can be silliest/ laziest/ stupidest/ most easily influenced etc. And i include my own ds in that who otherwise has a high functioning moral compass, good sense and intelligence.

I've lost count of the number of times I've uttered to dh "I just wish he'd make better friendship choices". It does also seem as though our expected standards of behaviour, taking personal responsibility etc are not the same as the parents of many of his friends. But looking back, I don't think it was much different back in the 90s, when I was a teenager (in an inner city comp). I used to hate being around the boys in my classes during the early secondary years (before we got streamed). I can still name the problem individuals now - and even the nicer boys had a tendency to get swept along with their stupidity. It was hideous.

I don't get a real sense from ds about what his school life is like, he doesn't really talk about school much (he's smart, but doesn't really enjoy it as such and has just been diagnosed with adhd). I'm looking forward to Adolescence stimulating discussion with him.

That’s because she’s only taught at private schools. I’ve taught in different types of school and yes, it was a very accurate portrayal of some of them!

Yes, i was surprised posters were inferring it was a state school problem

I once had a very, very loud and angry mother tear into me (I was in an contract admin role at the time) as her daughter had been suspended for setting alight another girls hair, she screamed that her daughter went to church every Sunday, that girls didn't do such things; and that the school had made the whole thing up because we were racists (despite it being a multicultural London school).

I think parents today are quick to get on the defensive (perhaps a guilt reaction to their ineffective parenting). We also live in a simplistic label driven society today, where people often play cards - expecting deplorable behaviour to be excused because of mental health issues or an alphabet disease. Or if you try to reprimand someone you are labelled racist, homophobic, sexist, whatever 'gist' they can use...

It's easy to see why the police don't want to get involved.

It's just age old snobbery. Sure, private schools look better on the surface...underneath it's just a different kind of rotten, a less reactive one, one that knows how to wear The Right Kind of Face.

I don’t think it makes a difference boys versus girls. I’ve been a teacher for 10 years - equal numbers of little shits on both sides. Some of the girls were truly terrifying.

Having consequences for their actions, ie, missing prom, is against their Human Rights, didn’t you know?

Will these parents be phoning DC’s boss when they have a bad appraisal for not meeting targets and not arriving at work on time?