Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think never again can Americans badge themselves as the good guys

155 replies

Decisionsdecisions1 · 19/03/2025 08:55

The millions who voted for Trump will go down in history akin to those who thought Adolf was a great guy.

Those sanctimonious bible belt so called Christians, full of values and morals supposedly, have blood on their hands.
If there is a God, and if there is a Judgement Day, they won't be going anywhere good.

I don't care if they see the error of their ways in decades to come. They didn't just vote for someone who put America First. They voted for someone who put dictators around the world first (and an unelected lunatic in the cabinet).
They have acted to the detriment of the safety and wellbeing of millions. They will not be forgiven.

OP posts:
TempestTost · 21/03/2025 10:07

CovenOfCheeses · 21/03/2025 07:55

All research points to the opposite. Labour is not fungible (jobs are not fixed and grow and contract with the economy). With a vibrant economy and more workers jobs are created in a virtuous circle. Workers shop, they create more jobs for shop workers, the supply chains, they buy cars, eat out, buy food. This all co tributes to the economy and creates more jobs.

Some studies have shown that tThere is a negligible effect on wage suppression on new arrivals but this impact is very small and mostly impacts other new arrivals.

The left wing parties are struggling in some countries because of the effects of capitalism and the fact that they cannot address some structural issues of globalisation. Also populist parties also have simple slogans and also appeal to tribalism by blaming all the issues on foreigners. This is simplistic and ensures that a simple solution to a complex problem is easily digested. But as we can see in Trump’s America, simple solutions cause chaos and inhumanity when implemented. They also disproportionately impact and hurt the people who were all for the policies.

No, all "research" does not point to that.

For goodness sakes, after years of denial, since the advent of free market neoliberalism, this has been the claim, that adding more and more low end workers has no effect, and it's bizarre now to hear the supposed left pushing it. Even the IMF has now allowed that wages are affected in this way, and while the degree to which that's the case varies, that's not something that can be hand-waved away. It's also allowed governments to neglect education and skills development among their own population.

Similarly, these organizations are now admitting that whether an immigrant adds more to the economy over his or her lifetime depends on what kind labour they are doing. Which shouldn't be a surprise, it reflects the nature of jobs within the country generally.

The fact that adding, say, 500.000 new people to a population requires that many new homes and new doctor's placements is obvious, unless you are ok with not giving newcomers adequate housing and medical care. Not only is that an up-front cost, it's not easy to simply increase housing stock or health infrastructure, it takes time. In Canada, the national bank recently, and in a shocking reversal of the neoliberal narrative, warned that large amounts of immigration were causing increasing inequality and destabilization in housing, and masking a weak economy.

None of this means immigrants are bad people, or there should be no movement, or anything like that. It does suggest that the experiences of low wage workers, and the people on the low end of the housing market, were not just racist figments of their imaginations as the capitalist right claimed, and the middle class, bourgeoisie left are now so keen to insist on.

As long as the left is insisting on that narrative they are not going to win the trust of the working classes. They can claim to be righteous leftists all they want, but if they talk like neoliberal global capitalists, and act like them, a few social programs and "be kind" rhetoric aren't going to convince anyone otherwise.

scorpiogirly · 21/03/2025 10:11

At least he isn't funding studies on transgender mice like pervy Biden.

Jonny234 · 21/03/2025 10:17

I think perhaps the most interesting point to consider is the following.

Has there ever been a country in the last century or so captured by an extremist ideology whether Communism, Marxism, Fascism etc (and globally there must be scores of examples) where upon taking office the dictatorial leader:

  1. Made big efforts to shrink the size of government in terms of money spent.
  2. Made big efforts to reduce the existing overreach of Govt.

Whatever side you are on it is undeniable Trump does not fit any historical context as a dictator with an extremist ideology.

Personally, and I know many may disagree but if I had to analogise him to past US presidents in living memory I'd say he's very much a Reaganite.

StandFirm · 21/03/2025 10:31

Jonny234 · 21/03/2025 10:17

I think perhaps the most interesting point to consider is the following.

Has there ever been a country in the last century or so captured by an extremist ideology whether Communism, Marxism, Fascism etc (and globally there must be scores of examples) where upon taking office the dictatorial leader:

  1. Made big efforts to shrink the size of government in terms of money spent.
  2. Made big efforts to reduce the existing overreach of Govt.

Whatever side you are on it is undeniable Trump does not fit any historical context as a dictator with an extremist ideology.

Personally, and I know many may disagree but if I had to analogise him to past US presidents in living memory I'd say he's very much a Reaganite.

I would argue that the sledgehammer being wielded against governmental agencies and various departments (like the Department of Education) is in fact very much in the authoritarian playbook. Trump is about consolidating powers into his hands. Moreover, the policies are arbitrary, do nothing to make services more efficient - they're just destructive- and pretty systematically target the most vulnerable in US society. I'm not saying Reagan was a saint but he probably is spinning in his grave right now. And he actually won the Cold War whereas Trump is working in Russia's interests, which is utterly at odds with public American opinion.

The latest consequence of this ludicrous ongoing shitshow:
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2025/mar/21/anti-trafficking-race-lgbt-immigration-demographics

^^vulnerable minors will suffer the consequences.

‘People will die’: alarm after US orders removal of identity references from anti-trafficking efforts

Agencies and organizations are complying with the directive to not lose funding, but are concerned vulnerable groups will suffer

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2025/mar/21/anti-trafficking-race-lgbt-immigration-demographics

Brinny · 24/03/2025 01:24

TooBigForMyBoots · 20/03/2025 09:32

I'm grand not having a repeat sex offender and rapist in charge, thanks.

You really are a Trump supporter , God forbid we never ever have anyone like that , Suspect you were a Brexitee as well ,

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Swipe left for the next trending thread