No help from grandmother

[NurtureGrow]

Sorry a bit long

My mum has come to stay for several days, as my husband has been away. We have a 4.5 month old baby. She last visited 2.5 months ago.

The first days I cooked lunch (for her dietary requirements) saw other relatives with her / took her and our baby to a museum, paid for lunch / have promised to go for lunch with her, our baby, my husband tomorrow.

Today I said we could go to a park, but if ok, I would really appreciate some help, if she could spend some time watching/playing with our baby etc. I very much need to clean, particularly the kitchen. She agreed. I’ve also told her I’ve been up very late recently batch cooking for the freezer to try to save money and other house tasks.. so she knows how busy its been with a baby.

It didn’t work well.. as our baby was crying and rather than comforting or distracting, she would just tell him to ‘sheesh’ ie be quiet.. and the baby got very upset. I had to keep coming in which was fine. Eventually I took him back, fed him and he fell asleep on me. Due to how upset he has been with teething, I let him sleep where he was. My mum was nowhere to be seen and I didn’t have my phone and couldn’t move. Two hours past. I presumed she must be cleaning the kitchen. When our baby finally woke up, I found she had just been sat in the dining room, not doing anything. The place was exactly as messy as before. She said she didn’t know what to clean.

I was upset.. not so much about the cleaning, but that she doesn’t offer to help clean, cook, she is not nurturing of me as her daughter at all. I try to do nice things for her, but it’s not reciprocated.

I decided to bring it up. She said it’s like this for everyone, and that my grandparents never helped her.. but this is absolutely not true. From 6 months I lived with them and she collected me on the weekend or sometimes every other weekend. My dad wasn’t well and they agreed this. My grandparents fed me, took me to school, potty trained me, taught me to ride a bike.

I said to her, no one helps my dh and I. (My husband’s family are out of the country.) We don’t even have an hour or 2 help. She insists it’s normal to not have help. And everyone ‘just has to get on with it.’ She is nice on a surface level, but emotionally she doesn’t seem to have nurturing in her. I feel I deserve a bit of help like everyone and there is something wrong with society that we seem to have forgotten we all need this. My grandparents unfortunately aren’t here anymore. She’ll go tomorrow and that was my opportunity for a bit of help, gone.

YABU - she is right and we should just ‘get on with it’ without help.

YANBU - to deserve support and help for a few hours.

I'm so glad you found my post helpful 😀

Yes, I also had that. I'd kiss my children or throw them up in the air for a mess around and then I'd catch my MIL kind of glaring/frowning at me. And it gave me the most uncomfortable feeling. It's hard to explain.

Also, if I ever text her with something 'warm' like 'we had a lovely day with you today, really nice to see you' I'll get a response like 'bin day has changed - it's Friday this week.' (I'm not joking ) and it'd leave me feeling hurt and like I was too emotional/gushy. But I wasn't and I aren't. I'm just a warm tactile person that's comfortable with intimacy. And for me this is what it boils down to- and I wonder if it's the same with your mother - my MIL is emotionally stunted and is NOT comfortable with intimacy , and I believe it makes her feel jealous, resentful and uncomfortable to see me so relaxed and 'free' with my children. So in turn, why on earth should they help you, the person that has it all (in their eyes) and because they can't express themselves it further sets their internal temperature to boiling.

It's not you. It's them. Keep doing what you're doing. Although we expect women, especially older ones, especially mums or mother figures to be warm and caring and helpful and nurturing, some just don't have that. It's atypical and disappointing, but they literally can't do it.

The problem isn't you. But you must lower your expectations and accept it kind of is what it is. If you keep trying to extract something that just can't be extracted, you'll only make yourself resentful and miserable x

@SnoopysHoose I did.. I mean it’s the strangest thing to say. She couldn’t have had more help!

I know it may sound strange I expected help, but I thought just an hour or two would be possible. As someone mentioned, even a house guest would do this.

Given how she left you with your grandparents when you were tiny, I think your expectations of her at this time were overly ambitious. She clearly has no idea what looking after young baby is like and therefore can muster no empathy at all.
I’m so sorry you feel so disappointed and let down, but at least now you know who/what you’re dealing with.

Are you able to employ a cleaner for a couple of hours a week for a few months until you get into your stride? I know that will add financial pressure, but may be just what you need.

My mum is the same has never had any interest in her grandchildren. However she was the most amazing mum to me and my siblings but she's been there done that with no help so same for me. She has become quite selfish since retiring she doesn't do much for anyone really as she put her life on hold for 20 years, whilst bringing us up.

Everything is all about her now she rarely thinks about anybody else. I thought because she was the most amazing mum she would be the same as a grandmother but it actually went the other way!

She’s got a right to not help, and you’ve got a right to say no visits unless you do. Personally I can’t imagine I’d have the bandwidth to entertain a house guest under those conditions with such a young baby. It’s basically giving you more stuff to do. Sod that.

I’d tell her if she’s not going to help then she can’t visit as it’s only adding more to your load having to also look after a useless guest.

There are a million ways to be a woman, expecting all women to be nurturing earth mothers is unrealistic and is just another way of pandering to a patriarchal stereotype of gender expectations.

Sometimes you have to accept people for who they are. We can change ourselves, not others, and trying to do so is futile.

You're so right.

It's like how it's often women in Africa who perform FGM. Instead of saying. This awful thing happened to me it needs to stop. They actually put their own daughters through it, in a well, I went through the pain, so should they kind of way.

I had a difficult childhood, I didn't want the same for mine. I'm not sure why trauma or pain should be passed on. Surely its enough that one person has lived it?

Sad that the OPs mother is a taker not a giver, but lots of people are inherently selfish and if they're miserable, everyone else must be too.

But it does sound like grandmother is actively making more work for OP in this case. Expecting someone not to deliberately make your life harder is a far cry from demanding they become nurturers.

Right? Absolutely!

I think it boils down to introspection and emotional intelligence.

The less introspective someone is, the less emotionally aware, the more likely they'll just passively pass on the trauma / fucked-up-ness. Counselling and reflection etc just don't even enter the heads of many older people. Many of them aren't even aware how problematic their thought process is.

@thepariscrimefiles I do keep an eye on her but don't do a tenth of what she woukd like me to do. Luckily she's always been very money focused so has enough for a cleaner and carers, should she need them later. She's still at the very early stages of Dementia

I had 6 month old twins and a touch of PND - my Mum came to "help". She spent her time reading and watching TV - twins sleep well so she offered to babysit whilst dh and I went out to dinner - she asked what I was making for her dinner before we went out - I saw no point in going anywhere. It would always be about her and what we were going to do for her - and she'd tell everyone when she got home how much she helped - she did it with all my sisters, stayed for a couple of weeks to help but actually sat on her arse reading and expecting to be wined and dined and treated like a guest.
We were glad when she left, in a funny way I did feel better because things could have been worse - they were when my mother came to "help" and I had to look after her too!
Your mother has told you who she is - listen to her. She has been and will always be like this. Lower your expectations - you will be happier not expecting help from her and the feeling let down.

@NurtureGrow I wouldnt bother inviting her to yours again. she doesnt seem to want to be a granny never mind a mum. how clean is her house? does she keep on top of that? she wants you to look after her, not the other way round.

She really, really doesn't have to.....

Why do you have her to stay?

You are right. She doesn't have to. It makes her a shit grandmother as well as a shit mother who gave OP to her grandparents for them to look after her when she was a small child.

OP's mistake is expecting anything different from this selfish, uncaring woman. She would be better off not having a relationship with her.

These posts appear regularly and pretty much every time it turns out that the grandparents not offering help weren't great parents either. I am sorry op but she isn't going to be the parent or grandparent you hoped and you are going to have to do this just you and DH.

I know how hard that is because it was the same for me but 9 years on I am so proud that DH and I did it without help and life is much much easier now that DS is older and we both get plenty of time to ourselves etc.

All you can do is break the cycle and focus on being amazing parents now and amazing grandparents in the future.

YANBU at all! I went to visit a friend with a newborn recently and I took lunch for us both, snacks for her for later, played with the baby while she went to the loo, did the washing up and unloaded the dishwasher, and even watched the baby for 20 mins while she went out to do the school run for her eldest. Baby did start crying but she’d already had a feed and a nappy change, so I just took her out of the bouncer, gave her a cuddle, sang to her and took her for a walk around the house to show her things - did the job until mum got home. This is just for a friend, so I’d be doing a lot more for a sister or daughter!

Before you had kids, what did you do to support her with her household tasks?

Was there give and take?

Indeed. Whose idea was her coming to stay, OP?

If it was yours, don't offer such an invitation again because it's just more work for you. If she asks in future, tell her - "Sorry, no, I can't cope with hosting a guest who doesn't help".

I would say it’s pretty rare to have support from your parents, when it comes to grandkids or cooking/cleaning etc.

If you moved closer to DH’s parents, would they be supportive?

But I think her level of usual support is irrelevant in this situation because surely if you are staying in someone else’s home, you automatically ask if there’s anything you can do to help.

I think you need to be very specific with what you need help with.

My friend has just had a baby and there’s no way I would just go and start cleaning but I do offer to hold the baby.

If I was you I would feed and change baby and then give them to your mum to hold, whilst you go and do other bits.

If shes sat in the kitchen, ask her if she’d mind doing the dishes or sticking the kettle on.

She may just be crap or she may not want to take over in your home.
The fact that your grandparents looked after you suggests she’s just a bit crap.

Stop expecting her to be a decent person or have any interest in anyone other than herself. It's only hurting yourself when you hope she'll change who she fundamentally is.

She chose to fail as a mother.
Can you seek therapy for childhood trauma and the damage this woman has caused?
I have accepted that I will never have the mother I deserved and that I don't love or even like the woman, and that's ok. It was a long road to get here.

See the thread titled 'But we took you to stately homes!' for adult children of toxic parents

Well, OP shouldn't be expected to wait on her mum when she's visiting. It's not patriarchal to expect a family member to help out when they're around. When my father visited I told him to play with the kids while I cooked/cleaned. My brother the same. Perfectly normal regardless of sex.

@arcticpandas of course anyone of any sex can muck in. There's not as much expectation on men though. They're not described as being shit and failing grandparents if they sit on their backsides and expect a new mother to bring them a cup of tea. All sexes can be selfish. Sounds like OP's mother was dealing with a sick husband when OP's grandparents stepped up during her childhood. If her dad had been well, perhaps OP would have been raised differently. We all play the cards we're dealt. Wishing someone would magically change into exactly what you want will always lead to disappointment.

Maybe one day OP's son or daughter in law will be lamenting how terrible she is if this site still exists in 30 years?

My god re the bin day @Halloumiheaven so sorry and I completely understand.. and the part below:

And for me this is what it boils down to- and I wonder if it's the same with your mother - my MIL is emotionally stunted and is NOT comfortable with intimacy , and I believe it makes her feel jealous, resentful and uncomfortable to see me so relaxed and 'free' with my children. So in turn, why on earth should they help you, the person that has it all (in their eyes) and because they can't express themselves it further sets their internal temperature to boiling.

I think this is exactly what it is.

It reminds me of when my mum got divorced from my step-father. After she made the decision, myself mainly, but also some other relatives were very involved to help her. He had been hostile and horrible for decades. When she was finally divorced and moved out, for some reason she asked or allowed my step-father to come to her new house (quite a long drive) when she moved her things with a removal company. They went in one car and I drove behind. When he left, I watched his car go to the end of the road, turn and breathed a sigh of relief. I stood there for a moment taking it in. When I came in and shut the door behind me, she said: ‘I wonder what day recycling is?’ And I said ‘can we take a moment to acknowledge you are here and what has just happened??’ She is not connected to her emotions at all.

Wishing you the best x