To think it is naive to assume Russian troll farms don’t target massive high traffic discussion forums like Mumsnet to post misinformation

[ThePeppyMoose]

Given the recent types of posts…

It’s not the so called bots that is killing this site, it’s the constant accusation by posters that anyone who has a different view to them is a bot.

Have an issue with labour? “You’re obviously a tori bot.”

Vote for Trump? “You’re obviously a Russian bot.”
Disagree with what Zelensky is doing wrt Ukraine? “Clearly you’re a Russian bot.”

The fact is that there may well be bots out there, but there are also people who don’t share the same opinions as you, and the constant accusation of “bot” is tedious.

If you think they’re a bot then report them but don’t respond. The more you respond, the more the thread goes off on the wrong tangent, and then it is you who made that happen, not a bot.

Loads

And they're really sophisticated too

Basically they say 'oh what about this thing I saw somewhere else about what Zelenskyy did before'

Making out they're NOT trying to drop a lie/bomb

I thought this post from @MrsBennetsPoorNerves in response to a post from one of the moderators (re users making "bot" accusations on a thread yesterday, put it very well:

"[Becky] do you think perhaps the time has come for MNHQ to review its talk guidelines?

I understand your point that people should challenge posts with arguments rather than so-called troll hunting, but it isn't always possible to disprove the spurious claims that are often made on here because they're just made up nonsense. And in this day and age, when we know that hostile foreign states are actively seeking to influence the political debate in our own country by deliberately spreading disinformation via social media, I am not sure that it is helpful for MN to just carry on zapping posters who cast doubt on a poster's motivations. Isn't it better to at least raise awareness amongst all MNers of the possibility that hostile foreign actors may be at work, so that people can maintain that critical awareness?

If you are not willing to allow posters to call others out when they suspect that hostile foreign actors may be at play, can you outline exactly what steps MN has taken to guarantee that such actors cannot possibly be active on MN? Or do you not actually agree that we should be taking all possible steps to minimise the influence that hostile foreign states might have on political debate in the UK?
We have a curious situation on MN at present in which highly offensive content is frequently left to stand and deliberate disinformation is rampant, and yet posts which dare to suggest that posters may not be exactly what they are purporting to be get zapped because they are "against Talk Guidelines".

I would respectfully suggest that it is time for MN to tear up the old Talk Guidelines and draft some new ones that properly address the very real threats facing us in today's world."

If Mumsnet can't/won't censor disinformation, it shouldn't censor attemps to call it out (even if misguided, or sometimes tedious).

On mumsnet? How

Just stop OP
Misinformation = clamp down on free speech

They don't

So why are you saying this about this war only? There are plenty of posts with different views on the Israeli/Palestine conflict. Do you call one side a bot?

Yeah, you do seem to get some posters who suddently seem to pop up in a rash telling us how terrible the government is, or how England has gone to the dogs etc etc. These can be genuine posts as well of course, there are definitely grounds to criticise the government or the state of the country but when you see a bunch of very generic-seeming posts in quick succession, you do think 'Hmmm, seems like someone's trying to push a line'.

This.

And sadly the most otherwise sane people don’t recognise this is the case.

Probably because of Russia's long-known, ongoing and extensive use of bots to push propaganda of social media.

@OneLemonDog this happens with every single side in conflict. Naive to think otherwise

What makes someone a troll rather than someone who has an opinion you don't like or agree with? How can you tell?

This! Tedious to see posts spout obvious nonsense that will be left to stand.

But nobody else does it close to as much as Russia do (online, in general) and the volume of easily-debunkable, pro-Russia propaganda on here has been particularly noteworthy, obvious and alarming.

Yeah tons of bollocks on here by them. I enjoy others taking the piss out of them though as it is funny, even though none of it is real. If it gets saturated I won't be sticking around. We wouldnt walk into a room full of weirdos saying these things and stay, so why would we stay here?

How odd, I (and others) must be mass hallucinating all the deletions.

I've suspected stuff was written by bots but not necessarily knowing what nationality.
Could people give general examples of the topics and language they use, and any pointers to help identify such posts?

I asked them to move posts about children with disabilities to the SEN boards so the OP could get some decent advice, rather than weirdos being arseholes to disabled kids, but they wouldn't move it. Someone was calling a 7 year old SEN child a sex offender and some very strange over invested people were posting, but that was fine for MNHQ to keep up.

That would just help them switch things up - for a while anyway.

Can I just ask what a ‘bot’ is? Literally speaking? Is it an AI program that generates posts on forums, or is it a person who is paid to deliberately spread misinformation / enflame culture wars etc?

Well, I’m a bit merry after a bottle if plonk with tea (not a regular occurrence)and I’m in bed now about to go sleep - but always like a quick flick here first though….

Regarding this, I’m quite gullible and mostly believe everything- even though I’m aware it might not be true. Today however, I seen an AI generated clip of Zelensky punching Trump and obviously it isn’t real but it looks pretty real so for some that haven’t seen the original carry on, they could believe that actually happened and of ciudad that’s bullshit.

There absolutely is so much bull shit out there and nothing surprises me anymore.

@OneLemonDog I personally find propaganda an interesting word used by all sides in every conflict. I take every piece of news from east and west with a massive pinch of salt. Yes Russia have massive propaganda, as do Israel, as do Hamas as do the USA. There is a self serving interest on all sides. I'm sure there are bots out there but bots exist everywhere. I just find it being used now as a dismissive argument for anyone who doesn't agree with someone. This is coming from someone that doesn't watch any news anymore purely for this reason.

There has been some weird pro Elon/Trump posts on here. Gushing a lot over them like they've just found the cure for cancer and made the OP a millionaire. They are very obvious.

Both (the AI ones are obviously a bit newer).