To think free bus passes for the old should be abolished?

[Bumpitybumper]

Statistics show that on average wealth peaks at age 65-74 in the UK, why then do we give these people free bus passes? It makes absolutely no sense at all and is just an unnecessary expense. The idea that 'young' pensioners are a relatively poor group of people is completely incorrect and it only serves to enhance the already massive intergenerational wealth gap between baby boomers and everyone else.

My husband has never applied for a bus pass as he can still drive. I don't know any over 65s with cars whose first thought once they reached 65 was oh great now I can apply for a bus pass.

The quality and convenience of the service probably has a lot to do with this though.

DH and I (both in our 60s) are recently back from a week in London where we, obviously,used public transport all the time. Honestly, if I lived in or close to London I would be tempted to not bother owning a car.

But back home I would almost never bother with the bus, even though there is a bus stop within about two minutes walk from my door. The service is so infrequent and unreliable I would rather walk or take the car. If I want to go in to Manchester I would take the train because driving and parking there is a nightmare these days.

However, I don't think the decision not to use buses is anything to do with wealth. Not much anyway.

65-74 year olds are factually the wealthiest group in this country. Why would you pretend that they all have ice on their windows and no food? This just isn't the case anymore. Single adults under the age of 60 are most likely to live in non decent housing. Where is your empathy for these people? Why do they have to subsidise the richer older people?

I think if you are just on state pension or/and pension credit you should be eligible to apply for one. I don't think all should get it. It should be means tested. Why should someone getting state pension plus private pension of say £3000 a month get a free bus pass.

While I generally give a sympathetic ear to proposals to reduce generational inequality, not convinced about this one. Means testing is expensive, society as a whole benefits from the bus subsidy and also it's a good incentive for people who don't need to travel in the rush hour to avoid doing so. YABU.

But then you have someone who is pennies over the limit

And do we really want people on the roads whose memory, eye sight, etc is slowly going?

I also imagine if you means tested it, many would qualify under the disability route (severe walking difficulties or be refused a driving license for medical reasons other than drug or alcohol abuse)

And isn't it an incentive for people to give up driving who probably shouldn't?

I like the free bus passes, if it helps people get out and about which probably in the scheme of things saves money elsewhere on health and social care, it certainly gets my mum out helping to support our local high street on a daily basis whereas otherwise she would stay at home.

I do think it should be extended actually to include younger people- 16-21's say.

What a crappy little thread.

The majority of pensioners who use their bus passes are not "wealthy"
Those who can afford to continue using their cars do so until they are too unsafe, by which point they have usually become debilitated.

Access to travel allows poorer pensioners to use transport rather than having to drag their shopping up hill and down dale.

It also enables them to socialise in order to stave off isolation and loneliness.

Some of the poor fuckers have even taken to riding the bus to keep warm in the pits of winter.

They are no longer able to work to generate their own income, so are reliant on additional support.

More to the point, they've paid tax and contributed to society for the duration of their working lifetimes, why shouldnt society support them towars the end?

How about taking aim at state funded childcare instead, for example.

Why should society provide free babysitting to those who have been irresponsible enough to reproduce without covering the full financial cost of their decisions?
Why should the child-free shoulder the tax burden of skint parents?

The answer to that is, of course, that taxation exists to support broader society, not just the little bubbles that we deem "worthy"

It is also worth remembering that the rich pensioners would not wish to use the bus anyway and have probably never applied for a pass. They would rather have the convenience of using their cars. Passes are applied for and it is unlikely they would even think of applying. Cost is incurred per use, so if they do not have one nor use one they are costing us nothing.

I would get off their backs frankly!!

Free pass from 60 in London. Well, you to pay £20 for an over 60s Oyster, but that's it.

I would not be surprised.
Your house as an asset only counts when you are about to go in a care home (so no longer need the house) and it will be used to fund that.
If you are still living in it, then it should not be considered at all. Otherwise people on other means tested benefits could be made to sell to remain eligible for them.

Good for her! Old people should continue to have a good time for as long as they can.

Many do though. My parents are wealthy but as soon as they got their free bus pass, they used it. They still both keep their cars for some journeys. Even they think it’s ridiculous that they get it for free.

Anything to stop people who shouldn't be driving driving is a good thing.

What did I wish on others exactly? The removal of a free bus pass? What a crazy overreaction!

Should 65-74 year olds not be driving?

A lot of my older friends use their free bus passes to get to the places they volunteer. I don’t think they would be quite so willing to work for nothing if their passes were taken away. It also helps protect the environment if there is greater use of public transport. I don’t think many better off over 65s use the passes as it isn’t very nice going out in all weathers to wait for a bus that (in this area) will probably not turn up anyway.
If I did use my bus pass I might spend the vast sums I would save boosting the local economy, us oldies loving a pot of tea and a nice cake of an afternoon.

I think everything should be means tested.
My Gran was very comfortably off in old age and was still given a bus pass and winter fuel payment. She would say she didn't need it and she would pass it on to us as my dad was very badly off despite working a full time job and my mum also working part time. We weren't entitled to anything due to that.

She would be angry about her peers who suggested they were "entitled" to it due to age/war etc saying that so many youngsters needed help more and were left to fend for themselves. She would get quite cross about how easier she had it with her and my grandfather buying a home and things.

If Universal credit is means tested for everyone then so should everything else that is technically a benefit.

So because your parents are fortunate enough to be well of it means all pensioners are does it? There are many many many who are not.

Makes me sick all the older people hate on here.

Of course there is. It's simply a matter of priorities. They could spend money on it, it may pay for itself in reducing carbon emissions, reducing inequalities in accessing services, reducing traffic congestion, improving mental health. I wonder how much the £2 price cap has cost and how much more expensive this would be compared to the increased benefits.

Thinking of re-naming myself the Bellman on this board since OP is so obtuse about this 'subsidy'. Young people are not subsidising the old, the old have paid their share. Bus passes for the old subsidise transport for the young - the bus company won't run buses if they make no profit out of it, so subsidies are needed to make them. Bus passes are a subsidy for bus operators.

Rich older people pay more tax! Therefore the money they get from generous pensions is taxed.

@MiserableMrsMopp - well my mother is dead & my father is currently in ICU. My father certainly never used a bus but drove for far too long. My mother used the bus a lot, mainly for Saturday shopping jaunts with friends. Is that ok with you?

Because if they didn’t, there would be fewer busses for everybody. As has been pointed out several times already, it’s a subsidy for the bus operator, not the pensioners. Without it many bus routes wouldn’t be viable. Particularly in rural areas.

In any case the richer pensioners will be paying towards the cost of the subsidy in the form of taxes like everybody else, young or old.

There are free and subsidised travel schemes available for school children, students and people on low incomes. I've been subsidising people all my working life, I went to private school, have no children, use private health care but I've still paid in to help others. What age do you think us oldies should get a bus pass, where I live it's only valid locally, I still have to pay when I visit friends or family.