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Teachers : what's the worst thing about the job now?

632 replies

Floursacktabletop · 22/02/2025 20:31

I've name changed , but been here many years and teaching for 22 years.
Dreading going back on Monday. For me , the worst bit is the increasingly poor behaviour of students and the continual parental complaints and allegations.
Anyone else dreading it and fancy a solidarity thread?

OP posts:
Musicaltheatremum · 23/02/2025 09:25

All your problems are going to be solved soon though with the VAT from the private schools. You'll have so many more resources.!

Seriously though I would hate to be a teacher. The behaviour problems seem to be escalating exponentially.

My son would come home from school and moan that Mr X had "told him off for nothing" I just used to laugh and tell him Mr X had better things to do and to behave.

yomellamoHelly · 23/02/2025 09:26

Ofsted due
plus
The amount of work - which is made worse by the lack of teachers, so we're expected to teach stuff that's not our specialism with no time to prepare.
Then there's the constant pressure to be setting (and marking) homework
And the books (Ofsted due...)
Plus do the extracurricular clubs (pressure for everyone to be offering something and to chase all kids to attend at least one - Ofsted due)
Pressure to call parents constantly - both those I teach and as a form tutor (which we all are). And no recognition that the parents can often be shit
(And I'm sure there's plenty more.....)

yomellamoHelly · 23/02/2025 09:30

Tia86 · 23/02/2025 09:22

In response to the what has changed, I think it's the issue of responsibility (child and parent).

Even at A level when I first started teaching over 15 years ago, students would turn up with their own pad of paper, pencil case full of pens, highlighters, and ring bingers to organise their work into. They also took pride in this and using their own money to buy colourful folders etc (mostly through their own summer jobs and weekends jobs, not just parents pocket money). Gradually this started to shift and you began to see a few asking to borrow a pen each lesson, and some asking friends for paper which just got shoved in their bag, crumpled which they would say they would put in a folder at home.
A bit further on again and it reached a point of giving out exercise books as no student would come with their own notebooks or folders, and pretty much handing out a pen to most of the class too. This was A level where they want to be treated as adults but were actually no different to any other class in secondary, and for some worse as they believed they had a right to be there and could to what they wanted with no consequences (no detention for sixth formers).

I understand cost of living has had an impact on families but it is concerning that the responsibility of providing even a pen has now fallen on schools (who have no budget for this) and children do not come prepared to school and are not prepared to learn.

Edited

This drives me nuts too. We then have to ensure that stuff comes back in or we run out really quickly as none of the kids in any of the classes have the equipment they need.
And most of the kids walk out the class and promptly erase everything you've just spent 50 minutes talking to them about too, so I'm on constant repeat to try and ensure something sticks. Kids do not care and then are resentful that I set them homework on what we've done in class

yomellamoHelly · 23/02/2025 09:31

And huge classes (which impacts on everything)

phlebasconsidered · 23/02/2025 09:33

And another new one- "My mum said not to bother because I only need maths and English". So sit in my class and do what then? They don't even bother with parents evening. And yet I still have to get them a 4 as my target- not allowed to even set them a lower one. It's laughable.

PinkGrapefuit · 23/02/2025 09:38

I do wonder after reading the whole thread, why teachers are not striking en masse.
Surely these things need bringing out into the open, and discussed frankly, especially the health and safety aspects. Nothing will change otherwise.

Queenager · 23/02/2025 09:38

I know a lot of children at school would benefit from ‘ wholesome’ school trips to widen their life experiences- unfortunately I know for a fact that teachers are cutting down on trips and visits because they can’t bear the thought of taking unruly children out of the classroom!
This is where the divide will widen even more - the parents who are able to enhance the ‘cultural capital ‘ for their children. - and those parents that can’t.
and it’s not to do with money a lot of the time. It’s parenting.

RainbowConnection1 · 23/02/2025 09:41

Behaviour, poor attention spans, lack of resilience, parents.

Floursacktabletop · 23/02/2025 09:47

Tia86 · 23/02/2025 09:22

In response to the what has changed, I think it's the issue of responsibility (child and parent).

Even at A level when I first started teaching over 15 years ago, students would turn up with their own pad of paper, pencil case full of pens, highlighters, and ring bingers to organise their work into. They also took pride in this and using their own money to buy colourful folders etc (mostly through their own summer jobs and weekends jobs, not just parents pocket money). Gradually this started to shift and you began to see a few asking to borrow a pen each lesson, and some asking friends for paper which just got shoved in their bag, crumpled which they would say they would put in a folder at home.
A bit further on again and it reached a point of giving out exercise books as no student would come with their own notebooks or folders, and pretty much handing out a pen to most of the class too. This was A level where they want to be treated as adults but were actually no different to any other class in secondary, and for some worse as they believed they had a right to be there and could to what they wanted with no consequences (no detention for sixth formers).

I understand cost of living has had an impact on families but it is concerning that the responsibility of providing even a pen has now fallen on schools (who have no budget for this) and children do not come prepared to school and are not prepared to learn.

Edited

I agree with this. Also children have learned that "my family can't afford that" gets them.out of any responsibility.
A student in my year 8 form group immediately replied to our fodd bank drive (at all different price points) with "my family can't even afford the 30p custard creams")
I know the family well and so contacted home to check all was OK. Parents mortified. They give the child a packed lunch and £2 a day to spend at the shop on the way to school. The child had just learned that to say this means you don't have to do anything. Repeat this with pens, highlighters, etc etc

OP posts:
Floursacktabletop · 23/02/2025 09:49

Oh yes contacting home to offer support if your child Is ill /not in school

OP posts:
Queenager · 23/02/2025 09:49

RainbowConnection1 · 23/02/2025 09:41

Behaviour, poor attention spans, lack of resilience, parents.

The poor attention spans are a real problem. Teachers are now expected to be performing monkeys to get children’s attention!

BusyMum47 · 23/02/2025 09:52

@Floursacktabletop

100% behaviour. Tied in with that is horrendous parents & lack of SLT backbone & support.

On the odd occasion that the Gods smile on you & you actually get to teach a class of well behaved, inquisitive children, it's the best job ever.

treesandteas · 23/02/2025 09:58

Lack of funding/provision for SEND meaning you have children in mainstream who can’t cope and you’re expected to miraculously meet their needs without any specialist provision or support. In practice, this means at best you have children with SEND sitting there unable to engage or participate, or at worst, you have children with SEND experiencing mental health crises that you can’t effectively help them with, ultimately affecting the education of other children.

I hated the fact that children whose parents had money, time and energy to fight the system were the ones who got support whilst those who didn’t, missed out. It’s a scandal.

StrawberryWater · 23/02/2025 10:10

phlebasconsidered · 23/02/2025 09:33

And another new one- "My mum said not to bother because I only need maths and English". So sit in my class and do what then? They don't even bother with parents evening. And yet I still have to get them a 4 as my target- not allowed to even set them a lower one. It's laughable.

This reminds me of a conversation I overheard recently. A woman said she wasn't going to bother getting her son to do any work or homework or concentrate on anything in class "until it was a GSCE year".

I nearly put my head in my hands.

blackbird77 · 23/02/2025 10:12

Doing science practicals with all but my top sets is becoming impossible due to behaviour, inattentiveness and immaturity.

Not only will students deliberately mess around with dangerous equipment (bunsen burners, throwing chemicals at each other, sticking things in electrical sockets), but due to decreasing executive function, impulse control, common sense and memory span, students will aimlessly leave open flames unattended and wander off, carelessly leave glassware like flasks and test tubes on the edges of tables so they roll off and smash, play fight and roughhouse around experiments, steal scalpels during dissections etc. (leading to whole-school bag searches).

It’s not just immaturity and behaviour but students look at you blankly when you ask them to pick up a beaker or use a kettle or measure 500ml or water in a (very clearly marked) measuring cylinder. There’s such a learned helplessness amongst them that they won’t even attempt to independently figure out something themselves. They are unable to follow even the most basic of instructions and due to screens frying their brain and the fast frame rate of things like TikTok and Instagram/YouTube shorts giving them dopamine hits every few seconds, they are unable to concentrate on anything longer than a minute. If they don’t see a result in the experiment after a couple of minutes (rare), they completely lose interest. If an instruction has more than one step, they cannot retain and follow it. No patience or self-discipline or ability to delay gratification.

Practicals take 3x as long as they used to and are not worth doing in most cases because it’s such torture. The secondary school students are so developmentally behind where they should be for assessing risk, thinking independently and understanding basic scientific method, it’s what I would expect from small primary school children.

Same for school trips. People thing trips are on the decline due to funding but it’s really because teachers are refusing to do them. Nobody wants to lose their career or end up in the newspaper over kids who can’t even meet the most minimal expected behaviour requirements for being in public.

SpanThatWorld · 23/02/2025 10:16

PinkGrapefuit · 23/02/2025 09:38

I do wonder after reading the whole thread, why teachers are not striking en masse.
Surely these things need bringing out into the open, and discussed frankly, especially the health and safety aspects. Nothing will change otherwise.

Because there is no public support when teachers go on strike

Because teachers have bills to pay and can't afford not to be paid for a long strike

Because no amount of going on strike will get parents to do what they're not doing now

Because teachers will - in the real world when the strikes are over with nothing gained - still have to get all those kids to pass their SATS, GCSEs and A levels.

grafittiartist · 23/02/2025 10:21

The scrunching sound of water bottles.
The sound of metal water bottles falling on the floor.
Water bottles generally.

converseandjeans · 23/02/2025 10:24

@PinkGrapefuit

There have been strikes but the general public don't generally support them as it's inconvenient. They get cross that they get fined if they take their children out for a holiday abroad & don't think it's fair that school is then closed.

There is a retention crisis. Lots of older staff are staying put but the younger generation are just leaving after a few years and going into other jobs.

converseandjeans · 23/02/2025 10:37

@Millysmum87 @tricho

Also how many other careers have such a proliferation of "early retirement". Guarantee you wouldn't be able to do that on a private sector pension chummy

Your Normal Pension Age (NPA) is the age at which you can take your pension rights in full. Your NPA depends on when you joined the scheme. If you joined the scheme on or after 1 January 2007, you have an NPA of 65. If you joined the scheme before 1 January 2007, you continue to have an NPA of 60 provided that you do not leave teaching for more than five years.

neu.org.uk/advice/your-rights-work/pensions/teachers-pension-scheme/tps-final-salary-scheme

I don't think 65 is especially 'early' and if you take it earlier you obviously get less. I have been teaching 24 years and will get £9000 at 60 and another £1500 at 67. So yes I could take it early but reckon it would be reduced by quite a bit. I think soon teachers won't get anything until 67. It's quite physically demanding and so someone who is 65 upwards would find it difficult. Say you teach reception age there's lots of bending down. Teenagers are quite physical & so an older person might easily get knocked over.

I think police & fire service have better pensions. But I suppose parents don't have as much direct contact with them. NHS, civil service, local government also have decent pensions.

spanieleyes · 23/02/2025 10:43

NPA is now 67.

ThrallsWife · 23/02/2025 10:49

Parents are definitely my number one.
When I started teaching, the threat of phoning home often used to be enough to get a child to behave and you only had the odd one or two who'd misbehave. I would, maybe, need to actually make one call a week. Now I dread every email and every phone call about behaviour, because instead of supportive parents I now have parents having a go at me. And those phone calls have to happen daily, because behaviour is much worse. I expect other adults to be reasonable, and I think that is why it is so upsetting when that doesn't happen.

Behaviour from students has two sides, which are equally appalling.
One is a lack of resilience and taking responsibility. Classes where half the children don't have a pen, let alone a calculator, where maybe 2 out of 20 have done their homework, where "We have a test???" comes after numerous reminders in class, on their homework and on my slides. Where children will ask to go to the toilet 10mins after break, because "break is for chilling, not going to the toilet", and then walk out if you refuse. Kids who speak to you however they want, but if you say one thing that can be even slightly misinterpreted (or, you know, have sass yourself), you get hauled into the safeguarding office, because little Gracie felt upset.

The other is that students now feel entitled to completely ignore you. You greet kids at the door and are lucky if one in 5 acknowledges your "good morning". You ask them to tuck their shirt in in the hallway and they walk past as if you don't exist. They're talking in class, you stand next to them and talk to them to address it, they carry on their conversation as if you're invisible. I find that behaviour worse than being told to fuck off.

As for reasons? Schools buy into "When the adult changes, everything changes". Any misbehaviour that carries on or escalates is down to the teacher, not the child. We're being gaslit into believing that is is our lack of building relationships, our lack of yet more accommodations, that has led to the child kicking off. Children bear no responsibility for their actions or their grades and if you treat them the way the real world does, you're in the wrong. Thankfully, we're seeing a slow return to actual discipline in some schools. Which then also report rapidly improving behaviour.

And a definite yes to "I only need to pass Maths and English". When did that attitude become acceptable? If you teach anything other than Maths and English at GCSE, you're stuffed, but if you're an EBacc subject, you get told to emulate the excellent behaviour and attitudes as well as grades in both subjects, while getting none of the support, curriculum time or children's engagement, because they don't need your subject for the next step.

Lastly, pay and conditions. Teaching used to have great conditions, all of which have been hugely eroded by MATs now (reduced sick pay, mat pay, increased days worked etc). I don't think there is an LA-maintained school left in my area. Pay was never high, but provided a comfortable lifestyle once you passed the first few years and that is no longer the case. With all the public sector pay freezes since 2010, pay is now worth 1/3 less than it was. It's why I am struggling financially despite my middle leadership post with vast amounts of responsibility, and why I'm climbing the greasy pole even though I have little interest in senior leadership.

noblegiraffe · 23/02/2025 10:58

And a definite yes to "I only need to pass Maths and English". When did that attitude become acceptable? If you teach anything other than Maths and English at GCSE, you're stuffed

You might think that they're knuckling down with maximum effort in maths and English, but rest assured, they are doing fuck all to get a 4 in maths too because 'my dad didn't get any GCSEs and he has his own company and I'm going to work for him'. My Y11s are borderline and the threat of 'if you don't get a 4 in the summer you have to resit' seems to have been understood as 'so don't worry, you can always resit'.

MrsHamlet · 23/02/2025 11:00

noblegiraffe · 23/02/2025 10:58

And a definite yes to "I only need to pass Maths and English". When did that attitude become acceptable? If you teach anything other than Maths and English at GCSE, you're stuffed

You might think that they're knuckling down with maximum effort in maths and English, but rest assured, they are doing fuck all to get a 4 in maths too because 'my dad didn't get any GCSEs and he has his own company and I'm going to work for him'. My Y11s are borderline and the threat of 'if you don't get a 4 in the summer you have to resit' seems to have been understood as 'so don't worry, you can always resit'.

I concur. Bob "dunt need no GCSEs".

Interestingly, Bob's dad refused to have Bob for work experience last year.

converseandjeans · 23/02/2025 11:05

@spanieleyes

NPA is now 67.

I honestly can't imagine teaching until 67. I don't know where the general public get the idea about teacher pensions. I think maybe in the 80s & 90s those retiring could finish at 55 and get a decent amount. But that was the case for lots of jobs at the time.

Millysmum87 · 23/02/2025 11:05

noblegiraffe · 23/02/2025 10:58

And a definite yes to "I only need to pass Maths and English". When did that attitude become acceptable? If you teach anything other than Maths and English at GCSE, you're stuffed

You might think that they're knuckling down with maximum effort in maths and English, but rest assured, they are doing fuck all to get a 4 in maths too because 'my dad didn't get any GCSEs and he has his own company and I'm going to work for him'. My Y11s are borderline and the threat of 'if you don't get a 4 in the summer you have to resit' seems to have been understood as 'so don't worry, you can always resit'.

As an English teacher, I'd say the extra monitoring from the trust/breathing down one's neck from SLT/MAT execs counters any tiny amount of better engagement in a core subject. Tbh though, I don't see it much either. I got "Why are we studying Shakespeare? How is this gonna help me when I become an influencer?" But I have seen first hand the battles of say MFL teachers with Year 9s who don't give a shit as they'll be "dropping it anyway". So I feel their pain.