To think that most “self-made” people had way more help than they admit?

[ArtfulTealCrab]

Every successful person loves to talk about their “hard work” and “grit,” but they leave out the rich parents, private schools, and family connections. Is true self-made success even possible?

I image it is true for some, but not most.

Absolutely.
I think genuine from nothing stories are very rare.
I don’t think people mean to mislead though. They just don’t realise the privilege they had.

I have known a lot of people who have come from richer homes who don't have any drive or passion and who don't like working hard. They still tend to end up in good jobs.

I think those qualities are built into a person and when they are from a poor background they have a bigger impetus to succeed. I actually really love looking at people who have gone from rags to riches to try to work out what it is that made that happen.

I feel like life is a race, in which we all have a different starting line.

Being born in a wealthy western nation will put you ahead, your ethnicity or sex can put you ahead, your access to education, your family income/wealth, your location, athleticism, good looks etc. These things contribute to if your shooting gun is 100m from the finish line, rather than a 10k slog.

I’m more interested in why you seem so invested in the idea that the self-made began with secret help. What difference would it make to you if people genuinely achieved success from nothing, with no educational or economic privileges, nepotism or connections?

This Reddit poster has obvs done their research on it. Apparently for America it's about 27% self made. I imagine it would be similar here.
https://www.reddit.com/r/FluentInFinance/comments/19180wa/no_dave_ramsey_8_out_of_10_80_millionaires_are/

Another thread about hard work…

Well some have help and some don’t - that’s life

Definitely in a lot of cases.

Just things like two loving parents, a safe and stable home, being wealthy or even comfortable, parents who care about your education, help towards starting a business or a house deposit, inheritance.

Not saying hard work doesn't come into it too.

But some people get a huge head start/leg up compared to others.

Sometimes people don't realise they had help others didn't ie their parents were poor but scrimped and saved and paid for a lot. Sometimes politicians exaggerate.

But there are people who just did well from nothing - I know two very successful people from poor backgrounds who had no financial help.

Because narratives matter. If we pretend that success is purely about hard work when many people start with massive advantages, it misleads others into thinking they can achieve the same without similar help. Acknowledging privilege isn’t about dismissing effort; it’s about being honest about how opportunities are distributed.

Everyone I know who has done very well has done it to prove something and definitely didnt have family help. For example they were bullied at school for having free school dinners or incorrect uniform. They had the drive to succeed. Their kids on the other hand dont!

Very possible & people are so quick to suggest there's more to it as you have but for many it's not the case. Not saying they don't exist, but it's not the easy one-size-fits-all statement you think. I say this as someone married to one (and we've built on it further together) and also friends with them too - people who were raised with none of the above & forged it all for themselves. Interestingly, none of these people make such sweeping statements about other people's success or lack of.

It was common in the 80s so people have grown up with that narrative. Decreasingly common now.

I think this is a good point too. A lot of context comes from knowing what era people grew up in.

Like the Industrial Revolution offered a lot of new opportunities for people to develop wealth they could never have previously experienced, the 80s was a time of Reagan/Thatcher capitalist economics, that did mean people who didn’t come from wealth were able to establish independently.

I notice it a bit when someone will post a thread worrying about their child who’s leaving school with no GCSE’s, and asking for peoples advice who have been in a similar boat. Comments from people who left school in the 70/80/early 90s with no qualifications and say it didn’t hold them back, don’t really hold the same context, although I do understand they are wanting to offer support.

Who exactly is ‘pretending’ that?

If help means starting of with economic or family advantages, than no, I don't think self made people all had them.

My grandfather was a self-made man. His family was working class, his father an alcoholic. There were no grandparents, his father immigrated as an adult, his mum came from a deeply abusive home. He had a difficult home life. He had regular schooling for someone in his position.

He joined the navy as a young man, and educated himself through reading, and became a well known journalist and editor in his city.

Does that count as self-made?

I can think of many stories like that, people who had no advantages and did well. It's always about hard work. I'm not sure why many people are so eager to poo poo that and convince young people that if they don't start off with advantages they are doomed to fail.

Yes when I trained for counselling - only those who had rich families /partners who could support them financially through the volunteering process to attain accreditation made it . Whereas I had to work so couldn’t get my accreditation . Hence most counsellors are from wealthy backgrounds - whether they acknowledge the help and support they had is a different matter though !
so yeah most folks get some help on one form or another . Not many do it all from scratch on their own as there’s too many obstacles .

Worth a look, if you have not seen it before:

https://digitalsynopsis.com/inspiration/privileged-kids-on-a-plate-pencilsword-toby-morris/

Toby Morris, On A Plate - a short story about privilege.

The wealthiest friends I have did have an easier start. Good schools and unis, but what really mattered was being supported to buy a home at a very young age and being funded through post graduate qualifications. They never had to do shite jobs to keep a roof over their head.

There's a comic/cartoon I am struggling to find right now, about obstacles and unfairness. Anyone know the one I mean?

Many forget how important a safety net is & how it gives you confidence to try something.

Because being poor sucks and they want something good better, an element of I'm going to show them and if you have nothing to start with it's easier to take a risk .

A few years ago Victoria Beckham got some kind of entrepreneur award. It kind of stuck 2 fingers up at people who had actually started a business from scratch, working all hours, for probably no pay, without millions of pounds of brand Beckham to fall back on. I'm pretty sure Trump has a similar riches to more riches story of being self made.

This isn't the one I mean, but the gist is the same. It wasn't aimed at the gender divide, but about privilege:

https://icld.se/en/article/study-says-obstacles-to-reach-gender-equality/

Edit: adding link because pic didn't load. Hope this works.

Many people don't recognise their privilege, whether it be sex, race, class, finance, secure housing, supportive family, or even just pure chance.

Often you don't realise how fortunate or unfortunate you are until you speak honestly with others.

Personally my parents were working class but upwardly mobile, and very supportive. Both were literate, our housing was secure and while there were times money was tight we always had a roof over our heads and food on the table. It has taken me a long time to not only recognise the advantages I have and the extent of them but also the disadvantages of being the first generation to go to uni, having no family connections or experiences to draw upon.

I'm in a profession where access has widened massively and it is humbling to hear accounts of colleagues who have fought through growing up in care, homelessness and prejudice but also sobering to hear the experiences of those who got interviews based upon the school they attended or who were able to work in Daddy's business.