Page 20 | Should I report my cousin's benefit fraud?

GreatAmberSnake · 2025-02-20T09:35:30+00:00

Hi everyone - I'm having a bit of a moral dilemma and looking to get everyone's opinions. My M34 cousin doesn't work, he claims PIP. I'm not that familiar with how it works but he says he's on the highest level available, and there's even talk of him getting given a car. He openly boasts at every opportunity about the extreme exaggerations and outright lies he put on his PIP application, and calls me and other members of the family idiots for working when we could just get our money from PIP like he does. If they investigated him they would easily find that some of his lies don't add up. I believe he genuinely does have depression and anxiety, but he has no physical issues. He said he put things like his partner needs to dress him in the morning (he split from his partner a couple of years ago), needs to wear velcro shoes as he can't tie laces etc. A home visit would show up some of his lies, and a call to the school (he's a weekend Dad but sometimes picks up/drops off his sons) or the Police (he's been arrested for drug offences a couple of times) would be further proof. The main thing stopping me from reporting him is his depression. He has attempted suicide on at least one occasion, and I fear that a potential prison sentence for fraud could send him into a spiral. Even if no-one found out it was me, I really don't want that on my conscience. If he didn't boast all the time I would just ignore it, it's not like it affects me directly, but it just winds me up every time he goes on about. Grrrr!! I do try to minimise contact with him but sometimes it's easier said than done. If he gets this car I think he'll become even more unbearable 😡 Help! What would you do?

Miley1967 · 22/02/2025 10:52

Laurmolonlabe · 22/02/2025 00:23

people applying for PIP are assessed by a DWP appointed doctor- so I'm amazed he hasn't been found out, maybe they are behind and his assessment is coming. Don't worry about him getting a car- the only case I have ever heard of this is 100% incapacitated by vaccine damage. I have helped people with PIP applications- it really isn't that easy to cheat on it, more people are turned down than accepted for it.
It sounds extraordinary boasting about benefit fraud, but I have encountered this .

PIP assessors are more likely to be Nurses, OT's, paramedics etc.

LifeMovesOn · 22/02/2025 11:57

I’ve just gone through 5 months of hell with a friend who has finally been diagnosed bi-polar, she’s delighted as this means she can claim PIP and not bother going back to work. She’s currently overseas on an expensive holiday.

it has been very insightful going thru her MH journey. The lies she’s told, the half truths with the MH team - she’s playing the system nicely just to get what she wants. And it’s been so easy. The MH professionals can’t cope with the level of people they need to help so it’s easy to see how people can cheat the system. And that’s not right, nor fair, for people who genuinely need the help.

scanni · 22/02/2025 12:09

LifeMovesOn · 22/02/2025 11:57

I’ve just gone through 5 months of hell with a friend who has finally been diagnosed bi-polar, she’s delighted as this means she can claim PIP and not bother going back to work. She’s currently overseas on an expensive holiday.

it has been very insightful going thru her MH journey. The lies she’s told, the half truths with the MH team - she’s playing the system nicely just to get what she wants. And it’s been so easy. The MH professionals can’t cope with the level of people they need to help so it’s easy to see how people can cheat the system. And that’s not right, nor fair, for people who genuinely need the help.

PIP ain't going to replace her wage though, even if she was awarded HR for both elements. How does she intend to manage?

LadyKenya · 22/02/2025 12:19

LifeMovesOn · 22/02/2025 11:57

I’ve just gone through 5 months of hell with a friend who has finally been diagnosed bi-polar, she’s delighted as this means she can claim PIP and not bother going back to work. She’s currently overseas on an expensive holiday.

it has been very insightful going thru her MH journey. The lies she’s told, the half truths with the MH team - she’s playing the system nicely just to get what she wants. And it’s been so easy. The MH professionals can’t cope with the level of people they need to help so it’s easy to see how people can cheat the system. And that’s not right, nor fair, for people who genuinely need the help.

From what you have written, your friend is not even in receipt of PIP yet, and it sounds like she worked to pay for her 'expensive holiday'. Unless I have read your post wrong. Either way she could still work, and claim PIP, as plenty of other people do the same. It is not meant to replace her earnings.

WaitingForMojo · 22/02/2025 12:29

Ok, so let me tell you what will happen if you report your cousin for benefit fraud, based on absolutely no evidence, as you seem to have no idea about the eligibility criteria and certainly don’t know the ins and outs of his medical conditions and the impact on his life. You only know a snapshot, and you really don’t understand the pip system at all.

He will be called for an interview under caution. Cautioned as though he’s been arrested. The DWP fraud team will scrutinise every aspect of his life, humiliate him, make him out to be a liar and a fraud, and twist his words (those of you saying if he’s genuine he will keep his benefits stress free have obviously never been involved with the DWP fraud team. I have (professionally) and the process is abhorrent.). It may be that he keeps his benefit. It may not, if he can’t meet the higher standard of proof that will now legally be required (criminal proceedings being a different standard of proof than a civil law matter or tribunal).

Ask yourself what good can come out of it? Will you feel good about yourself, for putting someone who you say has genuine mental health issues and has been suicidal, through that? What do you hope to gain? Some kind of vindication, a smug feeling that you were right all along? Him losing benefit? Is it worth the absolute definite and devastating negatives that will inevitably result from your report, whether you are right or wrong?

And if you are wrong, you’re causing all that to happen for no reason whatsoever

IMO, the risk of harm from reporting, even if you were right, is just so much greater than any harm caused by letting it be, and leaving the decision to the DWP and the assessment procedures that are already in place.

WaitingForMojo · 22/02/2025 12:31

LifeMovesOn · 22/02/2025 11:57

I’ve just gone through 5 months of hell with a friend who has finally been diagnosed bi-polar, she’s delighted as this means she can claim PIP and not bother going back to work. She’s currently overseas on an expensive holiday.

it has been very insightful going thru her MH journey. The lies she’s told, the half truths with the MH team - she’s playing the system nicely just to get what she wants. And it’s been so easy. The MH professionals can’t cope with the level of people they need to help so it’s easy to see how people can cheat the system. And that’s not right, nor fair, for people who genuinely need the help.

The diagnosis will have absolutely no bearing on her claim, so your post is utter rubbish. The diagnostic report will act as evidence but the diagnosis itself is irrelevant.

PandoraSox · 22/02/2025 12:42

LifeMovesOn · 22/02/2025 11:57

I’ve just gone through 5 months of hell with a friend who has finally been diagnosed bi-polar, she’s delighted as this means she can claim PIP and not bother going back to work. She’s currently overseas on an expensive holiday.

it has been very insightful going thru her MH journey. The lies she’s told, the half truths with the MH team - she’s playing the system nicely just to get what she wants. And it’s been so easy. The MH professionals can’t cope with the level of people they need to help so it’s easy to see how people can cheat the system. And that’s not right, nor fair, for people who genuinely need the help.

Another one who doesn't check up on what PIP actually is and its relationship with the abilty to work before posting. Which brings into doubt the rest of the tale.

Greeherbs · 22/02/2025 13:15

WaitingForMojo · 22/02/2025 12:29

Ok, so let me tell you what will happen if you report your cousin for benefit fraud, based on absolutely no evidence, as you seem to have no idea about the eligibility criteria and certainly don’t know the ins and outs of his medical conditions and the impact on his life. You only know a snapshot, and you really don’t understand the pip system at all.

He will be called for an interview under caution. Cautioned as though he’s been arrested. The DWP fraud team will scrutinise every aspect of his life, humiliate him, make him out to be a liar and a fraud, and twist his words (those of you saying if he’s genuine he will keep his benefits stress free have obviously never been involved with the DWP fraud team. I have (professionally) and the process is abhorrent.). It may be that he keeps his benefit. It may not, if he can’t meet the higher standard of proof that will now legally be required (criminal proceedings being a different standard of proof than a civil law matter or tribunal).

Ask yourself what good can come out of it? Will you feel good about yourself, for putting someone who you say has genuine mental health issues and has been suicidal, through that? What do you hope to gain? Some kind of vindication, a smug feeling that you were right all along? Him losing benefit? Is it worth the absolute definite and devastating negatives that will inevitably result from your report, whether you are right or wrong?

And if you are wrong, you’re causing all that to happen for no reason whatsoever

IMO, the risk of harm from reporting, even if you were right, is just so much greater than any harm caused by letting it be, and leaving the decision to the DWP and the assessment procedures that are already in place.

This made me laugh, thanks!

What you have described is so riddled with self contradictions and outright falsehoods that it is difficult to know where to begin.

Miley1967 · 22/02/2025 13:22

WaitingForMojo · 22/02/2025 12:29

Ok, so let me tell you what will happen if you report your cousin for benefit fraud, based on absolutely no evidence, as you seem to have no idea about the eligibility criteria and certainly don’t know the ins and outs of his medical conditions and the impact on his life. You only know a snapshot, and you really don’t understand the pip system at all.

He will be called for an interview under caution. Cautioned as though he’s been arrested. The DWP fraud team will scrutinise every aspect of his life, humiliate him, make him out to be a liar and a fraud, and twist his words (those of you saying if he’s genuine he will keep his benefits stress free have obviously never been involved with the DWP fraud team. I have (professionally) and the process is abhorrent.). It may be that he keeps his benefit. It may not, if he can’t meet the higher standard of proof that will now legally be required (criminal proceedings being a different standard of proof than a civil law matter or tribunal).

Ask yourself what good can come out of it? Will you feel good about yourself, for putting someone who you say has genuine mental health issues and has been suicidal, through that? What do you hope to gain? Some kind of vindication, a smug feeling that you were right all along? Him losing benefit? Is it worth the absolute definite and devastating negatives that will inevitably result from your report, whether you are right or wrong?

And if you are wrong, you’re causing all that to happen for no reason whatsoever

IMO, the risk of harm from reporting, even if you were right, is just so much greater than any harm caused by letting it be, and leaving the decision to the DWP and the assessment procedures that are already in place.

I've read recent reports on a couple of online forums of people being observed/ followed before they are called in for interview under caution. So DWP already have the evidence. Does this happen much? One woman said they had footage of her over two weeks, filming her walking to places, leaving the house alone etc when she had said she couldn't. They then presented her with the ' evidence' they had.

Hdjdb42 · 22/02/2025 13:24

vikingnorthutsiresouthutsire · 21/02/2025 23:56

@Hdjdb42 was any action taken after your reports?

It took a year, and one had to go in for assessments, the other was visited and questioned which made him panic and stop doing it.

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 13:43

scanni · 21/02/2025 17:01

Haha there is so much that doesn't add up but a tribunal that took years and he was given £20k of back money- pull the other one.

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Back when waiting times for PIP decisions were many months long, followed by a longish wait for the mandatory reconsideration, then over a year between the MR decision and the appeal, it wasn't uncommon for it to take 2 years between application and appeal, then a few weeks before the arrears payment was made.

It's a little better now, as the initial decision is taking about 3-4 months in my part of the SE, then 8-12 weeks for an MR decision. I'm still waiting for a tribunal date for an appeal submitted 14 months ago, and the initial decision was over 6 months ago, so we're not far off the 2 year mark.

I held my team record for the biggest PIP arrears payment at £22k, but last Tuesday, one of my colleagues won an appeal that will give an arrears payment of over £25k. £20k is entirely credible imo.

x2boys · 22/02/2025 13:49

LifeMovesOn · 22/02/2025 11:57

I’ve just gone through 5 months of hell with a friend who has finally been diagnosed bi-polar, she’s delighted as this means she can claim PIP and not bother going back to work. She’s currently overseas on an expensive holiday.

it has been very insightful going thru her MH journey. The lies she’s told, the half truths with the MH team - she’s playing the system nicely just to get what she wants. And it’s been so easy. The MH professionals can’t cope with the level of people they need to help so it’s easy to see how people can cheat the system. And that’s not right, nor fair, for people who genuinely need the help.

Do you undestsn̈d anything about Bi polar ?the half truth lies you call it could be part of presentation, people get grandiose ideas also spending money on expensive holidays, can be classic of people who are in manic phase of their illness.

Greeherbs · 22/02/2025 14:11

Miley1967 · 22/02/2025 13:22

I've read recent reports on a couple of online forums of people being observed/ followed before they are called in for interview under caution. So DWP already have the evidence. Does this happen much? One woman said they had footage of her over two weeks, filming her walking to places, leaving the house alone etc when she had said she couldn't. They then presented her with the ' evidence' they had.

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If it is a mental health award, a string of good days is par for the course.

You can report this as many times as you like and it wouldn’t make the blindest bit of difference. Especially if you haven’t read the actual claim.

Claimants often tell people all sorts of things. I used to live with someone who within a one year period had attempted suicide several times, long with being sectioned at least twice. Her family and friends knew nothing of this. Her claim would have been backed to the hilt with evidence from mental health professionals.

Reporting wouldn’t affect someone like this, not at all. Someone with ample write ups from psychiatrists wouldn’t be worried at all.

But if you have a lot of time to burn, do carry on. I suppose it keeps mean people occupied and off the streets. Best to have you focused on things that don’t cause any real harm.

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 14:21

Miley1967 · 21/02/2025 00:11

Age Uk often have people who will fill out the forms. they will often do home visits. Also citizens advice or sometimes even DWP home visiting officers will come to the home to help fill out the form. Or you can fill out the form online also.

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The online application is a trial thing and only possible in certain areas.

Sadly, none of them are in the counties I work in.

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 14:26

Jaehee · 21/02/2025 00:36

I’ve been on PIP several years now and have never once been asked about what I spend it on.

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I've never heard of any of my clients being asked, either.

I can't even think of at what point they would be asked, tbh. It wouldn't be asked at assessment, as they wouldn't necessarily be getting it at that point, and reviews are mostly a paper exercise and don't involve being interviewed.

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 14:37

Buttheads · 21/02/2025 21:07

I think they might be removing Pip for mental health issues and changes to UC but this will be announced in the next few weeks.
Scary times

I think that's vanishingly unlikely, because of the risk of suicides and hospital admissions by those who have significant MH issues and wouldn't be able to manage without it.

Mumofoneandone · 22/02/2025 14:41

As someone who is fighting the system to get PIP, which I absolutely need for an incurable chronic condition (as well as anxiety and depression), absolutely report if he is boasting about getting it fraudulently. Actions like his make it much harder for people who genuinely need the financial support to get it. It is incredibly hard to get but some people know exactly how to play the system.....
FWIW I reported someone for benefit fraud, as it was openly being discussed around the family. I was appalled.
If people don't have the sense to keep quiet about their fraudulent activity, then there is a chance it will catch up with them....

scanni · 22/02/2025 14:44

Buttheads · 21/02/2025 21:07

I think they might be removing Pip for mental health issues and changes to UC but this will be announced in the next few weeks.
Scary times

Scaremongering.

You can’t discriminate against disabled people in that way, it would never fly.

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 14:45

XenoBitch · 21/02/2025 21:19

I hope not. I know many people who claim PIP for MH reasons. They use it to fund things like private therapy.

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My friend's son uses most of his for exactly that. And it's therapy that he probably wouldn't need had he not been languishing on CAMHS waiting list for 6 years before he got any help, during which time he got immeasurably worse, and he was out of education for most of it.

If the government want to reduce the "benefit bill", they should consider investing in MH services for children and young people, so that their MH problems are addressed before they become entrenched and, often, end up being unable to support themselves financially.

Greeherbs · 22/02/2025 14:56

Mumofoneandone · 22/02/2025 14:41

As someone who is fighting the system to get PIP, which I absolutely need for an incurable chronic condition (as well as anxiety and depression), absolutely report if he is boasting about getting it fraudulently. Actions like his make it much harder for people who genuinely need the financial support to get it. It is incredibly hard to get but some people know exactly how to play the system.....
FWIW I reported someone for benefit fraud, as it was openly being discussed around the family. I was appalled.
If people don't have the sense to keep quiet about their fraudulent activity, then there is a chance it will catch up with them....

Someone with a mental health PIP award, would know there is no “chance”.
It is virtually impossible to evidence fraud. Even less likely that someone not close to the claimant could evidence this. Walking alone, shopping, holidays, partners, smiling, 5 star restaurants, and other silly things mentioned earlier, don’t really cover it.

Sorry if this really upsets disabled people enviers.

LadyKenya · 22/02/2025 15:18

I am actually looking forward to Labour announcing once, and for all, what they plan to do with certain benefits. The uncertainty, and the amount of scaremongering I have been exposed to lately, can be pretty unnerving. At least knowing for definite what they will be doing, should quell some people's fears.

Greeherbs · 22/02/2025 15:28

Whichever changes may or may not be brought forward, they will not be impacting someone as unwell as OP’s “cousin”. Being suicidal is a very serious consideration to be kept in mind.

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 15:31

Julen7 · 22/02/2025 09:34

The poster means physical disability issues, obviously

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My friend's autistic son is an adult, and he gets higher rate mobility because of his autism.

He is highly reactive and utterly phobic about any sort of flying insect, to the point where he just bolts if a fly or a wasp so much as heads his way. Consequently, he can only go out if he's strapped into a wheelchair.

Miley1967 · 22/02/2025 15:39

Greeherbs · 22/02/2025 14:11

If it is a mental health award, a string of good days is par for the course.

You can report this as many times as you like and it wouldn’t make the blindest bit of difference. Especially if you haven’t read the actual claim.

Claimants often tell people all sorts of things. I used to live with someone who within a one year period had attempted suicide several times, long with being sectioned at least twice. Her family and friends knew nothing of this. Her claim would have been backed to the hilt with evidence from mental health professionals.

Reporting wouldn’t affect someone like this, not at all. Someone with ample write ups from psychiatrists wouldn’t be worried at all.

But if you have a lot of time to burn, do carry on. I suppose it keeps mean people occupied and off the streets. Best to have you focused on things that don’t cause any real harm.

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Just to be clear I haven't reported anyone !

Miley1967 · 22/02/2025 15:41

LakieLady · 22/02/2025 14:21

The online application is a trial thing and only possible in certain areas.

Sadly, none of them are in the counties I work in.

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I have come across a few people who have used them but none have had a positive outcome. It seems to be more just tick boxes with no space to explain difficulties or upload medical evidence. One person didn't even seem to be aware she was applying for AA for her mum ( I think she thought she was just ordering the form or something) until a rejection letter dropped through the post a few weeks later. It is a very much shortened form than the normal one.