To say that ‘hard work’ alone will never make you rich?

[ThisWaryOtter]

If hard work was all it took, wouldn’t every low-paid worker be wealthy? Isn’t success more about luck, connections, and privilege?

It’s hard work and things lining up (like you said luck right place right time) surely!

I agree with others though about working at your existing skills and knowledge, and adding new ones, to give yourself new opportunities to get a better paid job. Which can be paid for training and courses, or free options like MOOCs (massive open online courses), YouTube videos, reading library books, joining a group etc or learning from friends and colleagues.

Hard work and luck/privilege

Yes you are right, hard work isn't enough. Working smart, seizing opportunities, making connections, knowing where the money is, making right fruitful investments increasing your passive income. I will also like to add that hanging around where the rich hang out also changes your mindset and would give you the drive. Also everything you look at or buy, being able to identify the source, production, trends and sales and being knowledgeable about it helps with small talk. For instance DH is a foodie and loves his wine and went to courses for wine. We went to a restaurant a few years ago at a ski resort and the next table heard DH talking about the wines with the waitress. Next thing we know DH is having a convo with a rich businessman about wines and which then it led to business talk and then economy, which later ended with exchanging cards and now doing business together. Before doing business together first started off with small favours such as he owns shares at a well known hotel chain and offered us discounts and DH set him up with people he knew where he could invest in a property in London in return. Always knowing someone somewhere, doing small favours like setting someone up with one of your connections and in return if you need something they will also do the same. This is why connections are very important.

YANBU. Of course hard work alone isn't enough. That's not opinion, it's fact. As well as hard work you need luck, whether it takes the form of privilege, genes (intelligence, physical ability/health), random good fortune (opportunities happening to crop up), or a lack of bad things happening. If it were only hard work, then literally everyone who works hard would be rich.

People often say rather indignantly that they worked hard for their wealth, as though people who aren't wealthy can't possibly have worked just as hard as them. I'm not rich, but my normal, comfortable life is certainly largely due to luck.

Who said anything about the sofa? You seem to be implying that if someone isn't 'successful' it can only be because they are too lazy...

Wealthy successful people often think they got there because they worked hard. They are blinded by their privilege. It’s the people on minimum wage who work the hardest. More than one job to make ends meet in a lot of cases.

Quite. For some privileged people, slogging your guts out every day at the best job you can get without higher qualifications, to feed your family and keep a roof over your head, just isn't the right kind of working hard. It doesn't count. 'Positioning yourself in the right place at the right time' isn't hard work. It's luck. How do you know when 'the right time' is going to be? And what kind of 'positioning' is available to people with no safety net, only just able to support themselves?

It’s the people on minimum wage who work the hardest.

Define working hard?

Long hours doing work that is consistently physically and/or emotionally / mentally demanding?

Long hours doing work that is consistently physically and/or emotionally / mentally demanding?

And you think only people on minimum wage do that? Teachers, doctors, lawyers could easily fit that description and they won't be on minimum wage.

Hard work alone isn't a guarantee, you need to be averagely intelligent and sensible about developing your career and saving money too.

But I don't think it generally needs significant good luck if your focus is on making money not on enjoying your life/having a family/etc.

Investment from an early age is also key even small amounts.

Pyscology of money and the janitor.

Very few "rich" business owners got there easily. Most worked hard to build their businesses, often working in evenings and weekends and during holidays on their business, alongside a full time day job.

Or studying for professional/additional qualifications in weekends and evenings as well as their full time day job to change careers.

My "richest" client who is a millionaire spent years working in his garage, designing and patenting a specialist/niche electrical connector, sacrificing holidays, hobbies, and his savings. It took him about a decade to design and manufacture it, get it patented and then marketing it, and finally renting a small industrial unit and leasing machinery to manufacture it. Yes, he eventually got the rewards, but it was bloody hard work and took over his entire life to actually get there. If it hadn't worked out, he'd have ended up bankrupt, losing his home, etc. It was a hell of a risk. Most people would have given up!

Personally I've never understood why anyone would put wealth above family or happiness. I mean, obviously we all need to earn enough to live, and hopefully we can earn enough to make life enjoyable for ourselves and our families. Those are important goals, but I've never been able to relate to the concept of putting wealth above family or general enjoyment of life to the detriment of those things simply for wealth's own sake. (I'm talking about where someone is rolling in it and has expensive property/cars/stuff but hasn't time for hobbies or holidays, hardly sees their kids etc because they are working so hard. ) Especially when the future isn't guaranteed. I bet many people have ended up looking back regretting their priorities.

No doubt on MN this makes me a slacker in some people's eyes. 😄

No. Where did I say that?! I am a teacher btw, and yes I work hard. The point wasn't to say that only people on minimum wage do that. It was that some people seem to think that only people who are 'successful' (i.e. well paid) work hard.

@AllProperTeaIsTheft apologies it was another poster who said people working on minimum wage worked the hardest so I was asking them how they defined working hard. Not saying people on minimum wage don't work hard, but I don't necessarily agree they work the 'hardest' which is why I was interested to understand how that poster defined hard.

I think good health (mental and physical) and networking; hard work alone no.

Just because someone who is seemingly successful says they worked hard does not mean they are also saying others who are less or not successful are not working hard. That’s what some poster are interpreting and maybe more indicative of their own issues.

If they worked hard they worked hard.

Many people work hard and achieve different successful outcomes.

There are too many variables to attribute success to one or two. But if hard work means:-

Effort physical and mental
Stamina going without in the short term
Attitude towards work/processes
Internal motivation
External motivators
Support and encourage
Degree of socio/enconomic and cultish barriers around them to overcome
Approach to problem solvong
Capacity for learning
Capacity to adapt and cope with change

But honestly….if you measuring success in financial and status terms only its crude.

cultural

In general I agree with you that focusing on money above family, friends and enjoying life is not the balance I want from life either.

I would say though that I think you are focusing on flash not wealth in your post. Especially for people starting off from a modest base, the expensive properties/cars/stuff is an issue if you want to be rich. They are wasteful spending when you need to be putting your money into investment that will give a good return (could be property, but probably not “expensive” property which is normally costly to maintain and about looking the part, not making money for you). Being rich isn’t about looking flash, which lots of people do living close to the wire and using credit cards. It’s about having money that makes money for you. Solid investments. A range of high, medium and low risk and decent hedging to see you through the ups and downs of the markets.

I hear you, but what I'm not getting from your post is the purpose of accumulating wealth simply to accumulate more wealth... and never spending any of it on anything? Obviously one reason would be to leave one's children a good inheritance, I get that, and another would be to fund children's education (although with both of those, I think they're problematic if they impact on spending time with one's children in the here and now). But beyond that, provided one has enough money to have the lifestyle one wants, I can't really see the point of making money just to make more money, not if you're never going to enjoy it or get use from it because it's all tied up... 🤔

Opportunities- knowing what they are, being able to access them ( you can't do an unpaid internship in London with no family to support you )

^ This, above all else.

I think it's more complicated than that OP - certainly there are people in good positions through all those things you say and often aren't particularly able or talented- - there are others who are there by sheer graft and others who took a good idea and ran with it - but you have to be consistent and a bit of luck comes into play too , be it lack of divorces, kids with no issues, suppliers not going bust etc - I also think not expecting a champagne lifestyle on beer money wages helps. If you aren't born into family wealth it certainly means that getting on usually involves consistent graft , plenty of luck or having a successful business.

I believe this is correct. Drive, ambition and a willingness to take risks along with at least moderate intelligence will set you in good stead.