To say that ‘hard work’ alone will never make you rich?

[ThisWaryOtter]

If hard work was all it took, wouldn’t every low-paid worker be wealthy? Isn’t success more about luck, connections, and privilege?

Yep. Sacrifice is a big one. Sacrifice time with family/friends, hobbies etc. Being driven and single minded, even selfish, so you have tunnel vision on your end goal plus resilience to set backs.
Too many people want the trappings of wealth before they are wealthy ie bigger house/car/holidays etc which means they won't ever be wealthy.

Hard work from childhood together with a strategy. There are plenty of examples around the world of people who came from nothing and made a success of their lives. The difference is that they have imagination, drive and self belief.

The big thing that most people need to be successful is confidence. Hard work may be necessary (although not always) but confidence is the essential thing.

The confidence to take risks, push yourself forward in work, to move location if necessary, to take on unfamiliar tasks, to lead others. These are all things that most successful and/or self made wealthy people have.

Good health, both physical and mental also helps a lot.

Bring academically successful or having high intelligence is not necessary beyond a certain level. You get diminishing returns on this the higher you go.

It's not just about how much you earn but how you spend
Someone on NMW who is careful, doesn't rack up debt and budgets/saves will be better off than someone who spends every penny they have and more, then pays interest on the interest for stuff they bought 5 years ago
They moan about being " skint" on a salary of 45K , can't pay their bills, life is sooooo unfair "someone" should do something who? and get the arse if someone suggests a budget or a second job

It's not always unfair, it's often stupidity

I didn't work hard in school, mainly because I found it easy and got the grades without much effort. I do, however, have a ferocious work ethic and have always worked my arse off in every job I've had since 16.

Unfortunately, I didn't really know what to do with that education and fell into teaching, where hard work is just the norm. Could I work my way up to be a headteacher? Probably. Would I end up working more hours? Not sure, tbh. Would I want to? No. The reason I stayed was because I love teaching my subject. Spending my life in meetings and talking about bollocks strategies and living in fear of being sacked after the next ofsted doesn't appeal.

You won't be successful without some form of hard work, whether that be hard work positioning yourself in the right place at the right time, changing jobs, building your own business. Whatever it is, it isn't going to happen to anyone laying around on the sofa.

No privilege, connections or luck here. DH and I are from v humble beginnings

I worked hard at my education AND made good decisions.

For example I realised my first chosen profession aged 20 was terrible conditions and pay and not good for family life, which I wanted. So I trained to be a teacher (in hindsight not great for family life either)

I’ve since sacrificed a lot to retrain and have an above average income.

My DH did none of those things but has worked hard at learning through work but at key points, I’d say 2 times, he made brave decisions that catapulted him forward and he has worked hard to max out this opportunities. I worry about how hard he works and the impact on his health.

DH oversees graduates who have had privilege and they get to an admirable point - way above average salary aged 25 with great prospects but some of them are bone idle and have appalling attitudes.

In my role I come across a real cross section of society from affluent and disadvantaged areas. Some of the barriers for ‘success’ are cultural constraints in what is expected. Working class or the so call underclass pass on what they don’t know and the cycle repeats- it’s really hard to break this.

At the other end I’ve met people who are highly successful if we talking about money and status but are really fecked inside because of the parental pressure of over bearing expectations and that love and approval was dependent on attainment - in some cases my DS friends for example they have been told what to study and what jobs they are expected they were not allowed to choose

So really it depends on how you define success and at what cost and sacrifice

You could argue hard work in teaching is fruitless as it’s never enough due to the system - if there was ever one example that hard work isn’t enough for success it’s maybe this. However if you don’t work hard you literally will sink.

The best guide to where you'll end up is where you start. Bootstrap millionaires are hens teeth and often use a great deal of poetic licence when recounting the level of help they had along the way. Obviously some improvement in circumstances is possible if you have natural ability and put it to good use, and/or if you're lucky, right place right time sort of thing. But most people work with varying levels of effort and live and die within the same broad wealth band.

I’d say 80% of success is hard work - I know plenty of clever people who are just not prepared to take the hours and stress of the type of career they are capable of.

Confidence seems to be the biggest factor in success. Privilege helps (educational opportunities, family money/connections, good health, etc) and of course luck plays a huge part. Meritocracy is largely a myth, though there are always exceptions. Hard work alone is not enough but is a more comforting narrative to tell kids and ourselves.

Hard work alone is not enough but is a more comforting narrative to tell kids and ourselves

this

But isn't that 'success'?

Recognising that your time on earth and how you spend it is very important, more than slaving away to accumulate more wealth that isn't needed?

Obviously you need to cover the bills and have security. But once you have that lots of people choose to spend more time with their friends and family or in enjoyable activities rather than at the grindstone to 'successfully' buy a bigger house/1st class holidays to the Maldives.

The most successful people I know live very charmed lives, work only being quite a small part of that.

It's not necessarily entirely about nepotism but the connections you have and the lives you get to see.
I have a friend who was brought up you know pretty well our family went to private school and everyone she associates with has a lovely life. She has a huge beautiful house and is not yet 40. I asked her once if she ever just stood there in amazement that she owned this amazing house and she answered that she had never really thought about it and had just expected she would live somewherele like that.

Not that there's anything at all wrong with my friend's attitude but I can assure you the majority of people growing up on council estates do not see their future self-living in a house worth nearly a million quid.

If you're surrounded by role models who are doctors, lawyers, businesses people etc expecting that you can do that. But if it is so far removed from your reality that it seems that's something other people do it's hard to get out of that mindset.
It's also the little things like I have been organising work experience for my kids and because I know a few professionals I have been able to offer my children a range of experiences and also they have been able to go and chat with their uncle and my friend who is an architect. If you don't know these people it's much harder to arrange to do this.

It is also about expectation. If you expect your children to work hard and do well academically this is one of the biggest factors in ensuring that they do. My kids have friends whose parents hold no value over education, and thus their children don't either. Those children whose parents do have a privilege that is ingrained from a young age.

I always think that 'working hard' should really be 'working smart'. I have seen many people get ahead in the workplace simply because they were good at networking (ie kissing the CEO and board's backsides...) and at constantly talking up their achievements while doing little actual work. While the real hard working people who kept their head down and did all the work got little reward.

Also a lot depend on upbringing/parents' financial situation, gender, race, having disabilities/long term health conditions.

You only have to look at governments we have had in the past few years: well connected, over-confident and wealthy individuals who go to the top because of their connections rather than any sign of competence, talent or 'hard work'...

I think that is a big issue in our society as a whole: inequalities are rampant.

I personally think being out to find a good work live balance, where you don't have to be stressed means you are much more successful than somebody who might be rich but stressed and working through their best years.

And you don't even get sympathy when you complain, because everyone knows a teacher who never works weekends or holidays and says it's easy😄

Yes, they're that colleague always off 'sick', so they can catch up and not spoil their time off. Or the one who always needs resources but never shares. Or moves jobs rapidly so they don't get caught out.

Hard work is an irrelevant term used by the rich to blame the poor for being poor (as in they wouldn't be poor if they worked as hard as me). Self confidence and self belief play a big part in economic success, along with circumstances, luck, connections and having an eye to spot an opportunity.

My husband worked from 16 as a fisherman. Out fishing all weathers and extremely early starts. Hard work has paid off for him but his body is knackered.

Hard work, progression - and also living within your means or below your means and putting that excess into savings, and later into investments when you have sufficient for an emergency fund set aside.

I managed to have a reasonable amount of money saved when I earned very little. Just by steadily putting away money consistently, not paying for things on credit, and working hard to live frugally - but still enjoyed life.

We only got sky channels about 6 years ago as part of changing broadband. Before that, we had lots of choice on freeview channels. We have 1 streaming service for a long time, but not 3 or 4. I got books (and DVDs) from libraries rather than buying them. We rented dvds and made a pizza rather than going to the movies and for a meal out.

We still had a car. We still ate good food. We still had warm, comfortable clothes. We still had outings - some free and some paid (even occasional movie/theatre outings). We still went on holidays. But we managed within a budget and set up regular savings. And we saved up to replace the washing machine rather than buying a new one on a credit card.

It is not always easy - and there were times I would feel hard done by. But I have benefitted from those actions by having the funds when needed and also putting in the hard work to get promoted over time. But I still use a budget and save money even now on good money.

Exactly. A lot of 'I worked hard and succeeded, what's your excuse?' Tory rhetoric being peddled on here. Some pps seem oblivious that what worked for them won't necessarily work for other people.

YABU. There are different ways of working "hard". Stacking shelves in a shop all day or waitressing is "hard" but will literally get you nowhere.

But working "hard" on professional qualifications, or learning a trade, or learning how to write computer software, etc., is far more likely to lead to you getting a better job or starting your own business.

Talking of starting a business, working "hard" will mean long hours, learning about buying and selling goods or services, marketing, administration, etc., usually for no income at all in the early stages and often working in evenings and weekends alongside a full time job to pay the bills.

You have to have a plan/strategy. Working "hard" without direction or an outcome in mind is pointless. But working hard within a framework of targets and aspirations can well lead to a significant improvement in your life, maybe even make you "rich" whatever that means to you.

I agree. It's about identifying opportunities and grabbing them. Challenging yourself. Pushing yourself. Changing jobs rather than getting stuck in a rut. Learning new skills. Building your self confidence and resilience.

My profession/business is accountancy and I've had literally hundreds of small business clients over my 40 years working life. The common factor in the successful ones (whether that means them becoming a millionaire or they just want a decent work-life balance to give them a good standard of living), has been confidence, drive, passion, and willingness to learn and adapt and yes, take risks. That's the same whether they've designed and patented a new product or whether they're opening a gift shop or whether they're taking the plunge to leave a decent job and start their own consultancy.

Hard work is only part of the bigger picture, but none of them get anywhere without the hard work in the first place, although that initial hard work usually pays dividends once their business is up and running and they can ease off and enjoy the rewards once established and successful.

To accept it as true would require us to also believe that white middle class men are the hardest working people in the world. I don't know about you....

But that requires a certain amount of inherent intelligence. It will be impacted by the quality of education you have access to and whether you have guidance of people who have sat exams, navigated university admissions etc, the option to study without having to work part time, have a faster laptop etc.
Two people in different situations could work equally hard at their education and have different outcomes.