To think lots of badly behaved children are getting passed as SEN

[Hometimeyet]

I am not judging anyone here but now 1 in every 4 children are diagnosed as SEN, while when I was growing up there were very few SEN children. I am in 30s.
Recently some of my friends DC were pushed and mistreated in School by children identified as SEN. I do understand that there are many children who are SEN and they need support but now I feel every new mum I have met in recent years, as soon as their toddler behaves like a normal toddler, they rush them to get them diagnosed as SEN and don't want to put effort to correct their bad behaviour and teach them discipline.
AIBU to think lots of badly behaved children are just termed as SEN and their parents are just not bothered to work with them to teach them value of discipline.

Most bad behaviour is as a result of this
' gentle ' parenting crap . Parents should be parents not friends . Kids need boundaries .

Ooh, late night goady ND poster. It’s been a minute.

I have yet to meet a single child who I think has naughtiness being excused as SEN and my dc have been in various childcare settings and schools for ten years. The suggestion in the OP just isn’t true IME and suggesting it is pretty ableist.

Children with SEN displaying bad behaviour still need to learn to behave.

But yes, I agree with you.

I agree with you massively OP

Here we go.

Absolutely - 99%

I would tend to agree. What concerns me is that support is spread ever thinner and the children who really need it are less likely to get it.

I think what many people don’t realise when they say oh they won’t get a diagnosis if they don’t have x y or z is that while this is correct because of the dreadful wait times for an assessment, currently a number of years in most cases if parents or staff have concerns then the child will be treated and accommodated as though they do have the need. This approach comes from a good place as it means that children who need support are getting it while they wait for an assessment. Unfortunately what is also means is that children who do not have SEN but who have perhaps a lack of boundaries or whose parents would rather not face into their behaviour being actually just bad behaviour are also being accommodated. For a SEN child the changes made for them at school will make an enormous difference to their wellbeing, for the children who don’t actuallly need to accommodations they will learn that if they ‘meltdown’ they get iPads and they don’t have to do their work and they can behave badly without consequences, it’s a mess but sadly I don’t see how it can change unless waiting times for assessments dramatically improve as it’s unfair to work a child with SEN not being supported

This is a good point.

Not to mention the benefits system being stretched further in the same manner.

I absolutely despise these threads that just want to enjoy ripping the parents of SEN children and the children themselves apart, under the excuse of claiming to not actually be discussing them. It's all excused by saying "oh we don't mean you, we mean some other type of parent", but it's just a nonsense.

I think everyone is a bit ND. I don't know a single person that doesn't have a 'quirk'. There is a difference between SEN (needing assistance to navigate the world) and a diversity that may not alter your every day life.

Also going in to adulthood, I have also encountered many people in the work setting who ask for a moon on the stick due to ND but have never been diagnosed / are pushing for diagnosis and not getting but use their belief to not carry out their contractual duties.

This,
As a parent who has a child with Sen needs I feel that it’s being used to excuse bad behaviour, especially ADHD, ASD and other ND traits, and minimises the needs of those children who require the additional support.

The problem is that parents observing from the outside have NO idea of all the factors involved.

You don’t tend to know if a particular pupil is behind in their work. One of my dc is working over two years behind in written work and because they are articulate no other parents will know.

I know a dc where there is elective mutism suspected after trauma. Again other parents will have no idea of all the factors there.

Exactly

I don't know that @Boardingschoolmumoftwo - really interesting!

Yanbu. Surely even with SEN there should be an expectation of kind behaviour, respecting teachers etc? It seems to be used as justification for all sorts.

Why do people who don’t like this kind of thread not just scroll on past? Save yourself the upset.

Because it's about children like my child, who has SEN and it's about parents like me. And people are talking such nonsense about it all, and promoting harmful crap. So it bothers me and I want to respond to that. Rather than let it carry on. I appreciate that it would be easier for people to continue discussing people like me and my child without being disturbed, but tough.

There should be, yeah. At least an expectation that an effort is made to do these things, even if they don’t get it right each time.

I think the issue often lies with the parents. If they’re shrugging their shoulders and giving it “there’s nothing I can do, he’s got ASD/ADHD so this is the way he is” then how will a kid ever learn?

It’s a shame as they need to grow up and function somewhat in society, so the parents with the attitude I describe above are failing them.

@Kibble29 maybe you could share how you would decide that my significantly autistic child could or couldn’t be taught certain things. Do you have a qualification in a relevant field?

I’m afraid it’s very easy to have views like those expressed in the OP based on no knowledge at all. But the OP is about as evidence based as someone saying the moon landings are faked.

And me too! My (adopted) DD1 of 15 has SEN, she wears hearing aids and has been diagnosed with FASD (Foetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder) and is being assessed for epilepsy after having two seizures recently. She’s being bullied by another girl with SEN and it has appeared at times as if her needs are being prioritised over my DD’s.

All children deserve to feel safe in school whether they have SEN or not.

I think that one of the reasons for more diagnosis is that society was less fast, noisy and overstimulating years ago than now. Many jobs that people used to do had a rhythm that we know can help with sensory needs so for children that might now struggle massively with sitting in a classroom all day and then going home and sitting inside, years ago might have done things like gardening, baking, fetching and carrying for parents, rocking younger siblings and other sensory activities that may have helped regulate them. (Same for adults - bread kneading, digging and hoeing, sweeping etc. are all excellent repetitive, rhythmic activities that can help regulate) There wasn’t the constant music/lights etc. that are everywhere today that can be overstimulating. There were more opportunities for movement and brain breaks than ch get today. Even in the 90s I can remember going outside for lots of lessons and getting more breaks from learning whereas 2-3 phonics lessons a day and filling books to prove to OFSTED children are working doesn’t allow for this. I think our society and education system is actively making neurodiverse people’s lives harder and so it is more noticeable than in years gone by.

Because views and posts like OPs that are ignorant, offensive and inflammatory should be challenged. You don’t get to have a little echo chamber I’m afraid. Mumsnet have said before that they have a problem with returning ND trolls so they might be joining in with these threads too. If you don’t want to see people challenging this stuff, then you can always be the one to scroll past.