To think billionaires shouldn’t exist?

[ThisIcyWriter]

No one earns a billion through hard work alone - it’s exploitation. AIBU to think billionaires shouldn’t exist in a fair society?

One of the real reasons for certain people wanting Britain to leave the EU was that they were starting to harmonise taxes so that there was nowhere to hide for the super rich. And you can see how protectionist and isolationist the US has quickly become under Trump.

Countries united and working together to harmonise tax regimes is the last thing that plutocrats like Musk want. They want isolationist countries and global discord. People fighting among themselves for scraps while they do as they please. And yes, it is frightening that they can become more powerful than governments.

As I mentioned earlier, giving so much to your own pet causes gives individuals far too much power and influence. Billionaires should give back by paying the tax they owe. Not deciding solely for themselves what causes deserve their attention.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/gates-foundation-accused-of-dangerously-skewing-aid-priorities-by-promoting-big-business-a6822036.html

https://www.vox.com/recode/22441627/bill-gates-scandal-divorce-epstein

https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-gates16dec16-story.html

It isn’t all or nothing though.

And a totally unregulated system isn’t the default. Capitalism is as much a construct as communism.

Its a forever conversation about where we draw the line between personal freedom and preventing exploitation etc

I wonder how many of the haters above have actually 'tried' to succeed?

There's a huge difference between doing a 9-5 in a shop etc, and the grafting you need to do to set up your own business, manage people, take risks, strategise, etc.

Those top ten billionaires are smart, and have worked extremely hard in a way that I envy. Even those selling gadgets on Dragons Den have all gone into massive amount of debt and have done serious research to progress their companies, often leveraging their houses!

I think people are more jealous of the ambition and initiative these people have, rather than the money they've attained.

Where I WILL agree are the supermodels, etc. There's a big difference between working your arse off and studying hard to succeed like business owners, lawyers, etc... and those who are naturally 'blessed' with the good looks the average person could only dream of.

Another 'thought provoking' thread where the OP never returns. Theres a lot of these recently 🤔

Didn't like to mention it, but.....

Let’s be honest though, this isn’t about billionaires, this is about Elon Musk.

Because there absolutely are billionaires who have done good with their wealth.
Bill Gates for instance has given billions to other causes. It’s disingenuous to deny that.

And what happens once you abolish billionaires, say that no-one should be allowed more than 100 million? Then 50 million? Then 10 and so on until people really do think that everyone should be equal.

There already are people who believe that nobody should e.g. be allowed to earn more than £100k, people who say they’re struggling living on £50k are ripped apart for daring to have more than the minimum wage.

There is a lot of poverty in the world not because of a couple of millionaires, but generally because of corrupt governments.

Africa is the way it is not because they’re not being given enough money, but because the governments of those countries are spending that money on their own needs rather than it going to where it’s needed.

Billions is an obscene amount of money, nobody is denying that. But poverty is far more complicated than the presence of billionaires.

Sorry but you have 100% bought into their BS that you could be like them if only you worked harder!

Lawyers aren’t billionaires. Your average hard working business owner isn’t a billionaire. The Dragon’s on Dragon’s Den aren’t even billionaires let alone the contestants! Being a Billionaire takes tax avoidance. It takes corruption. It takes hiding your money in dodgy ways and investing your money in unethical ways. There are very, very few expectations to this.

Do you honestly think billionaires work harder and longer hours than a nurse in a hospital? Billionaires are not harder working. They are not more intelligent. They are lucky and corrupt.

Some have a special talent (Taylor Swift for example) but most absolutely do not. Musk came from a wealthy family and invested his money in other peoples businesses. He didn’t invent PayPal. He didn’t invent Tesla. He bought them. The people who DID invent them aren’t billionaires!

I know people won’t believe me but honestly my ILs will be billionaires before this year is out. They started a successful business but that is not what’s made them (nearly) billionaires. My husband and I will inherit absurd wealth and we don’t deserve it. My ILs are not special. They are lucky and corrupt. Through them I’ve met plenty of insanely wealthy people. They are ALL lucky and corrupt.

What do you think causes those government to be corrupt? What do you think allows them to be corrupt? It’s unchecked wealth.

It isn’t about “abolishing” billionaires it’s about closing the gaps in society so that it becomes impossible to become a billionaire. No tax loop holes. No exploitation of labour.

It isn’t the “presence” of billionaires that causes poverty. It’s the systems which allow a very tiny percentage of the world population to become billionaires that causes poverty. Billionaire can ONLY exist if most people don’t have significant wealth.

How? What do you do? Have the police turn up once their bank account hits a £billion?

I think talking about taxes is such a distraction. Most billionaires are obviously not British and won’t be paying residential tax here- concentrating on tax treatment of the ones who are is a distraction that doesn’t deal with the point OP is making.

we should be having a conversation about how ie Roman abromovich became a billionaire and what he’s done to launder his money (Chelsea anyone?) and the impact this has had on the world. Look at billionaires and you will find corruption. It’s simply not possible without it

Or as the saying goes “get skin in the game” Often they are rich as they own things. Even lowly millionaires probably started a business. Talking self made not inherited. Often many failures, set backs and years of taking no salary from their side hustle (in the modern vernacular).

its ideological and (extremely) long term change. The methods might not even remove billionaires, but might have other impacts.

it’s about how we create and put a figure to value. Who says RA is a billionaire? He has assets that have a value of over a billion. How were the assets valued? To whom are they valuable? It’s a big question and a huge change to society.

but billionaires or their historical equivalent are relatively new, based on global consumerism

Obviously, the one most talked about atm is a twat. Some of them quietly go about their lives doing a great deal of good with their money, though. Long may that continue.

I love the Fran Leibowitz quote, something along the lines of “people on $12 an hour earn their money, people earning millions steal.”

It’s pretty much true across the board as when you’ve accrued that amount of money you are probably not doing much actual graft, but more just watching the money roll in. But arguably that’s just how capitalism works, and who’s to say that such and such billionaire didn’t start out by simply being smart and working hard?

So they would just move to another country that didn’t do that.

Funny you should mention Abramovich. There's increasing talk he owes £1bn in unpaid British tax.

@LucyMonth is absolutely correct. Billionaires do not get to be billionaires because they work hard, it's because they play dirty.

If you were a billionaire, would you give all your money away?

I think there should be a limit, no one needs more than 1bn that's for sure.

All billionaires are greedy. Nobody needs that much money. It's sickening. By having that much wealth you are, by default, taking from others.

Agree..Nobody needs a billion pounds.

Apart from me..wouldn't it be lovely 😁

Hello, we suspect this one was started by a previously banned poster who will not be returning. However as it has gained some traction we are going to let it run.
MNHQ

Irrelevant. There are currently no trillionaires- there isn’t enough wealth in the world to create one. Plenty of people want to be one. But it’s out of their reach.
this is all people are talking about- taking away the potential to become a billionaire

I agree. When you think about it, it’s a special kind of fucked up world we live in, where by someone has so much personal wealth, they could stand in their garden and burn £50 notes by the bin bag full and burn them for the next 20 years and still have more money than they could ever possibly need.

I don’t agree with communism of course but there must be a better way. The contrast between the rich and poor is utterly sickening.

I'd have agreed completely 10 or even 5 years ago but there are now pop stars making a billion from just being really popular without engaging in shady business deals or using slave labour to get there.

However, I still think they shouldn't be billionaires; they should give money away.

The thing is, the vast majority of billionaires became billionaires because they were willing to do anything to hoard money and are never going to be giving any of it away, and nowhere wants to be the first to introduce a tax or cap on them and lose their spending power. It would need a co-ordinated global effort and there's always going to be somewhere where billionaires can go to escape paying their fair share.