when people say 'don't let them get to you'... to ask just how exactly?

[VUtterlyFedUP]

If people are capable of getting to you, it's usually because you are emotionally involved and care what they think. So when they give you a load of undermining abuse, it's upsetting.

One of my brothers consistently does this to me. I wish he loved me. We were very close until our twenties but now I get nothing but undermining nastiness. It really hurts and I really take what he says to heart.

Does anyone have any tips or tricks to not feel that sick feeling in your stomach, the churning of anxiety and feeling so worthless and squashed when someone says critical underminign and nasty things to you? The problem is I still care so I have no way to access that 'don't let it get to you feeling'.

How?

“Don’t let him get to you” is victim blaming at it’s finest.

It’s now YOUR fault you’re upset. And up to YOU to manage your feelings.

Do you need to be in contact with him? Can you just remove yourself from his life?

Unfortunately I can't at the moment. Think birth/engagement/wedding type of situation incoming.

Its very hard to let it wash over you if its a family member. If he is being nasty to you then its more than likely some insecurity on his part and he is projecting it onto you.

You say you were close so what happened or changed the relationship?

Would talking to him about the way he speaks to you be an option? Is he aware his words and behaviour are hurting you? Is it all done “in jest”?

I think I would have to have an honest conversation with him about it abd if nothing changes then you really need to question if the relationship is worth it.

It’s impossible to not let them get to you.

Ive got a head and heart full of hurt from people who claim to be “family”.

The only way to stop it accumulating and hurting you further is to put distance between you and the person who is saying the hurtful things. Life is too short to put up with people who are nasty to you.

Step away @VUtterlyFedUP that's how you do it.
No matter what family event is coming up, you really don't have to put up with his shit.
You step away and if anyone tries to tell you that you are the unreasonable one, you tell them exactly what the twat is saying to you. It's his fault, not yours.

You say you were close so what happened or changed the relationship?

Depends who you ask. I would say he has a long term partner he lives with who has taken over his mind. He would say I am an evil bitch. I would have said I was right but now I feel like maybe I am just nasty and horrible. and then I stop and think about all the people who dont think I'm nasty and horrible. and cry.

What provoked this post was I just spoke to him on the phone and he was very unpleasant. I'm in the middle of organising something all the siblings have a vested interest in going well - think like a parents wedding anniversary party or special big birthday party.

He (who is doing nothing, not lifting a little finger) just was really critical of a lot of it in a nasty way.It's not just what he says its the tone so like he'll say "That's weird" in the sort of tone you might say "there's vomit on your shoes".

and I then say 'what's weird about it?" - frightened now I've upset him, made a bad decision or done something bad, or will be letting everyone down or will be in for years of him afterwards going on and on "but of course VUtterlyFedUP organised that weird thing'.

and I don't get anything constructive just a repetition of 'well it just is" and "I think its weird".

so I feel so shitty and very anxious and a bit frightened. Not sure why I'm frightened but I think because he hurts me emotionally so regularly that this is a form of emotional cowering.

It is hard. You need to put yourself in the position of power over how you feel and that takes practise.

If someone does something that upsets you, you have to try and think of it objectively. Ask yourself why does it upset you not why did xx do that. Once you take the time to see it for what it is when you think about it, it is easier to not become upset.

I'm close to one of my brothers but he does come out with some really shit things sometimes that made me feel hurt. By thinking about what he said or did objectively it helped me to see he was lashing out for his own reasons. I eventually saw that I cannot control his actions. He did it to get a rise out of me so he could blame me for him feeling shit about something and that meant he passes on the responsibility of him screwing up onto me. He can't do that now because I won't own it for him anymore.

I do still get annoyed but it goes away very quickly now because he has no power over my emotions anymore

I’ve been working on my self esteem in therapy and have an activity that might help you. The reason people ‘get to you’ is low self esteem, someone who thinks well of themselves can brush off other peoples bullsh*t comments because they have a mental reserve of self esteem and a sense of power and control over their environment that means that what other people think of them does not matter. It all comes from within.

The activity I do is brilliant (and helps me) but you’ve got to keep at it to continuously build your self esteem. It’s from the Thrive programme and I highly recommend the book.

Write down 10 positive things you have done/have happened to you recently. Best if it’s something you’ve accomplished - doesn’t have to be big, sometimes mine are things like ‘painted my nails to make myself feel better’ or ‘went for a walk after work to clear my head’ or ‘read a chapter of my new book before I went to sleep’

For each good experience on your list, ask yourself 3 questions:

What was it that made you feel good?
What would you say to someone else who had done the same?
What have you learned about yourself?

So, for the nail polish example:

‘i painted my nails and it felt good to take time out for myself’
‘id say ‘well done for taking 10mins out for yourself in the day, you deserve it’
‘ive learned that even though I’m busy and feel like I have no time, I can still pamper myself’

Keep the list on your phone and read it at least three times a day, going back over the questions. Take 30secs for each item on the list.

When you have a new item to add to the list, delete the oldest one and add the new one so you always have 10. This might be multiple new things in one day or maybe you don’t have another for a few days (but they don’t have to be big things)

Over time this will build up positive reinforcement about yourself in your head and I’ve found it to be really helpful!

If someone does something that upsets you, you have to try and think of it objectively.Ask yourself why does it upset you not why did xx do that

@MarkingBad I think it is as simple as it upsets me because he used to love me and think I was great. when he talks to me like that it shows he hates me and thinks whatever it is he is saying - I'm incompetent, self centred, difficult - whatever it is. So I feel upset because deep down I am going through this:

hes my brother, he knows me better than anyone, he used to be my champion.
if he is saying these bad things to me, then they must be true.
oh god, I am such an awful person.
this reinforces all the low self-esteem things I fear about myself.
I am a piece of shit.

that I think is why it upsets me.

It would be upsetting if anyone said it but its worse that its someoen who used to love me.

@CheddarCheetah thank you for that. that sounds like an interesting idea.

I know, right! It's right up there with 'people can only make you feel inferior with your consent.' (Eleanor Roosevelt.) That really pisses me off. How people make out you're a weak and pathetic loser if you are upset by something someone said. People can't help how they are, and the fact that they feel upset easily by if someone says something nasty or rude.

Sometimes it's a lot harder to not let things get to that people say, and a lot harder to ignore all their hate or bullying or goading. Especially if you see their faces fairly regularly, or you've got someone in your life who sees them. (Like if you've got no contact with somebody - but you're in touch with someone who's in touch with them.)

I think you need to change your communication with him and make it absolutely controlled by you. If you have to ask him something send him a text : Hi Mark, is 12th of March ok with you? Please confirm by next Wednesday. Utterly.

Don’t ever face time him. If he calls you make notes what he says - it will distract you a bit. Then tell him: I need to go now, sorry. Will text you later.
Switch the phone off and then tell to yourself: F** off you twat, believe me it helps.

And try to keep away from him as much as possible at the event.
Just because he is your brother it doesn’t mean that he is a nice person - there are mistakes at every family.

We always listen to negative words more than positive! I totally get it as I can be the same . However, consider if you would ask his advice on something important?
Would you value his opinion on anything? If you wouldn’t then do not listen to his nastiness either. His words are of no worth.

When someone is nasty to you, they are really talking about themselves.

You are no different now than you were before he chose to say this guff. This is a him problem not a you problem. He feels shitty over something so he intends to make you feel shitty so he passes the buck.

It's nothing to do with you or who you are, it's all about him feeling shitty and wanting it to stop so he deflects it

Sometimes it's hard to hold onto your sense of self in family situations but you have to for the sake of your own sanity.

Sometimes I think lowering expectations may help. With my stbxh, having accepted that he now tries to upset and hurt me and lies, then whenever these things happen it's less of a hurt and a shock, and more of an ah yes everything is operating as it naturally does and stbxh is being a knob to me as he does.

When someone is nasty to you, they are really talking about themselves.
You are no different now than you were before he chose to say this guff. This is a him problem not a you problem. He feels shitty over something so he intends to make you feel shitty so he passes the buck.
It's nothing to do with you or who you are, it's all about him feeling shitty and wanting it to stop so he deflects it
Sometimes it's hard to hold onto your sense of self inflicted family situations but you have to for the sake of your own sanity.

@MarkingBad I think there is a lot in that. He has a lot of failure and problems in his life and I think he is shitty to me because I take it and he can. Like kicking the cat or something.

I thought you said above though that why he is like that doesn't matter and what is important is why it upsets me.

What I meant by that was it doesn't matter why he is like that, that is for him to deal with. I was ineloquent in trying to explain why it's his problem he wants to make you feel bad.

You can only control what you do and how you deal with it.

I'm not kidding but right now I feel like when this party/event is over, I just don't want to have anything to do with him because it's becoming more and more painful.

I don't know if its me and I'm becoming more vulnerable as I get older/peri menopauseetc.

or if it's if someone metaphoricly punches you emotionally again and again, you eventually get to overload point - so even if the latest ones aren't as hard or painful as before, you start reacting worse because you are over sensitised.

or if I've finally realised it is causing me such problems because I feel very low and upset whenever I have contact with him. I have low self esteem anyway and it is like this has got to the point where it is pushing me to the brink. I don't have any spare confidence to bat it off. i'm broken nearly.

See him as little as possible

And look up grey rock to manage him when you are with him

I understand you love him, but he doesn’t love you - or not enough not to take out whatever his issues are on you - so it is an abusive relationship which you have to cut yourself off from it to protect yourself.

See a therapist to help you if you think you need to.

If you keep him at an emotional distance because you understand he is emotionally dangerous to you, you will feel better, and eventually quite a lot better because his hold on you will fade as other things and people come into your life.

OP, I really feel for you. I went through something similar with my brother, he was very undermining, mean and narcissistic - everything he thought was right and superior. He too had a girlfriend who loved stirring up drama and would fill his head with storylines and theories about our family. He once called me out on something that wasn’t my fault and he was really piling on the pressure so I would admit to it. I stuck to my guns and he cut contact for 2 years. After that time, he apologised and owned up to his mistake. I’ve never had that anxious feeling around him since because I know how to stand up to him now, he also knows I won’t be bullied into anything, I’d rather go NC.

Everyone has their limits, OP. Theres
no reason in the world that should allow anyone to speak to you this way - especially your own brother. I don’t understand the ‘don’t let it get to you’ either. It’s such a strange thing to say. Feeling impacted because someone is being hurtful towards you is a healthy reaction, it’s alerting you that somethings wrong and you shouldn’t have to ignore that.

Good luck, it’s a hard cycle to break.

It's ok not to have anything to do with him. You don't exist to be his punching bag.

The issues are his, not yours.

I don’t have any deep and meaningful advice, I’d probably just try to get through the arrangements you need to make with as little contact as possible/ contact in a group setting (think a group WhatsApp or email rather than phone) and then see/ speak to him as little as possible.

Practise a series of passive aggressive responses which he can’t object to like “That’s an unusual way to look at it” or “Thanks for your contribution.” Or if you have to speak just sigh and move on. Don’t question his goady comments. Thumbs up or laugh at nonsense on messages. Once it’s over just keep away from him and see other family separately.

It’s fine for you to grieve the relationship you had but if it’s been a while you need to protect yourself and your own mental health by keeping him at arms length.

The single phrase that helped me was
'A person's's behaviour says everything about them and nothing about you".

Basically, if someone is being an arsehole to you, it's because they are an arsehole, don't take as a reflection of how they see you, but as a reflection of who they are.

This enables me to not take their nastiness personally and doubt myself. That does not mean that I don't examine my own behaviour, but I evaluate it in comparison to the standards I hold myself to, rather than what I think someone elses expectations of me are.

You need Cognitive Behavioural Therapy.

Christ, everything you said in your first few messages came out of me during my 12 sessions.

With it you can hopefully learn what I did.
The power of fuck you, fuck him, fuck her and fuck them. It is a wonderful thing to learn. Of course, I'm kind of paraphrasing but that's basically it.

It's not you. It's him. Nothing you do will ever be good enough for him, so why bother? Fuck him. Nothing which goes on in his head, wants, needs nor anything he does is your responsibility. It's not under your control. As it is not under your control, any guilt for outcomes does not belong to you. HE is responsible. If he is unhappy about something you've done then it is HIS job to do it different. FUCK HIM.

The truth is he can't be arsed to arrange things himself but he wants to moan. Lazy bastard back seat driver that he is being.

He can do it how he wants it or he can fuck off.

I was you for over 40 years before I got therapy. Wish I'd done it sooner.

I think there is a lot in this. The emotional abuse I got from my family was pretty low level for a long time, but after years of experiencing it I reached a point where I'd get anxious before and during every interaction. And their words became my internal self-critic too. There is something about family that just cuts you deeper, even when you know it shouldn't.

I dealt with it by: recognising how I was feeling, and not blaming myself for it- you can't help how you feel, and your feelings are justified. I tried talking to them about it, but predictably they denied it all and nothing changed. I then massively distanced myself- less interaction has meant (after several years) their words impact me less. And spending time with people who make me feel good and seeing their reactions when I occasionally share things my family have said and done has helped me realise that it really was them and not me. Counselling to understand it all and address my self-esteem has helped too.

Good luck, I really feel for you. But remember, you don't deserve to be spoken to like that, and a decent, kinder person wouldn't speak to you like that either xx