Parents need to stop lying about term time holidays

[Ljcrow]

If parents want to take their kids out of school for a term time holiday because it's cheaper, I wish they wouldn't give the bullshit that it's an "educational experience". There's an article about this on the BBC today, but working in a school I've heard it all before. Can we not pretend that an all-inclusive to Lanzarote or similar is a rich cultural and educational experience?! If you want to take your kids our because it's cheaper that's up to you but don't try claim the moral high ground, no one's falling for it. (Fwiw I think holiday companies shouldn't be allowed to hike their prices up in school holidays, it's disgraceful, and as a parent myself I have no choice but to pay those inflated prices. It sucks.)

Feeling a bit sad at all the anger directed at schools here. Schools have to follow the policy set out for them. Our schools are not perfect but the education your child gets is one that of the most important and valuable things they will ever get. BBC also had articles this week about teachers feeding kids out of their own pockets and I know teachers myself that do this (actually ex teachers now). Meanwhile the ceo of tui and the other holiday providers make millions every year. They could afford to take everyone who has commented on this post on an AI to magaluf and even buy us the expensive cocktails that you have to pay extra for.

holidays are great whenever you take them. That is the point of a holiday. But out of everyone I know who has taken their kids out of school during term time for a holiday I only know one who did it for a reason other than price. They did it because it was family stuff and the school holidays were different in different parts of the country and it was a uk camping trip. No one else would have done it if the cost was the same or even just a little bit higher.

so when I see another news article where someone claims that their holiday is a better educational experience than school and the fine is a huge penalty it does annoy me. The article that triggered this post does not even mention the difference in the cost of the holidays at different times. It’s allegedly reporting on the huge increase in fines but completely ignoring the main reason people go on holiday in term time. We all know the prices don’t go up a little bit, they go up huge amounts.

I sometimes wonder if these articles are planted by the holiday companies as stealth advertising. That might explain why the people in the articles are all on package holidays and not city breaks to visit the great museums of the world. And also would explain why they rarely touch on the one thing that could be changed that might make a difference, namely the massive hike in holiday prices.

and to anyone feeling pressure to provide educational holidays for their kids. You really don’t have to do that if you don’t want to. No one is keeping score of how enriching your free time is. I think it was the freakonimcs book that showed no correlation between visiting museums and school test scores. However I did read that book while flopping around on a sun lounger in Lanzarote so might not have been reading it too carefully.

I am amazed at how many people on this thread don’t value the importance of education. “Schools can fuck off”?

If I were wearing pearls, I’d be clutching them. With no sense of irony.

Parents have a legal responsibility to ensure that their children attend school which is why there is a legal basis for fines and prosecutions!

By law all children of compulsory school age (between age 5 and 16) must receive a suitable full-time education. Section 444 (1a) of the Education Act 1996 requires children and young people of compulsory school age to regularly attend the school at which they are on roll.

As a parent/carer you are responsible for ensuring your children receive a suitable full time education.

Regular attendance is not only a legal requirement but is essential for children and young people to maximise their educational opportunities.

Absence from school, even the occasional day, is proven to have a negative impact upon a child’s educational attainment, personal confidence and enjoyment at school.

Breakdown of Fines: -

5 days or 10 sessions missed for unauthorised reasons: £80 per child, per parent/carer, paid within 21 days or £160 paid within 28 days.

If, within a three-year period, a parent gets a second fine they will be charged automatically the higher rate of £160 per child.

Fines are capped to two fines within any three-year period.

After the cap, if a child is taken out again, a Parenting Order or prosecution will be considered. If parents/carers are prosecuted and attend court there could be a fine for up to £2,500.

Research consistently shows a strong positive correlation between school attendance and exam results, meaning that students with higher attendance rates tend to achieve better grades on exams; in essence, the more regularly a student attends school, the better their exam performance is likely to be.

Key points about the correlation:

Direct impact on learning:
Missing school days means missing out on crucial instruction and practice, directly impacting a student's ability to understand and retain information needed for exams.

Negative effects of absenteeism:

Even moderate levels of absence can negatively affect exam results, with persistently absent students often achieving significantly lower grades compared to their peers with good attendance.

Id never say that but like I said I'm lucky because I live in Ireland and no fines, you give a note and basically the child is told to enjoy themselves, hasn't impaced on the irish education system, having said that I only took my my kids out of school in primary schools and in second year of secondary school, never when it was the junior or leaving cert, oldest child is studying medicine in Trintiy, second oldest is about to do his masters so honestly didn't effect them at all x

Your post comes across erratic, OP. Have you considered seeking professional help if this is a result of work related stress?

Not sure if you can access this link in UK but interesting reading from a school/principals point of view regarding taking children out of school, nothing I haven't said already on this thread but good understanding...
https://search.app/UQJFXY7f3QeLrUHQA

Actually, moaning about it does change it, if enough people do it in the right way to the right people.

(Sorry, this was meant to be in reply to a post that basically said that "this is the system we have, so no point moaning about it".)

What on earth are you on about?;

I was taking the piss...

My husband doesn't make the rules. His boss does. Just because you can't believe it doesn't mean it's not true.

If we are talking about comprehension....I didn't at any point say eating chicken nuggets was enrichment. I said that someone's experience on a family holiday was enriching. They may well have eaten chicken bloody nuggets on the holiday, but there's plenty of other aspects of the holiday that would be enriching, as I did explain in my post.

I'm not quite sure how you 'noted' that I'm not bothered about cultural or educational enrichment. A holiday abroad during school term once a year - and actually, I haven't taken my children out of school for a holiday since before covid - does not mean that I'm 'not bothered'. My children are exposed to more cultural, enriching experiences than most children, which was even mentioned in the youngest child's school report. One of my children is home educated, so we actively seek out plenty.

And staying in Britain... I want my children to have the experience of navigating an airport, going on a plane, sunshine, people from other countries and cultures....you know, enrichment.
I can cross the road and go to a beach as I live opposite one. I can go to the local swimming pool. We do - regularly. But that's not the same as being abroad in a hotel complex with almost guaranteed decent weather.

And again, with my husband not being able to take time off in holidays, even going on holiday to somewhere in Britain would involve going in school times.

I won't be replying anymore as tomorrow we are going to Liverpool to the maritime museum because y'know, I don't care about enrichment or education.

But it is children in deprived areas who lose more from missing school.

.

Nah, you don't, you're just a spiteful little twerp who's enraged you have zero power over me and mine :)

My happy, excellent young adult children in their good jobs and with great relationships and friends will never know you exist, and none of the wheedling, weird parents ever knew a damn thing me and mine did unless I chose to tell them.

Worked really well :)

What an obsessively strange comment 😅😍😘

No idea who you are though, so thanks for paying so much attention to everything I say 😍

Sorry, who are you? Why are you being abusive and harassing me?

I presume you are talking to me, maybe you're harassing someone else, not sure.

None of which even slightly relates to a theoretical discussion about how parents would respond to teachers taking time off during term time. And really, as plenty of us know, it's not difficult to remove your kids during term without falling foul of this particular rule. You just make sure it's not 5 days at once.

You've also over egged the pudding with 'Absence from school, even the occasional day, is proven to have a negative impact upon a child’s educational attainment, personal confidence and enjoyment at school.' The occasional day, really? Mmmkay. You'll find correlation between low attendance and other issues, which is of course not the same as correlation and is to be expected given the piss poor way in which the state provides for and treats DC with issues like school refusal and neurodivergence. But even taking those half formed arguments at their very highest, there's sod all evidence about 'the occasional day'.

They shouldn't be in a position where they feel they have too.

The old discretion days should come back. No one should be penalised for wanting quality time as a family.

I can see both sides. However, they are not just OUR children. They are people who have their own rights and responsibilities (UNCRC) and that is why world governments empower people outside of their home to make decisions about their welfare and wellbeing. With the best will in the world, as parents we don’t know what happens every day in school, and our children have their own feelings about missing it.
My sister is a teacher and she cried when the schools were shut over COVID.
Stop being an arsehole about schools and build a good relationship with them to support your child. Because you DON’T have full control over them. They are protected by law.

I meant no point moaning on here about it, or getting around it by lying about it, that changes nothing.

I meant that either

• you feel strongly enough that is wrong that you try to do something about it
• or you don't feel strongly enough about it and go along with it.

Couldn’t agree more.

the reason why people choose to take their children for holidays during term time is none of the op’s business.

👌🏼

I agree with you. But I’m not sure you go about putting your point across very well. You do seem a little…on edge?

Absolutely! People talk about their children as a possession, like a handbag 'they are mine so I will do what I want with them'. They aren't a possession, they are a privilege and a responsibility.

Those same people will want the state to 'interfere' when they want free healthcare, free schooling, child benefit. But not when they need to do the things the state is asking of them. It's like asking for your paypacket but feeling like we don't have to turn up to work to earn it.