To call the police to conduct a wellness check for my hoarder neighbour?

[Atmywitsend23]

I had posted last week about an awful smell in my new apartment hallway. It transpires my neighbour has been a hoarder for 15yrs and there’s amongst other things, vermin and sewage issues in her apartment. The smell is so incredibly awful that it consumes the hallway and my apartment too. I’ve contacted my landlord, the building owner and the housing regulator to try and get some help to deal with the situation. Nobody seems to be able to do much. Would it be unreasonable to call police or social services for a wellness check? Surely when things are this bad there is a significant mental health issue and someone has a duty of care in this situation?

I thought for a minute you were a neighbour of my Mother My mother's next door neighbour has caused these problems several times Fortunately she's in retirement apartments with a manager and they called in Adult social work with safeguarding concerns and it was sorted out

@Atmywitsend23

Adult social worker here.

Environmental health can do more than this. If there is evidence of filth and vermin then they can provide a letter than if not responded to will result in legal action.

Social services wise. Raise a safeguarding. It won't meet for safeguarding but should meet for self neglect. Say whether the lady smells? Looks unwashed? Thin? Say about the fire Risk, hoarding and feaces in hallway.

Nothing can be discussed directly with you as to what happens next. But what should happen is adult social care visit her, she likely won't engage. They will speak to environmental health and a multi disciplinary meeting will be held with the housing association. The housing association can share information under safeguarding.

The process is not quick as it depends on cooperation and if someone is able to make those choices or if they are deemed to lack capacity in this area. Keep logging everything and reporting. Include social services when reporting as this can build up a picture which helps provide evidence.

I would ring her landlord or housing agent and tell them you are going to the papers might not be a lie as there are very nosy journalists on here. Tell them you will also go to your local mp. This is not fair on you or anyone else in the building it’s not your problem if she has issues you have to look after your own mental health your 26 you shouldn’t have to all this the people who let her live there should be banging at her door. In the meantime can you plug in air fresheners in the hall or keep spray nice smells around and by her front door. Good luck op.

I would look at whether your Landlord knew about this issue before you moved in. You say the windows were open which looks like they were trying to hide the problem when you viewed. I would look at getting the landlord to release you from your tenancy and return your deposit so that you can move. The problem with Neighbour could be very drawn out and quite frankly you would be better to move if at all possible.

Have you contacted Adult Social Care? They are first port of call. Environmental Helath looks from different angle.

Police will not do much.

HA says rubbish in terms of GDPR to environmental health. Gdpr is trumped by safeguarding and partner agencies need to work together in such circumstances.

The landlord has a duty not to allow antisocial behaviour, which this clearly is. He needs to visit, which he has a right to do, and force the tenant to clean up. It's in his interests because it's his property that is potentially being damaged, and other people being impacted by this antisocial tenant can take action against him. But yes in the short term I'd call social services or police to do a wellness check.

Contact someone by all means but it doesn’t help. I reported my neighbour to the council, who did report to social but there was never any improvement, it only got worse, I lived there 15 years and eventually sold up (under market value) and moved. I couldn’t stand the smell, rats, families of foxes living in her huge overgrown garden and flies all summer. When the council tried to clear the garden she threatened suicide and the police had to stop the council workers.

I work in prevention for the Fire Brigade. We have no jurisdiction over single private dwellings. We can only enter by request/invitation to carry out a free Home Fire Safety Visit. When we come across cluttered/hoarded properties either through attendance at an incident of via HFSV (anything over 5 in the Clutter Image Rating) we will pass a safeguarding referral to the Local Authority. As others have said, you can contact Adult Social Services and make a referral with them.
You are correct in what you say though, hoarding is a huge risk owing to the increase fire loading and the difficulty for crews accessing the property to effect evacuation or firefighting. Risk is also significantly increased where the resident is a smoker, uses candles or has unsafe heating or cooking practices.

Former housing association supported housing officer here. I practically got flashbacks reading your post, OP.

It is really unbelievably hard to help hoarders. It is essentially a mental health issue, and requires input from a diverse range of agencies: MH service, environmental health, the landlord/freeholder and adult social care. That is hard to co-ordinate, as all those services are massively overstretched and under-resourced. In this case, I would raise a safeguarding with adult social care in the first instance.

And I hate to be discouraging, but in one case I was involved in 15+ years ago, the tenant was temporarily moved out twice so that the hoarding could be addressed and the property cleared and redecorated, but within a couple of years it was back to square one. A colleague tells me that it is worse than ever now, and the tenant's home is now so full of crap that they can't access their cooker, washing machine or use their bedroom. The HA can't get a possession order because the tenant is vulnerable because of their mental health.

If I was in your position, I think I would be looking to move. Even if the property is cleared etc, there's every likelihood that the hoarding would just continue and you'd be in the same position again before long.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this at such a young age when you should be enjoying your new home. Hope you get a swift resolution.

@LakieLady Just out of interest, is it theoretically possible to give the tenant you dealt with a series of one year tenancies in different properties so the problems never get the chance to build up too much? Or that’s a crazy idea?

Harsh and unnecessary as well as unhelpful.
Possibly true but unwarranted.

Horrid situation and clearly the neighbour has MH issues as well as very nasty habits.

Pity there isn't a charity that helps people with these issues. I've seen some independent "'clutter clearers' but I don't expect anyone will pay.

I've been on that edge before, and just managed to pull myself back, but its very hard once you get past a certain point.

My friend had this situation and it in the ends she just got to the end of her tether and said she kept smelling gas. Ended up with neighbours door being broken down. The state of the house was then taken seriously and the women was taken out and is now in a home.

Now I am not saying do this in fact I was surprised they broke in as I would have thought they would have had to have smelt it themselves or they would have brought a gas monitor to see if it showed anything. But knowing what my friend went through I can’t say I blame her.

She had rats coming in the house from the neighbours property and garden., terrible smells, drain pipes blocked time and time again. She was also joined on so worried about the fire hazard. The rubbish in the neighbours front garden has been set on fire twice by local youths and the last time it set friends bin alight as well. No one wanted to go anything but one mention of gas and they were in.

I'm borderline - just checked the clutter images and scored 3,3,4. I'm a housing association tenant and the welfare team found me a grant (I asked for help) to pay for a clutter cleaning service.

When the service came to look, they were really lovely but only geared up to get rid of stuff, then tidy what's left and give the place a good clean. I'd have loved it if my clutter was a 'hoard' but it isn't - I'm just disabled & disorganised! If I ever manage to organise my shit, I'll get them back to deal with anything that's too old or no longer needed.

The takeaway from this is that the HA surely could mobilise the funds and the forces to deal with the neighbour's problems ... if she wanted it. Which hoarders notoriously don't 😢

OP, this is horrible for you. I'm very sorry your first proper place is turning out such a let-down. I'm afraid I've got no advice except [1] Buy a fuck-off air purifier, and [2] leave. Am totally on board with giving your landlord hell and asking your MSP for help. MPs often get results from previously reluctant agencies. Fingers crossed for you!

Yea good idea to contact your local MP. I've worked in the public sector and any intervention from MPs tend to get responses.

Our neighbour (thankfully detached) lived in indescribable conditions. Social services were brought in on occasions and, true to the old mantra ‘an Englishman’s home is his castle’ nothing could be done if he didn’t want help unless he was sectioned under the 1983 Mental Health Act. For this to happen he had to be a danger to himself or others. Anyway, the problem is in the past now as, three weeks ago, we found him wet through, on the garden on a freezing cold morning after an inch of rain overnight, and he died shortly after they got him in the ambulance. The house was even worse than we thought it would be. I think social services call them Emas- elderly man alone. This won’t help at all and I do sympathise because these people are a great worry to family and all around them.

It might be worth contacting your local council's housing department as they may have a team who deal with issues with Landlords and this may include social housing landlords-my local council does but it could vary (although EH should have advised this I would have thought).

Save up any money you can and move out as soon as possible. X

Thank you for all your helpful responses. I have been informed that there will be a multi agency meeting next week and from this point forward they can’t give me any more information on the situation. I know that the housing association, environmental health and a social worker will all be present. I’m hopeful it will be resolved soon

Everything crossed for you!

@Atmywitsend23 thank you for the update.....i hope they get things sorted sooner rather than later 💐🫂🙏❤️

That's brilliant. Hope something is done.

The HA can't force their way in without an access injunction, even then that doesn't allow them to force the door. If access isn't given, breach of injunction would mean the HA could go for possession.

BUT

If there is mental health conditions involved, they won't be permitted to apply for possession until all possible avenues have been investigated which means multi agency working. Again, a slow process.

Suggestion suing the housing association is hilarious, you realise they are governed by laws and regulations that one, means they can't share a neighbours personal and/or medical circumstances with a neighbour and two that they can't just force their way into someone's home. Law requires them to act in a processed, correct way.

Can you put a camera/ring doorbell up in the hallway - people like this don't change habits so very likely they'll act similarly and make a mess there again - catch it on camera and ask the police to deal.