Neurodivergent husband has brought me to my knees, am I unreasonable to leave him ?

[MyNextSteps]

This is my first Mumsnet post so I'm sorry but this will be a long rant. But I have really lost my way and would appreciate everyone's thoughts.

My husband and I are in our late 50s and have been married for 25 years and have 5 kids who are late teens/20s.

The marriage has always had something "not quite right", something missing which I couldn't explain. DH didn't have many girlfriends I thought he was just shy. Once married I always felt he was avoidant, pulling away, preoccupied, unavailable, never initiated sex. If I ever tried to raise it, even gently, he was irritable and defensive, saying my "constant criticism and oversensitivity" was the problem and then he'd try to run away or hang up the phone or get busy or fall asleep or get one of the kids to interrupt us to shut me down. He is also very interested in facts not feelings and tends to disconnect from conversations once he's satisfied himself of the facts.

Eventually I dragged DH to therapy wondering if he was a covert narcissist but this year he's been diagnosed with High Functioning Autism Level 1 (Aspergers) which explains everything. I feel I'm in a nightmare as our story started out as a fairytale with our beautiful kids but now I'm acceptingw nothing will change with DH.

We both had good careers but I stayed at home to raise the kids. He worked hard to provide for us all but had a long commute. We moved out to the coast and bought a rambling old house with land, did it up and we have a small holding with animals. DH seemed to avoid intimacy but I didn't question it as he was tired and working so hard and so was I. He never took me out in the evening or hired a babysitter or took me away for a few nights. We only ever went away with the kids but I was so in the tunnel of parenthood and we didn't have much money to spare so I didn't really stop to question it.

Gradually the kids grew up and then DH stopped work and I thought we would spend more time together but I gradually realized he wasn't interested. Once he stopped work and was around 24/7 and the kids were grown up, it dawned on me that he was just making excuses to avoid time with me and avoid intimacy.

We did years of marriage therapy but he could neither express his feelings at all (alexithymia) or understand mine. He just cannot hear me - all he can hear is that he's being criticized and then he becomes a professional victim. I have given him a million chances to sort himself out, so many times we have fought and he always comes back, says sorry but nothing changes. Our therapist said he wouldn't change and to leave him as he wasn't able or interested in meeting my needs.

Some of the worst family fights have been when I have been angry with DH and then he goes to the kids and portrays himself as a victim and me as the perpetrator. Then the kids (who are angry he's so weak) stand up for him. So I'm then fighting my own kids and he sits there with his head in his hands not speaking while it all kicks off between me and the kids.

So there have been times when the kids have seen me as the aggressive bad cop whilst he is good cop being their friend as he does everything for them, drives them around, gives them money and never sets rules or boundaries. Mum "wears the trousers" and keeps it all fair and accountable. Although the kids hate on me for being bad cop I notice when life gets tricky they all come running to me for guidance because I'm actually the only real parent.

Every time the whole family gets together which is now only about twice a year I work hard to cook food and make it nice but either my husband or one of the ND kids has a meltdown or shutdown which ruins the occasion and the family doesn't speak for months, I am beginning to dread get togethers.

Now his daily routine is to get up feeling anxious and then just drift around for the rest of the day, no plan, no goals, achieving not much, never gets together with friends, sometimes hangs with his family (many of them have the same issues as him) low functioning, wears same clothes for days. If I ask him to do something he'll do it eventually but then says I'm bossy and that he feels "controlled" and then makes sure the kids know it.

Some of our kids have various neurodiverse traits/issues and DH and I clashed seriously about how to raise them because as a ND himself his first instinct was to deny their problems and help them to mask whereas I as an NT wanted to get them diagnosed and get them help. DH also insisted that we don't mention anyone's diagnosis in the family (shame) so when several of the kids have huge meltdowns we are not allowed to address it with the other kids and I can see that they feel guilty and responsible when it's not their fault.

Things have come to a head in the last few months. DH was being assessed for suspected cancer. He wasn't able to process many feelings about that beyond being sure he didn't want the kids to know. I did all the worrying and supporting whilst he looked blank and numb all through Christmas. Finally this week he got the "all clear", he did express some relief but I was hugely emotional after the hospital.

The same night one of our kids rang up and shouted at me because she'd given a message to DH for me to do something but he hadn't passed it on to me so I hadn't done what she needed me to do. I was still emotional from the hospital so after she'd put the phone down I was angry with DH that he hadn't passed on the message. He denied this so we started to argue. DH then portrayed himself a a victim in front of one of our sons who got aggressive with me and goaded and shoved me (he's 6 ft) and started being verbally abusive and telling me I was crazy (he didn't know about the hospital or cancer scare at all so didn't know why I was so emotional). I said to DH "tell him to stop" but DH said "why should he stop abusing you when you abuse me ?" (professional victim).

In that moment after 25 years something snapped in me. I did something I've never done before. I calmly put together a small bag of clothes and walked out. I drove off and checked into a local B&B where I am sitting now with no idea about my next move.

DH has brought me to my knees. It's not what he does, it's what he DOESN'T do, he's just absent from our marriage. He doesn't want me to leave but he doesn't want to have a relationship with me either. He just wants a housekeeper/secretary/organizer/mother not a wife. I want to leave him but then I break up the family, we lose our lovely home and I get blamed for that by him and the kids, I lose my smallholding and animals and will have to give up my dream part time job that I have taken up in the last few years too, so essentially I lose my entire life as it is currently.

I rang DH from the B&B to discuss the issues. He said "all you do is criticize me, I'm a victim" and hung up. He didn't want to discuss the issues because he can't summarize or express his feelings. He says he can't change and I am persecuting him to do things he can't do. He then said by the way if I was moving out then he'd sell our home and small holding because he wasn't interested in it anyway he only bought it for me (first I heard about that, he was the one that insisted we buy it when I wanted to stay in the city !). I went back briefly to our home to collect clothes etc and he was just lying flat on the sofa staring into space, washing left in the machine overnight, last night's dinner still on the table untouched, curtains not drawn, animals not fed, plants not watered, post not opened etc.

AIBU to leave and break up the family and sell our family home and smallholding and rehome the animals ? Or am I overreacting and should I accept he can't change, stop asking him to and just suck it up for the sake of the family ? DH is not a bad person, we have a lot in common with our joint kids, life and animals. He worked hard to support us all, he's never been unfaithful or had addictions or been abusive (contrast I've been a drunk and screaming harridan more than once when pushed beyond human limits by rigid and goading ND family members). I am also nearly 60 and have let myself go with all the stress. Dating now fills me with horror, what are my chances anyway and my friends are having horror stories on Bumble.... I would also have to go back to full time work at 60 to support myself and the children would be hostile to a new partner as they feel responsible for their victim dad. But he is not my husband or lover and he's more friends with the kids than a father to them. He is a professional victim and he has no capacity for a marriage or partnership with me. I would be happy to live alone but I keep having the sad thought that I don't want to get to the end of my life without having experienced a true and loving partnership.

If I could find a way to stay with DH I would but I have tried to compromise a million times. I don't want to have an affair either but it seems that if I stay I would have to completely deny my own needs for love, support, intimacy, boundaries, joint parenting, joy etc and life is too short for that. Advice please.

Wish him well in life and goodbye.
Don't over justify yourself either. You are the author of your own life. Therefore if you dont like it, write the next chapter where you do.
I am 58 autistic and my husband and I split and divorced 4 years ago.
You can be friends after the initial 6 months.

Actually @bubblesbluesky had nailed it in that she described this as a 'beautiful moment'.

It is exactly this. Your inner self has acted and you have got out and you would be wise to see this as a beautiful thing as self preservation has stepped in to save you before your are entirely consumed.

Go back but only when you can do so in a neutral and grey rock form, hearing him as white noise only. Get everything you need, see a lawyer. Get going.

This time next year, it will all look so much better. Don't waste another minute of your life. Make every minute you working towards getting free of this awful 'marriage'.

Some great advice already in the thread. Good luck op. He is awful and you can’t live like that anymore. My big concern would be he is obviously going to completely turn your children against you in this situation as he has already manipulated them into seeing him as the good guy and you the bad.

OP I think that your first priority should be protecting yourself from further violence. Longer term I'd be stopping hosting family gatherings as it just seems to turn into chaos and stress you out. Longer term I'd look at what relationships you can build with your DC as individuals but it does sound like you all work as a group.

I think you should stay away though I get it's a huge wrench with the animals.

This a good example of the trauma a lot of autistic children go through. People trying to beat or shame the autistic behaviour out of them. They then develop mental health issues and personality disorders. The personality disorder is not caused by autism, but rather it is trauma they experienced from being autistic. In the same way NT children who experience traumatic childhoods also develop mental health issues and personality disorders as a result of that. But people seem to struggle to understand this and seem to think it is the autism that causes people to be abusive adults.

I am not minimizing those aspects I just wasn't talking about them.

We are in agreement that the relationship is over

It's rather unusual for adult kids to square up to their mother in defence of their father so whatever the situation it has clearly become toxic and both sides perceive they are being abused.

The father is not capable to talking through the issues, as he has alexithymia and is a consummate avoider of difficult thoughts and feelings. They just need to separate. I am not judging OP, just saying, it's futile for her to be screaming at him in the hopes of engagement from him.

Btw since the professional involved felt it was autism not narcissism I would imagine that is the case, despite the armchair psychologists all over the thread.

Everyone has a breaking point / moment of realisation / survival instinct and this is yours . Please leave him. You have done enough. Put yourself first or you’ll get to 70 and only have regrets you didn’t do it now ! I have started my life again twice over and it’s entirely possible.

I agree the only way you are going to extract yourself with the least amount of drama and pain is to say you care about dh but as you make each other so unhappy, despite the efforts to stay together you must let him go. That it’s time to end the fight and everyone will be much happier separate. That you wish him well.

Your children might well still plead or threaten you to stay with him. they know you are the only adult in the room, but you just repeat I think we will both be much happier apart, gently and quietly with no malice. This is the best way to end things as calmly as possible.

Tell the children separately and individually, in age order, asking them to wait before speaking to each other.

You need to live for your own sanity. And fir the other's' sanity as well.
The family is already in a state of stress and anger and violence. Why would you continue to struggle to keep the family together? You are not together.
It may well be, that without 24/7 contact, you will all become more civilised to each other.
You absolutely must never ever drink again. You need to start focusing on your physical and mental health. A very small detail you mentioned, but Once you become more balanced, your appearance will improve. But appearance is not a priority at this stage.
And why are you even thinking about finding a new partner at this stage? You might not want a partner once the dust settles and find that you might be content on your own. Just forget about new partners for the time being.

You don’t know what our professions are in real life. The two disorders are often conflated. Covert narcissism is notoriously hard to detect.

Sorry, I meant to say that it sounds like you don't work as a group.

What a nightmare, I'm so sorry about this mess you're in.

Look at the finances, speak to someone like Womens Aid, just to see what options are open to you. Really though, one of you needs to leave.

He hasn’t got a cancer diagnosis - he got the all clear at Christmas. OP was referring to him keeping the Asperger’s diagnosis a secret.

Leave permanently OP. You deserve more in life. Your husband has lied and made you lie by omission to your children all these years. He may not be able to do want you would like him to, but he knows what not to do after all these years.

Incidentally I know someone with high functioning Asperger's and they are a narcissist too. So hurt when someone slights them, but a manipulative, nasty piece of work who doesn't care about other people's feelings.

I'd love to know what a fly on the wall would report. I'm sorry to say OP but I think it would tell a different story to what you've told here. This is not a one-way street. I see two damaged people who have brought five more damaged people into this world who are in all likelihood going to bring yet more damaged people into the world.
That is not to say I don't have sympathy for you all - I do. And I am not trying to defend your husband's awful behaviour. I just don't think it's the whole story. It's an absolute tragedy and sadly for me very close to home (I'm one of the kids who chose not to have children myself).
I hope you manage to leave and I hope it works out for you all.

I feel empathy with your kids here. They have one hapless parent and one coper, and they see the latter continuously wishing the former (and trying to force them, through shouting and force of charcter) to be something they are not. And if they have inherited some of the hapless parent's personality traits, the sympathy will be stronger. I am in this situation. I would find it extremely difficult to forgive the coping parent for abandoning the other, and that may be wrong but would be my emotional response. My coping parent knew what they were doing when they married and brought kids into the world and have responsibility for those decisions.

So yes, leave if you can no longer make your own life within the confines of your marriage, but you will likely lose your kids too. They will, rightly or wrongly, see the abandonment of the 'vulnerable' parent - someone who has never pretended to be someone they are not, who has supported you in your desire for a small holding, has supported you through parenting etc - as selfish and difficult to forgive. Maybe years and maturity will being them round but I think you are in a lose-lose situation here, and trying to only lose the things you feel you can afford to will be key.

I am sorry you have found yourself in this position.

Oh god OP I was literally trembling reading this. It’s like you're living my life 15 years ahead of me. The only difference is that we have 2 children and one of them is level 3 ASD non verbal (no doubt genetic) EVERYTHING else is an exact mirror image!

No girlfriends
big career
absent/distant
always one foot out the door
totally own agenda
can’t communicate in any way without ‘critiquing and having a go at him’

we even have our own rooms I got so fed up of it. It’s easier now with my own space but I get very little in terms of connection or emotion or praise…always feel like I’m an inconvenience who is coming up short. Can’t leave him though as DS’s needs are so complex,

This is not a good relationship. And it’s creating a really horrible family dynamic. It’s not going to get better. You’ve been a ‘drunken screaming harridan’, your son has pushed you, all of your children, in fact, are being brought into the conflict and actively participating.

So yes, I think you should leave. It’s not going to be plain sailing, and I doubt your children will respond well. Sorry, too, about the likely loss of your small holding, but I think you will be happier on your own.

Respectfully please look after yourself and don't go back to this man. I used to be with a man for years who had the same ND issues, he drained the life out of me and was also I suspect a bit of a narcissist to boot. they always play the victim don't they.

Leaving aside fault, neither of you are happy and the situation has resulted in you acting in ways that you don't like. Your descriptions of being a haridan and drunkenly/soberly screaming at him don't sound enjoyable for you either.

Look at it from the perspective that you have already left, so the challenge is to not return. What benefit do you think adult children will gain from having their warring parents stay together? They have their own lives. You may well find that your relationships improve if they don't see you both constantly sniping when they visit.

Accept that the smallholding part of your life is over for now. Don't be thinking about jumping straight to another relationship, work on yourself and your happiness. He will probably be thankful of the excuse to have divorce as a reason to be a victim forever, but it will no longer be your problem.

Oh OP I’m so sorry, I dont have any useful advice but my heart truly goes out to you. You speak so calmly and matter of factly about a situation that must be causing you deep anguish. Sending huge hugs to you, you are being so strong with little support from those around you 💐
The early part of your post strikes a chord for me, I am possibly earlier down the road than you in a similar situation. My DC is still small, but I’m unhappy with my husband - the lack of true intimacy and him not wanting to do anything special together, and his constant deflection and anger when he perceives any criticism. It wears you down and i can feel my self confidence being eroded.
I know a huge change must be daunting, but it would be truly sad if you stayed in this situation for the rest of your life, rather than leaving to have a chance at finding true happiness. And by finding happiness I don’t mean finding another man, but just being away from this man who makes you feel so bad, and having this weight taken off your shoulders. I know it must hurt to think of losing the home and farm you have built -through no fault of your own - but you could have it elsewhere. A small country cottage could still have enough land for a big veg garden, chickens and ducks, maybe goats. A community to get involved with and make a new circle of friends. I really hope that you can find a way to put yourself first.

As an Autistic person myself - he's a shitty husband. I can absolutely see how you're at the end of your tether with him and his entitled behaviour. I'm glad you're leaving him, this sounds like the right decision.

All of your children are now old enough to know the truth. Withholding the truth from them has made your already complex marriage and home life even more so. They must be so confused with constant misleading messages from you both and this has exacerbated the toxicity. He was so wrong to make you keep secrets from them and it has been very damaging to them as well as to you. Now that you have left him, they deserve complete transparency from you …you don’t need his permission any more….so that they can have a much more balanced picture.

You are young enough to find proper fulfilling happiness OP.
If he won’t move out and that sounds unlikely as he sounds very mean, then I suggest that you do what is necessary to start a new, more healthy life for yourself. You really deserve that. It will be difficult to leave your lovely home but I hope you can take your pets with you eventually.
All the very best to you. I’m sure you will work it all out and I hope your children can at last show more respect to you once they know the truth of your situation.

The DCs should definitely be told about the cancer scare and the autism diagnosis.
The rest isn't really their business.
I'm still catching up with the thread, and I would just add - there is no reason why this should be your life story .
I don't know what sort of wedding you had, but any promises to 'love and cherish' have definitely been broken.