Talk me out of teaching

[Avaricii]

I don't enjoy my job. I've drifted into something that doesn't fulfil my need to feel like I'm making a difference. It pays ok.
I'd like to teach secondary maths. I think I'd be great at up to GCSE and have a relevant degree. But all I hear is that teaching is so stressful. What I don't get is why it's more stressful than any other stressful job? I'm stressed every day at work now so at least I would get a less stressful summer with my still primary kids who I feel are growing up fast at camp or at after school clubs.

I turn off all notifications when out of hours.
We've actually also brought in a more recent rule of nothing after 5 or on weekends. Only v necessary at end of holidays. This includes the staff what's app.

Ah! Private school! That explains why your experiences are different to the majority of us replying. State schools have changed beyond recognition in the last few years. Unfortunately there are many schools where an urgent response to a late night/early morning email would be expected. If it isn’t then you will be reprimanded. I was part time last year and shouted at in a staff meeting in front of colleagues for not responding to an email which came through at 11pm on my day off. It wasn’t urgent at all.

I was a secondary maths teacher for 14 years before I swapped to work for the LA.

In my experience working part time 2-3 days a week and it’s manageable. By doing this you have less planning and marking and so I could keep my weekends free for my own children.

Working full time would require at least a 50 hour week, sometimes more. I would be in school for 7:30am and not leave until after 5pm. Sort dinner and then get the laptop out again to plan lessons for another few hours. Sundays would be for marking.

Workload can vary hugely between schools with different planning and marking policies. However the pressure to get results from kids (especially in maths) is intense. You desperately need the kids to do well, but often they don’t give a shit and won’t listen to anything you say. Won’t do class work, you spend hours after school supervising them in detentions because they won’t do homework.

I was swore at, pushed, had things thrown at me. On the flip side there are obviously some great kids too!

You couldn’t pay me enough to go back into a classroom now.

My best advice is to shadow a teacher for at least a week. And while doing so remember they have experience and preplanned lessons that make it easier for them. Imagine doing the job having to plan everything from scratch and having no prebuilt relationships with the kids.

No, you're right, we don't have to. LikeI said, it's a choice between working late in the evening responding to those emails, or dealing with them first thing in the morning (because they will pile up quickly and issues with students almost always have to be actioned sooner than within 24h). I am less stressed in the evening than if I was trying to fit that in on top of the tens of things to do when I get to work.

OP, you need to go into schools and experience it for yourself. Everyone's experience will be different and every school is different. If you've looked at the statistics for those who leave, and feel for whatever reason that you will be part of those who stay, then just go and experience it for yourself.

If you want to be talked out of it, DH is a STEM teacher with 10+ years experience who has recently moved back to the public sector from a private school. He is now done with teaching completely. He has worked 7-11pm every night of the Christmas "holidays" including Christmas day and has been upstairs since 8am today getting his work done because it hasn't been enough to mark 180 full sets of GCSE mock papers (the school are doing double marking meaning every teacher has twice as much marking on these bloody papers) plus 20 A-level practice papers, let alone get all the rest of his planning and marking done.

He hasn't had a single day off since he started this job in September. Not a weekend. Not those "amazing" holidays he's beaten with a stick about by other family members when he says he's done with this job. Nothing. And he gets no annual leave where he isn't expected to do all this work. It never stops. I used to be a teacher and his experience isn't unique or unusual. When he was private he'd often be working until 10pm doing boarding duty and prep duty, so not as mentally taxing but it still requires a physical presence.

People saying "you don't have to do all that work" well the work still has to be done, it's just your choice whether you stay late at school or do it at home in the evening or both, depending on your subject and the school's individual bureaucratic processes.

If you're hellbent on getting into teaching, go private.

Then your union rep should be engaging with the management. SLT can expect what they like but there are protection for things like this. I absolutely accept that I have been out of the state sector for a while now but I still think it's true that whether or not teaching is a positive or negative experience depends greatly on the individual schools / management and the ability of teachers to compartmentalise and refuse to go beyond reasonable expectations.

You don't have a job anymore. 🤷‍♀️
I worked with someone who tried having real boundaries and working just school hours (including doing his planning and marking in the allotted PPA time) in his first job after his PGCE. He lasted 6 weeks before management got him on an "improvement plan" and he was out before Christmas. He was working on the checkouts in the local supermarket a few months later.

First job as a new teacher on probation I can see it not going down well but an established teacher with a proven track record and multiple options for references should not be afraid to say no to six am emails.

That’s ridiculous.
Why should a newly qualified teacher have more responsibility to respond out of hours?

https://youtube.com/@mrrufaeel?si=Ui7NW_MKmenl7ili

Have a look at this man's channel. He lays out in insightful terms just what teaching in the UK is like.

We have two union reps at my school. 4 years ago the Head wanted us to do directed duties in our undirected time (so before school, lunchtime and after school). They conceded as they have no backbone. It now means I do 2 hours of duties a week.

Lots of replies which imply that state schools are the pits. I'd just like to add that I teach in a state school currently, and while there are always going to be challenges, it is a far more positive experience than when I worked in a selective school which was deemed 'outstanding'. So my comment about finding a good school wasn't referencing state vs private etc. I meant that you will find a preference ... I much prefer teaching those from difficult backgrounds who really need the support to achieve, rather than the arrogant ones who are more than capable but choose not to want to work (I'm generalising slightly but I definitely found the 'better** on paper' school harder!)

@PrincessAnne4Eva The story sounds so awful but so familiar. I hope your DH has a supportive dept.

Why don't you post on the Education section off mumsnet? There must be teachers and other knowledgeable education-related people on there.

Unfortunately union reps are generally ineffective unless they have the support of all staff. In every school I’ve worked in that never happens. Schools are full of lots of people who moan about management and working conditions but are too afraid of SMT to actually stand up against them. Generally due to SMT spies in union meetings reporting back to the head. If I hadn’t personally witnessed this then I wouldn’t have believed it! That results in nothing changing and those staff who do stand up being reported to the head and subsequently bullied out.

I’ve witnessed similar. If you’re not prepared to go above and beyond during your probation then you are bullied out.

@TENSsion
You’re 100% correct but unfortunately that’s the expectation. If you’re not prepared to go above and beyond during your first year then you are judged negatively and are unlikely to have your contract renewed if you don’t. This message is given from the start of teacher training.

I've been teaching Maths for 10 years and I'm a Head of Department - I have only ever been a teacher so I don't have non-teaching jobs to compare to.

I broadly love my job and teaching and never seriously consider doing anything else - the students are excellent and fun and I love teaching.

Things that help me with being successful:

• knowing when enough is enough! I work really really hard during term time - but I will not work every evening and every weekend. I could (teaching is a job that expands to fill the time available!) and if you don't have boundaries you will burn out.

-relatedly, not being a perfectionist. -being able to switch off - this is probably surprising to my colleagues as I am the definition of someone who LOVES her job and is keen and goes above and beyond - but actually I compartmentalise very well. -find a sensible school with sensible policies and good middle and senior leadership. A lot of the horror stories on this thread seem wild to me - don't work anywhere with excessive marking policies and no trust in you as a professional.

There's a lot of cynicism against senior leaders on this thread. In my school they are wonderful, and do what they can to support teachers. Union representation has become more vocal in recent years, since Covid and the national industrial action, but the rep has a good relationship with the Head, and the Head listens. New measures reduce or mitigate staff workload, e.g. as parents evenings are now fully online staff can choose whether they do their slots at 3pm or in the evening after they get home, and each appointments cuts off automatically after 5 minutes (some parents don't like this, but the ones that experienced late-running appointments in the past, or who need to do their appointments from the office, appreciate the benefits). Also staff are no longer asked to do lunchtime cover duties - our exhausted SLT now cover those.

The lesson is, shop around for a school with a relatively happy workforce and stable SLT. At interviews you will get opportunities to hang out in the staffroom and ask what it's like to work there. No two schools are the same.

I know. I worked in schools for 8+ years.

I was replying to that poster thinking how it “should” be the case that teachers further down the line shouldn’t have responsibility to reply out of hours but new teachers should expect to.

No one should. It shouldn’t be an expectation of anyone.

I’ve been teaching 20+ years and am looking at exit strategies. There’s a well publicised recruitment and retention crisis in teaching and for good reason. I have 3 children and I feel like I’ve missed them growing up as I’ve spent my time and energy supporting other people’s children.
As others have suggested, take some time shadowing a teacher at a school if you can.

I can't talk you out of it I don't have the energy.

Best thing would be to see if you can spend a couple of weeks doing some sort of work experience in the sort of school you would hope to work in (primary/secondary). In fact when I applied for my PGCE in 2006, you had to have a minimum of 2 weeks experience in a school.

Where you work sounds amazing!