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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Talk me out of teaching

127 replies

Avaricii · 05/01/2025 10:38

I don't enjoy my job. I've drifted into something that doesn't fulfil my need to feel like I'm making a difference. It pays ok.
I'd like to teach secondary maths. I think I'd be great at up to GCSE and have a relevant degree. But all I hear is that teaching is so stressful. What I don't get is why it's more stressful than any other stressful job? I'm stressed every day at work now so at least I would get a less stressful summer with my still primary kids who I feel are growing up fast at camp or at after school clubs.

OP posts:
MerylSqueak · 05/01/2025 12:34

ILoveLeopard245 · 05/01/2025 11:20

There are lots of things I like about the job - I’ve been in it for over 20 years across secondary and primary. I work in a leadership role now but I’ve done some interesting education roles within my time. The days are varied and fast paced, and that’s something I enjoy. But I’d say the pace is not sustainable really and I am probably at burn out at the end of every term. However it is a job which is rewarding in many ways and I don’t regret being a teacher. I laugh every day and try and find the moments that remind me why I do it every day. I’d recommend getting some experience in schools if you haven’t already to see how you find it.

Lots of jobs are challenging, but I would sum the challenges up in education at the moment as -

increasing pupil needs and decreasing support- this is a huge issue and many staff feel like they are firefighting and not able to meet the needs of our children as there aren’t enough boots on the ground.

behaviour- we are seeing increased violence on a regular basis in schools across the board. Again, this links to lack of resources and support for children. Families are under huge pressures and often have to fight for the appropriate support for their children etc. I find it a bit like a moral injury- I know that some children require x or y, but there isn’t the staffing, funding or resources to provide it. This is something I find hugely difficult personally and I am retraining to leave, ( for a number of reasons so don’t be put off by me saying that) but this disservice to our children is one aspect that has become unmanageable and I can’t see improving with the budget pressures schools are under.

bureaucracy -in some settings anyway. planning, prep, marking and exams takes a huge amount of time and that is outwith your face to face contact with the children, parent meetings, school meetings, assessment, tracking etc.

lack of autonomy in some settings

work/life balance, especially when you start out, but if you have a supportive school that makes a difference

Lack of flexibility - the holidays are great, but time out to go to appointments, funerals, weddings, your own children’s events etc are less doable in many settings.

being generally disliked and disrespected by society - you need very thick skin at times but I try not to read anything online and stick to focusing on what I can do in my school for my children and families and drown the noise out. 🤣

I agree with this.

My twopennorth is that I believe the ability to cope with teaching Secondary in a state school (which is all I have experience of) comes down in part to your temperament.

For example, I started teaching at the same time as another NQT who was also in Humanities. We both worked hard and were reasonably good. The difference between us was that he had the great ability to shrug off a bad day or a bad class and walk away. I took everything to heart and would wake up with a burning need to improve some lesson plan in the middle of the night. I wasn't able to deal with the stress. It's no good to anyone, at home or at school. I think the ability to care up to a point and then say. 'Fuck it,' is really valuable.

I ultimately left due to the onset of a disability but I may well have done anyway. He's still there.

meloncotton · 05/01/2025 12:35

Avaricii · 05/01/2025 10:38

I don't enjoy my job. I've drifted into something that doesn't fulfil my need to feel like I'm making a difference. It pays ok.
I'd like to teach secondary maths. I think I'd be great at up to GCSE and have a relevant degree. But all I hear is that teaching is so stressful. What I don't get is why it's more stressful than any other stressful job? I'm stressed every day at work now so at least I would get a less stressful summer with my still primary kids who I feel are growing up fast at camp or at after school clubs.

It's a bit worrying that you say you'd be great up to GCSE.

My DS was stretched in year 11 (with others kids) doing some AS level topics which overlapped some of the harder GCSE questions.

If you feel you could teach A level too then GCSE maths is for you, if not it really isn't.

664theneighbourofthebeast · 05/01/2025 12:35

Maths is a required subject that many students dont want to do and aren't good at so will do anything to disrupt the class for their own entertainment.
Up to 30 students who don't care about you or you or your welfare and are resentful of even being in the same room as you and have zero interest in what you are saying. Hourly.
People are proud of being bad at maths.
The nearest support if there even is any can be several hundred yards away and you have no way to get it nor can you leave the classroom or trust a student to actually get it for you.
Every time you have to punish a student, ( eg extra homework or detention ) you end up punishing yourself by having to 'hold' the detention, or set and mark the homework, often twice in different coloured pens so you can point out they didn't take on board any of the suggestions you made the first time around and did in fact do nothing.
Every . Single. Thing. You do has to be justifiable and evidenced.
By the time you have tidied up, dealt with 1 thing and prepped for the next lesson you don't have time to wee.
You may not have time to physically prep for lessons because you may have to go outside and stand in the rain watching them so they dont kill each other or escape.
You will pay a fortune for your holidays and have to spend them with other peoples badly behaved children.
And you will end up spending that "not too awful" paycheck on basic equipment like pens (so the kids can just do something, anything..) and they will get broken or stolen because nobody cares you did something nice.

Is that enough?

keiratwiceknightly · 05/01/2025 12:36

I have no other jobs to compare it to - I've literally never left school since age 4 and I'm now 52!

I'm secondary English.

In my opinion it's a great job when it's going well. I've always loved it. But when it's going badly it is utterly miserable. And the last 4 years have begun to tilt the job I love towards a job I'm staying in until 55 when I can afford to stop.

What's changed? I think 2 things.

firstly the delicate balance between teachers/students/parents has absolutely tilted away from teachers; mostly since Covid but it was happening before that. Rudeness and inattentiveness is EVERY lesson now - I'm expected to just put up with behaviour that would have warranted a serious intervention by a year head a few years ago. That's because the SLT are constantly working on really serious behaviour- truancy, vandalism, swearing openly at staff - all things that would have been instant suspension once are now daily occurrences.

Secondly the curriculum and how we are expected to teach it. It's hard, it's dull - though it is much more rigorous- my a level groups are much more skilled when they start than they used to be. (They now need teaching how to actually BE a 6th form student - debate, be brave, self organise, meet deadlines etc, but they can analyse texts better!) That's one thing. But we are also being forced to all teach the same thing at the same time in the same way; I deliver centrally produced PowerPoints rather than devise my own lessons. Much less of my own time used there, but much less fun for me or the kids.

If that sounds ok, go for it. But if you think you'll inspire young minds to love you and your subject, think again. Dangerous Minds it ain't.

Saltandvin · 05/01/2025 12:37

Avaricii · 05/01/2025 11:58

There are a lot of vague "i wouldn't go into teaching. I hated it and left stressed"

But from those who have given reasons it seems to be.

  • shitty SLT (which you can have in any job and aren't everywhere)
  • being undervalued (again could be at any crappy workplace)
-kids that are abusive (but then others saying that the kids are the only good part)
  • working more than 9-3 (playing catch up in the evenings and weekends. But I work 8-6 with a 1hr commute at each end so I don't see this as Big negative)
  • not being able to switch off. Although others who have been positive say that this is a necessary skill to get through a teaching career.
  • poor pay.

If there are any I've missed Let me know!

All are really valid points and worthy of working out what I can handle. I think shadowing a teacher also makes a lot of sense.
When I hear 'kids just want to be youtubers' I get that. But then I start to think of ways that maths can be relevant for youtubers. And maybe that's naive? And there is really no time to make maths interesting and fun within the curriculum now?

I think you've misunderstood the time thing. People are saying they work 8-6 (and will also have a commute) and then are working in the evening/at weekends as well. I do this as a primary teacher and am very regularly complimented by colleagues on my great work-life balance and boundaries which I find rather odd. It's the same in many professions but equally there are many jobs where this is not the case.

I also wouldn't pay too much heed to 'my friend is a teacher...'. I don't moan to my friends so they only really hear about the nice bits of my job. They really don't have a clue about the hours I work or the bits I find stressful, just like I wouldn't offer an opinion on their jobs.

Really, you just need to go into a secondary and observe. Or a couple of different secondaries. That'll give a good starting point as to whether the behaviour at least would bother you.

Hankunamatata · 05/01/2025 12:37

Go and try and do some volunteer work in a high school.
My sons have amazing maths teachers they adore (school with kids with lots of issues). They are amazing at engaging, dealing with stroppy, rude, emotional teens.

Snugglemonkey · 05/01/2025 12:41

Read any thread on here about teachers. They are overworked and underappreciated.

RhaenysRocks · 05/01/2025 12:49

I definitely agree about boundaries and knowing that "good enough" is fine. I love teaching but I do it because I like it, not to make a difference or anything worthy. My kids like my lessons on the whole and I get good results. I don't spend time researching new pedagogy or revising lesson plans beyond what I absolutely need. A lot can be done with a whiteboard pen on the spot. I wing it more than I should probably but I'm good at what I do and only choose to care about a limited number of things.

oustedbymymate · 05/01/2025 12:54

I'm a secondary school teacher. It is very rewarding. However in some schools the behaviour is appalling you effectively spend your day firefighting. There's no actual teaching happening yet your kids are still expected to make progress etc. without robust systems in place it's a shit show. So be prepared that no matter how many hours you spend planning lessons you will be having to deal with shit behaviour at some point and some of it down right nasty.

TENSsion · 05/01/2025 12:57

Saturdayssandwichsociety · 05/01/2025 11:22

I don't think its a good sign that you say 'i think id be great up to GCSE'. This suggests you don't feel confident about teaching A-level maths and if you don't feel confident to teach A-level maths are you going to be capable of stretching/challenging the top set at 16?

Our children deserve proper subject specialists teaching them not just people who think they'd be 'great up to GCSE' and I wish government would be clearer about this, there are so many weak and poorly qualified maths and science teachers around now.

😂😂😂
I have a friend who qualified as a PE teacher who now teaches secondary English on the strength of his C grade English A level.

The whole system is in a mess. At this point, I’d be grateful to have a teacher with a maths related degree teaching my child for an entire year.

TheMoth · 05/01/2025 13:00

So much depends on the kind of school you're in; your head; your dept.
I've done it for half a lifetime now, in a range of schools (special measures to outstanding) and I've probably loved and hated it equally.
If u had the choice again, I'd have gone into a job with lower starting salary but better long term prospects.

Having said that, being on stage 5 hours a day definitely suits my personality. As does learning new poems/ plays etc. It's the stuff behind it that I hate- which has all been covered in detail here.

I'm currently building myself up to go and do some final bits of work before school tomorrow, having spent a couple of days planning and organising.

greycatmoth · 05/01/2025 13:00

Tldr all the responses- but I teach in a secondary, and I really enjoy it. I teach food technology. There are some challenging children- but more good ones. I think it helps I picked a subject which is pretty universally enjoyed and hands on. It also has very little home work until you get to gcse.

Osory · 05/01/2025 13:00

I retrained as a primary teacher 12 years ago and I love it. So much more varied interesting and rewarding than working in an IT multinational like I was before.

However I love the principal teacher and the school I'm in so that is a huge help.

Good luck in your decision!

ThrallsWife · 05/01/2025 13:04

Alright, specifics:

The "shitty SLT" mentioned here (many I met have been lovely) comes down to lack of management training. Often, people who know how to get results or with the right level of time/ confidence are chosen for the job rather than those who are suited for management. They go into SLT without any management training. The same goes for anyone who is head of/ deputy head of department. So you can end up with a whole bunch of people good at talking the talk and fudging results, but with zero skills to actually lead a team.

Targets for students are so out of touch with reality that you will be put under huge pressure to get results. My school, like many, has yet to acknowledge that performance related pay is gone; we still have targets for results to meet on an individual basis in order to get pay progression. So if you get many bottom sets with lots of students not turning up to school on a regular basis and others not caring, you will be denied a move up the ladder, putting you under huge pressure to achieve and prove everything you did to try and prevent that.

Workling hours are looooong. I have people still emailing me at 10.30pm - sometimes colleagues, sometimes parents. Sometimes it can wait, but often a solution is required before teaching begins again the next day - often because of an issue with a pupil, which has to be addressed, or because everything is done evry much last-minute in many schools, even if you yourself are organised. So if you don't want to get into work the next day and have to deal with 15 emails while also trying to set up your teaching day, you respond and work late at night.
We get into work at 7.30, partly because many schools only have 2 working copiers for the whole school and everyone needs one, partly because meetings start at 8.15am, up to 3x a week, and you need some time to set up. You teach until 3.15, then have duty, then after-school clubs or intervention or meetings so you don't actually finish contact time until 4.30. Then you make phone calls, tidy up, plan some stuff and whoosh it's 5.30 and you have to pick up your own kids. Then you sort them, after that you work - often marking is involved, too. You also have parents evenings and open evenings up to 12x a year at secondary level, and some twilight sessions run until 6pm, pushing everything else back.

Behaviour is worse than I've ever known it. A mixture of unsupportive, overly stressed and overworked parents not dealing with behaviour at home, management who have bought into the whole "building relationships" trope (which pushes all work and responsibility for behaviour onto you while giving you none of the support) and pupils who don't sleep, are addicted to tiktok and know they can get away with murder. You will have child criminals sitting in your classroom and children with anger issues so severe that they are a danger to themselves and others.

You will have zero time for yourself in school. PPA is given at the minimum schools can get away with, because there is no money to employ enough staff or to employ cover teachers. You will miss breaks to duty. You will have meetings in your PPA time. Lunches are often so short now that you don't have time to sit down and eat. You will not be able to go to the loo when you need to.

And there is no flexibility for you. I have had my heating break down this weekend. Do you know when I can get it fixed? Next weekend, thanks to a very generous engineer, who is prepared to work weekends. Not many are. That's because by the time I'm home he also has to look after his kids. So now I have a week without heating in the first big cold snap of the winter. I have had this happen with all sorts of things that I needed tradesmen for. Long waits if I was lucky, paying dodgy firms that subcontract on a 24/7 basis over the odds if I wasn't, because in many schools taking time off for such things as trying to have hot water at home is really frowned upon.

These are just some of the stressors. There are more.

TENSsion · 05/01/2025 13:09

I loved teaching secondary. I did it for 8 years. You expect a bit of bolshiness from teenagers and on the most, they were actually really funny.
Towards the end, the expectations and attitude of SLT and management became too much. I expect to be spoken to badly by a hormonal 13 year old who is being abused at home, not from a 52 year old man on £65k a year.
I went on to work with victims of domestic abuse. It was just as rewarding (if not more!) but the support I got from my managers and colleagues meant what should have been a much more stressful job was actually far more calm.

monkeysox · 05/01/2025 13:10

RhaenysRocks · 05/01/2025 10:59

@toomuchfaff of course it's not the norm to work without pay. Only student teachers on their training year do that. Other routes into teaching pay from day 1. OP you will get lots of horror stories but honestly I love it and would never do anything else. Secondary maths is a great choice as it's valued by parents and staff and even kids accept that it's important. Whenever I cover a maths lesson there's never any sort of bother, the kids know they need to get on. A lot depends on the type of school you are in but assuming you show yourself to be competent in interview lessons you'll be able to have your pick.

Tbf there is almost £30000 bursary

CrushingOnRubies · 05/01/2025 13:13

@ThrallsWife 100% agree on the lack of management training in SLT and HODs. Friends in the pros are sector are always shocked when I say they get little to no training

monkeysox · 05/01/2025 13:21

Avaricii · 05/01/2025 10:38

I don't enjoy my job. I've drifted into something that doesn't fulfil my need to feel like I'm making a difference. It pays ok.
I'd like to teach secondary maths. I think I'd be great at up to GCSE and have a relevant degree. But all I hear is that teaching is so stressful. What I don't get is why it's more stressful than any other stressful job? I'm stressed every day at work now so at least I would get a less stressful summer with my still primary kids who I feel are growing up fast at camp or at after school clubs.

I have inboxed you.

FreshAirForwards · 05/01/2025 13:29

I'm not a Maths teacher but I've observed Maths teachers stick together so the character of the Maths HOD will also be crucial.

If you can, get into a couple of local schools to meet the maths department. We regularly get approached by people in your position wanting to come in and see how it all works and have a chat, watch some lessons. Having taught in 5 schools in the space of my career, I have yet to meet a maths department who didn’t get along swimmingly with each other and adore their subject. I think meeting other maths teachers might be key here. Most of my department have been in our school for 10 years plus and a good number of us have extra responsibility around the place. Lots of flexibility for part timers and shared classes in our setting means that our newer colleagues are well supported by us old timers which can be crucial in your early days I’d say.

Itsrainingatlast · 05/01/2025 13:38

This is my 30th year; I’m SLT in a challenging inner city school in the SE. I earn just into 6 figures. I’ve got older teens of my own and have been a single parent for most of it, so it absolutely is doable with a family (I’ve been SLT since my eldest was 18 months old).
It is feast or famine. Term time is tough; 10 hours a day minimum which is pretty much non stop, but I rarely work in the evenings or weekends (I don’t teach at all so no planning or marking). I’m the DSL so my emails were on for the whole of the holidays (including bank holidays), but I think there was only one I had to respond to - I’ve spent less than two hours working over the holidays in total.
As PP have said, the curriculum is very dry (knowledge/memory rather than skills based), but the gov have started a huge curriculum review which will report initial findings in the spring. There is a lack of trust at all levels, very top down from the MAT/Ofsted/DfE. SLT get it from above and are held hugely accountable, a poor Ofsted or drop in results and you can be out.
Edited to add; most SLT by now will have had extensive management training, through NPQs, I have completed both SL and H, and I now train other new SLT, so to say this does not exist is incorrect.
But I think there is a growing realisation at all levels that the current system is badly broken and unless this is addressed by government, the current exodus of teachers will continue. My school (as far as it can) prioritises staff wellbeing; you absolutely can go to your child’s sports day/nativity - all staff get annual wellbeing days, long service days, paid duties, free tea/coffee/fruit, free breakfast on a Friday, and we’re actively looking at what flexible working could look like.
As a maths teacher you will be in demand. Most of our maths teachers tend to have a speciality - high ability/low ability/KS3/GCSE/A level and teach mostly where their strengths lie. As a core subject Maths does have the highest levels of accountability (as does English), but therefore our maths/english teachers have the most support.
As others have said, if you find the right school, it’s the best job in the world (indy/grammar would be my idea of hell). There are a range of routes in, all of which would be either salaried or attract a bursary. Good luck!

fussychica · 05/01/2025 13:43

My DC would say it's all about the school and the quality of the SLT. Their school has good behaviour for a big state secondary which is a huge plus.
9 years in, still loves it.
Now Head of Department and has an additional role which they would hate to give up despite it eating into some weekends.
Hates marking but your subject choice means you'd have less than most.
Works in the holidays / evenings sometimes but far, far less than when they first started. You need to be prepared for the probability of working a significant amount of hours in addition to directed hours during the early stages of your career.

dizzydizzydizzy · 05/01/2025 13:49

DM was a science and maths teacher in the 1980s. She had constant colds/flu/nasty lurgies and was very bad tempered. It was very noticeable that the moment she gave up teaching she became a nice person again and her health returned.

HPandthelastwish · 05/01/2025 13:50

@fussychica this is true, my school was lovely when I first started and brilliant nurtering place to work and attend, the old head had to leave due to ill health and it took a while to get a new one, he was / is atrocious the entire culture at the school changed, staff morale plummeted there is no one left in my department from when I was there, 6 members from just one department all left not to mention the others and several had been there 20+ years. The general culture became negative and punitive for staff and students and staff encouraged to report on each other if not sticking to ridiculous rules like giving detentions if students wearing the wrong colour socks. The school had been one of the best in the area and now no one wants to send their children there.

DDs school just down the road is a completely different experience, staff turn over is low, they don't mark books just assessments, plenty of extra curricular on offer, staff seem happy and the overall feeling around the school is positive lots of focus on reward for effort and achievement, lots of focus on community within and without the school.

ArghhWhatNext · 05/01/2025 14:08

I trained to teach because I wanted to do a more worthwhile job. There are loads of things that I love: the children, my colleagues (on the whole), seeing lightbulb moments happen, taking the children on residential… BUT I’m leaving. The biggest reason is the constant anxiety about really obnoxious emails which arrive at unpredictable times but remarkably frequently. Quite often they’re about something tiny and innocuous that gets blown out of all proportion but you get an email late at night or at 6am demanding that it’s resolved immediately. I feel constantly on high alert and find that quite draining.
When you write it down, it sounds ridiculous. However, I’ve had all sorts of jobs over the years but never anything where I was so on edge

RhaenysRocks · 05/01/2025 14:13

Those saying they respond to emails at stupid times of night or early morning..you don't have to do that. My school has a rule that you don't respond outside of 8-6. You send a holding email within 24 hrs and then deal with it when convenient. Unless you are a DSL or very senior, it can wait. I teach in a private school now but none of mine have ever expected a normal classroom teacher to be responding at 6am. It's simply not that life and death.