To think autism gets worse with each generation

[eastereggg]

Genuine question.

Why does it seem that autism gets worse with each generation?

Example: a mother is a late diagnosed autistic but her child is very clearly autistic and displays much more severe characteristics than she did. The grandmother would probably be diagnosed autistic today as well.

There seems to be a recurring pattern that I'm seeing where autism is getting more severe with each generation. Is there an explanation for this?

I have looked into this in some depth for reasons to do with my work, and it is extremely complicated and seems to have many factors. It's hard to untangle factors like more sensitive diagnostic procedures and awareness, greater acceptance, and possible environmental factors. There's even a possible evolutionary factor that has been suggested - with the rise of academia and computing as professions, autistic people gained a greater likelihood of having successful careers and prestige, making them more likely to marry and have kids etc. so changing the gene pool and increasing incidence.

There absolutely have been some studies that have supported a link between some food additives eaten when pregnant and the incidence of autism in the baby - though more research is needed, that shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. There is also evidence that being born prematurely increases the likelihood of ASD and other ND conditions. As time goes on more and more babies survive premature birth so that is likely to contribute to the rise in diagnoses.

I stress I'm not asserting any of these theories as 100% true or fully evidenced, but there definitely are a range of factors that probably interact in various ways and it's not straightforward. I also agree there may be a factor of greater acceptance meaning that children are not expected to learn to suppress or manage their difficulties in the same way they used to be.

There seems to be anecdotal evidence of this in and around silicon valley too. Two clever techy autistic parents and then a more high needs autistic offspring.

I think the tech industry has a lot to answer for, personally. 40 years ago people like my DH would’ve been sitting in a garage somewhere trying to get one computer to talk to another, with very little consideration for social norms or much else, not necessarily earning very much. Now he and his colleagues are on very attractive salaries at companies you’ve heard of, working in Shoreditch or the City. They’re much more likely partners. So these classically Aspie blokes get married and have children.

No data clearly, plenty of anecdote.

So many factors here - and an interesting topic. On the one hand as a student nurse in the 1980's I looked after people who had been in psychiatric institutions for decades, until they closed. It is likely that some of these people would meet the criteria for diagnosis of ADHD or Autism today, but weren't able to form relationships. It is also true that average age of parents was younger a generation ago and that conditions are more likely to be identified.

On the other hand, DC were able to go home for lunch, had less pressure about exams and were able to leave school at 15/16 and get a job. If people weren't good at maths or reading, they could still find meaningful employment. They were less disabled by society's expectations, as people accepted them as they were.

And while it is true to say that Autism isn't caused by food, I find the emerging evidence about gut health and brain health fascinating.

Finally, parenting is relevant. Parenting is hard. It might be rewarding and fun, but there is also a lot of mind numbing routine which any of us find hard at times. And some people find harder than others.

Financially beneficial?

To have a disabled child?

Fuck me.

You're right it is inherited but aren't there also other risk factors such as having children later, possibly a link to upf? If that's the case then possibly there could be an interaction of genetic and environmental factors at play.

I don't think it's the genetics that are changing, I think it's society. Capitalism has impacted neurodivrrgent families because the mother is the main caregiver and now with mums having to work also I'm sure they are even more burnt out and overwhelmed. Schools are bigger classes, less financial support - 1-2-1 support is expected to help the whole class instead of just their SEN child. The world is much more overstimulating and busy.

I was diagnosed late with autism and inattentive ADHD (in my late 50's). As a child I was drugged up with anti-depressants from age 4 - 10 years old as I screamed a lot (apparently). I was also physically punished at school when I showed ADHD behaviour (zoning out and scribbling on my desk earned me a smack across the head from my teacher). I was raised in care and any 'behaviour' could earn you a smack or whack on the legs with the wooden spoon. So obviously I learnt to not mis-behave. Looking back a lot of the other kids I was in care with were also ND but there was zero understanding of the spectrum, especially in relation to girls, as it was seen as a male condition. The only autistic child I was aware of was non verbal and stimmed constantly.

Thankfully times have changed, but I a lot of late diagnosed ND adults will have had to mask heavily prior to seeking a diagnosis.

Interesting.

All the young people I know with AS and related conditions have someone in an older generation that has associated traits.

Do people on the spectrum have children who are NT?

Ds’s long term girlfriend, parent and sibling have strong traits, that serve them well and contribute to their successes.

But I wonder about the next generation.

Life with a non-verbal, very meltdown-prone young adult is incredibly hard, based on one friend’s experience.

Sorry if I have used wrong terms etc.

@tinselAndCrackers who says '
Autism is due to chemicals in the food chain '

DD is autistic and that's not an explanation that's ever been offered to me

The first one of these - two autistic parents. I can't find it but read a book a few years ago about how the internet etc made it easier for people to find similar people to share their lives and have children with, therefore the ASD genes would get stronger. And the difficulty is that ASD people are often attracted to ASD people because they understand each other instead of , for example Cystic Fibrosis, when generally if people have that gene there is nothing that particularly attracts them to those with the CF gene.

I'm utterly gobsmacked at people believing it's because of food 🤦‍♀️

IMO rubbish

I wonder if in previous generations there were more job opportunities that had a level of routine and less unpredictability. Aside from fewer people having a diagnosis.

Recognising it is a spectrum.

This isn't what I've found in my family. None of the older generation are diagnosed with ASD (but youngest 2 with dyslexia) but I think several are undiagnosed and have really suffered from that. It is a big family (my gran had 8 children) and there is drug and alcohol abuse, nervous breakdowns, terrible anxiety, OCD and suicide.

DS on the other hand was diagnosed at secondary school age and has had huge amounts of support and understanding. He isn't any more severely affected and thankfully is coping much better thanks to the support and understanding he has. The other younger members of the family with suspected ASD aren't any more severely affected either and are coping better as they are more supported generally.

My theory is that two generations ago, the dating pool was much more restricted so many more neurotypical people ended up married to autistic people.
Now autistic men and women meet at university and hit it off. Also their friends are autistic. Less mitigating influence of neurotypical neighbours and so on.

Not getting worse in my family, previous generations of undiagnosed autistics in my family have suffered severe mental illness. I suspect what your talking about is the other side of this; not being recognised along with a more conformist society led to huge pressure to conform or mask as we would call it. This may have allowed your family members to go under the radar or to minimise their own suffering. It also led to severe mental illness for some. Any weirdness was a huge cause of stigma and shame.

I agree, Autism seems to be getting more severe as time goes on.

so many non verbal children now, waiting years for a place at an SEN school whilst a mainstream school is doing their best to accommodate them.

years ago people with Autism coped much better with everyday life than what they do now. It was unheard of to be having ear defenders, screaming fits lasting for hours, unable to communicate with people etc etc.

Thsts,not quite true my son has a chromosome deletion linked to his,autism ts,a De,novo.in his,case,neither me or his,Dad are,autistic snd,whilst he,does,have a,second cousin who is,autistic ,this,is ,only one other incidence in quite a,large extended family.

My dad is absolutely, 100% autistic. Safe foods, special interests etc etc.

I am autistic, and my brother probably is too. No more worse or "better" than the other.

The vast majority of children who are autistic with high support needs and have at least one autistic parents are going to be born to parents who have lower support needs, however the vast majority of children who are autistic with low support needs and have an autistic parent are also going to be born to parents who have low support needs. Autistic people with high support needs are less likely to have children, thankfully we don’t know whether a non-speaking, doubly incontinent autistic adult who isn’t able to live independently would have children with similar support needs, higher support needs or lower support needs because in most cases if a vulnerable autistic adult without the capacity to consent to sex were to have children it would likely indicate abuse happening somewhere.

Is there any data that autistic parents are more likely to have a child with high support needs than low support needs if their offspring are autistic? I do know autistic parents whose autistic children have high support needs, but know more whose children either don’t have autism or have low support needs. I also know some autistic children with high support needs where neither parent has a diagnosis of or suspects they would get a diagnosis of autism. Is there any research into this or is your feeling just anecdotal?

I'm utterly gobsmacked at people believing it's because of food

It's not a belief, it's a reasonable theory that it's perfectly reasonable to do studies on, and that's happening.

We know various food additives and pollutants can have all kinds of effects on the brain, and on the gut which influences the brain. Many parents of children with ASD are careful to avoid them having particular food additives because they affect them badly. It's not a huge leap to wonder if they could also affect brain development in the womb. It's not wrong to look into that. Why shouldn't it be a factor? And if it is, isn't that worth knowing?

Maybe in your family but not in mine, the issue was they (parents and schools) literally had no idea it was even a thing back in the 50s and now they are spotting it early in order to give support.

I think schools have become like sausage factories (but turning out kids that can pass exams and behave a certain way). I think we have appear to become more progressive and supportive whilst simultaneously making it harder for less able and ND kids to thrive.

Certainly at my primary school there was no fixed curriculum, we had mixed year classes and we went at our own pace in maths. In English we were encouraged to read widely and write creatively but we didn’t have formal grammar and spelling tests - whilst frequent - were “low stakes”. We did lots of dance, art, drama and music and random fancies of our teachers like hunting for bugs, learning about farm and traditionally crafts.

It was so free, honestly. I can’t imagine the regimented approach of today’s classroom works well for many kids.

Assortative mating might be a factor. Also people have more of a chance to bump into 'like-minded' people nowadays, given there are so many more technical, detail-oriented job environments than used to be the case.

Have you read the links between the older the parents are the more likely the children are autistic.