To think there is not enough disabled bays for how many badge users there are

[thecherryfox]

I have been disabled my entire life, as a kid and even as a teenager getting access to a disabled space was a lot easier than it is now. I believe now with the intake of how many people can access a badge with many different conditions - the amount of disabled bays have stayed the same but the influx of badge holders have risen.

Between 2021-2022 there was a 25% increase in blue badge holders from the previous year, but there wasn’t a 25% increase in disabled parking spaces. It’s rising each year, but there is no increase in parking spaces.

I’m physically disabled and the difference between me not getting a close space often means I cannot physically go. I know people with ‘hidden’ disabilities like bowel diseases would feel the same about accessing a close space. I’m truly not blaming individuals for getting badges because if they at eligible they are entitled to one - but it’s within the government to know that an increase of blue badge holders should mean an increase of spaces for people to access.

I’m in the NW and there are never enough BB spaces around us. Chester Zoo, for example, has an entire BB car park and I’ve never yet managed to get a space in it! There are more elderly and infirm adults as we all live longer, and ime the OP is correct that the facilities have not expanded to meet the need.

It is always non wheelchair users who want to attack wheelchair users in these threads. And we get attacked, our comments deleted, etc, despite the fact that we are also the ones getting harassed on here.

I'm not surprised at all. Because I'm familiar with the pervasive ableism on this site! I literally expect it every time a thread on this comes up. But yeah, still disappointed in you lot. You could be better but you don't want to. Just like the mods could choose to be less ableist in their moderation but they don.t

And it's almost funny that we get accused of "top trumps" when all we are doing is talking about literal material reality such as needing to get a wheelchair out of a car. No one is saying that the symptom can't be just as bad for an ambulant person, which is the exact opposite of top trumps. But the very idea of a wheelchair user needing something is so abhorrent you have to attack us.

Except it's often other disabled people (with invisible disabilities) emboldened by what should be a good thing (advocacy) to go back to the days of hating and laughing at cripples. (And before I get deleted for using a slur, this is a community I belong to and it's a term we have reclaimed.)

(Although it wouldn't surprise me if MNHQ use any excuse to delete my comments since they apparently hate disabled people commenting.)

I had a comment removed the other day, after a number of people had been very ableist, where I said I was only rude to ableists, with a smiley face. That's literally all I said.

Guess which comments remained? Yep, all the ableist ones.

It was frustrating for me this morning when I couldn't do my shopping because there were no blue badge spaces available, despite waiting and driving around for 10 minutes. No bread or milk in the house so I'll have to try again this afternoon

It is always non wheelchair users who want to attack wheelchair users in these threads.

Nope. It works all ways hence all the ignorant comments about people with invisible disabilities not looking like they needed a blue badge and the suggestion that they shouldn’t qualify for a badge. I can list them here if you like but I’m sure that you can see them for yourself even if you don’t care about them.

Nobody at all has attacked the idea of wheelchair users needing something. They have simply pointed out that others who don’t need a wheelchair may still have a need for it. You don’t need it more because you’re in a wheelchair. That’s where the top trumps comes into it.

if someone has been assessed as meeting the criteria for a blue badge they have as much right and need to use that space as someone else with a blue badge. They shouldn’t be made to feel guilty for parking!

the pervasive ableism on this site!

There will be howls of protest from all quarters, however MN is merely a subset of society, and there is a growing pervasive ableism in society. To be brutally frank, as soon as there is any impingement on their able life, people lose interest in anyone else. There will of course be exceptions. However the plural of anecdote is not data.

Again, not my point. I don't know why you are so determined to twist my words when I have not actually said anything negative about other blue badge holders, but it's still wheelchair users like me getting attacked. This is exactly what I'm talking about , the lack of solidarity and chronic hate and harassment.

Except there are literally multiple examples of hate against wheelchair users on this thread and every other thread like this, and also of biassed moderation ;)

@JubileeJuice I am not surprised one bit. Saddened but not surprised. I am not one to rush to report comments as I prefer to let the debate stand, but if people report me and get my comments deleted out of ableist motives, then I will challenge MNHQ about why. And yet oddly enough they will let the ableist hate directed at me stand and only delete me... just like in your situation.

It is an entrenched issue with the site. The reason why others shout louder is because there are simply more abled people! And more invisibly disabled than wheelchair users. We are a minority within a minority and perceived as entitled / having special perks. Hence the eagerness even by other disabled people to attack us. It's bitterly ironic how we get accused of top trumps.

In fact @Sirzy I have many times affirmed that ambulant BB holders can have just as serious symptoms and be just as unwell as wheelchair users, so my comments are the literal direct opposite of so called "top trumps". And yet that accusation is hurled again and again because it's easier than engaging with my points. I have been very clear I am not attacking any legitimate users but pointing out there should be a direct and frank conversation about each group's needs, and that these are not all the same. For some reason this is taken as an attack when it is not one. Even when I simply cannot be more explicit in saying that I am not claiming one patient is more unwell than another.

Something like getting out a chair from a car is a physical equipment related action that some people have to do and others do not. It doesn't have anything to do with concepts like validity.

I honestly don't mean this rudely but do you need a blue badge at all with just epilepsy? Even if you did go into the shop with him does walking the extra 10-20 feet impact you? Genuine question, not goading etc but I think this sort of thing is was the OP means. Ideally disabled bays would be for very physically disabled people and parent and child spaces would be for those with very young children. But I guess there are a myriad of conditions where a disabled bay may be best suited.

BB spaces serve 2 different, but not mutually exclusive purposes.

1. If a wheelchair user needs to transfer from the car to a chair or scooter then there needs to be enough space around the car to allow the doors to open, and the chair to be safely moved from storage to the doorside. For this purpose, the actual location of the space is secondary to it's size. This is why P&C spaces are a useful fallback when the BB spaces are free (although it seems that never happens).

2. For people who can walk, but are unsteady, get tired, or have a condition that doesn't require a wheelchair, the proximity to the entrance is key. There is no specific need for a larger bay.

For the ease of a simple minded public, these are combined.

What that adds to the party I can't quite tell. But it's all grist to the mill.

@RegulatorsMountUp

honestly don't mean this rudely but do you need a blue badge at all with just epilepsy? Even if you did go into the shop with him does walking the extra 10-20 feet impact you?

This is what o was touching on earlier. People thinking you should not have a badge despite you being entitled to a badge as per the regulations set by the government/local councils.

It's not up to you to challenge a poster, they have a legitimate BB. We need more spaces in many areas, not less 'help' for disabled people.

Quite apart from the fact that there isn't a "not rude" way to question someone's disability, how do you know that they have "just epilepsy". The poster said that they cannot drive due to epilepsy, not that they have no other disability. You don't get points for mobility needs (OP has a motability car, so must have scored highly on mobility sections) unless there is a good reason why your mobility is poor.

I'm not challenging I'm asking a question, a genuine question because I have no idea about epilepsy except a colleague who had it and was only triggered by intense flashing lights.

@SerendipityJane For people who can walk, but are unsteady, get tired, or have a condition that doesn't require a wheelchair, the proximity to the entrance is key. There is no specific need for a larger bay.

Untrue. I can walk. After a fashion. I am very unsteady on my feet. get tired quickly and must rest frequently, hence I have a rollator, not a wheelchair. Unfortunately I also can't get out of the bloody car unless I can open the doors to the full extent. Have you tried doing that in a normal sized bay? Half the time you are lucky if an able bodied person can get out of the car in those bays!

I do appreciate that you are genuinely asking a question. STOP DOING THAT! If you wouldn't walk up to a person on the street and ask what their disability was and how it impacts on them, then it is just as rude to do it here. It is rude no matter how genuine the question.

Why the need to ask though? The poster has a BB, so that means that she has been assessed as being in need of one. There is no need to know anything more, unless the poster in question wishes to answer you, of course.

There are many triggers. I had it as a child and one trigger was lack of sleep. I'd also vomit after.

A blue badge isn't just for those with issues putting one foot in front of the other.

This is the issue. Wheelchair users have different needs to other disabled people. The same as someone with a limb difference has different needs to someone with a stoma. All disabilities are different. No one is saying people with invisible disabilities who have a valid BB should not park in BB spaces. They're entitled to use them. I used to be that person myself. I needed to use them.

However, wheelchair users have different needs. If we can't park in a disabled space, we can't leave our vehicle. We can't find the nearest standard sized space and use that. We can't park a little bit away in a standard space and use a stick. We can't get out. We can't access food/medication/healthcare.

No one is saying this "trumps" anyone else. We're saying that we have different, valid needs. There should be disabled spaces and spaces for wheelchair users who physically need extra space for ramps, hoists etc.

But isn't that the whole point of an anonymous forum so that things can be asked and answered without upsetting anyone. I have ADHD - don't really talk about it in real life but often give my input about it on here. Wouldn't be bothered if someone asked me questions about it etc. The poster I quoted doesn't have to reply but at the end of the day it was a polite anonymous question. Not sure why you're all getting so cross about it.

totally agrée. I think it’s a particular issue around parks and street shopping areas where the BB spaces are totally insufficient.