Teacher telling 7yo that Father Christmas not real

[Peaceandquietandacuppa]

Is it reasonable for a RE teacher to tell 7 year olds that Father Christmas isn’t real?

My 7 year old DS has just told me that his RE teacher told the class Father Christmas “isn’t real” today. He isn’t one to over-exaggerate. I asked if any of the kids prompted it by asking and he said no, she just said it.

If you think it’s unreasonable, would you say anything to the school?

YABU - teachers are fine to say FC is not real at the age of 7

YANBU - let the kids / parents decide if FC is real. Just don’t say anything!

You may have seen or heard things I haven't. From my point of view it's not an 'enforced conspiracy' where every adult is held responsible for it. It's about reading the room and having empathy and an awareness that it's not your place to tell other peoples' kids the reality.

You don't have to do it for your own kids if you feel you'd rather not. You just stay in your lane and keep shtumm when it comes to other peoples' kids.

There's always going to be children who, when they find out, are bursting to tell others. It's not a case of them 'daring' to, it's a case of them feeling superior because they know more than the other kids! Perfectly normal for that sort of age, of course. They can be told to keep quiet to not spoil it for others and it won't harm them. Again, they don't need to lie, just not shout from the rooftops. It's about thinking of others, really.

You might be expressing it slightly more politely but you're saying the exact same thing, that everyone who DOESN'T do Santa or FC has to shut up in order to protect the people who DO. It's rude and bossy.

Meanwhile, anyone who isn't into the Santa/FC story doesn't have any choices at all about whether to do it or not because it is immediately enforced upon all children the moment they start nursery or school, and if you tell them, they will inevitably tell others (regardless of whether you tell them not to) and you will be made a social pariah.

We play along with it FOR NOW because my daughter is 4. When she gets old enough to ask for the truth, we will give it to her and I certainly won't be telling her that she has to "keep schtum" because other kids believe differently, just like I've never told her she has to "keep schtum" in conversations about religion just because we are not religious.

Accept yes, I do, but I am telling no lie for any traditions.

I am tired of this message that we should teach our children to lie by omission. That is a ridiculous expectation and I wouldn't be teaching any child to do that

I'm appalled! It's like her telling a Hindu their gods don't exist!

Do you realise how ridiculous it sounds, as an adult, to think only your way is correct? 😆

No it isn't.

Assuming this is sarcasm, right?

If not then I don't know how to break it to you that children believing in Santa does not equate to a religious belief!

It's about being mindful of other peoples' feelings, that's all I'm saying.

I'm not saying you have to tell your kid a certain thing, though I find it odd you use the word 'enforced', like a belief in Santa is a bad thing for children. I'm just asking that you consider the feelings of others. In the same way you might talk to your child about other areas where we generally think about the impact of what we say on them, e.g. not pointing out somebody's fat, because it would hurt their feelings.

Not every thought that comes into our heads needs to come out of our mouths, that sort of thing.

Well, it might do, if that were what I was saying, but you misread. I'm not saying my way is correct, just that it's correct for me, and its mean for others who think otherwise to be trying to enforce their views on me or my child.

But tbh I do find it a bit joyless and overly-serious when adults go on about 'lying' to children as if it's damaging for them to believe in Santa while they're very young.

So you and your child can share your belief in Santa whenever you like and that's not enforcing your views on anyone, but families who don't believe in Santa have to be silent about their views because that's enforcing their views on others and it's mean. Right.

More hysteria over Father Christmas. December is always full of it ... I'm not sure I'd take a 7yr olds words as verbatim. Ultimately, finding out about FC will happen all sorts of ways – parents who try to control it or get too upset by it are setting themselves up for unnecessary anger and disappointment. Stop hingeing so much on the big man in red and spread the joys of Christmas elsewhere.

Our class WhatsApp group had mums sending anxious messages to remind any non-believing kids not to say anything at school. I honestly just rolled my eyes – it's not my job to uphold your belief systems.

Who says I'm 'sharing my belief in Santa'?

I'm not quite sure what you mean? It's not like I'm standing in my local town square every Saturday morning proselytising about Santa and urging others to believe. All I want to do is join in with what others do about this. Like take my child to see Santa, read stories, sing songs, put a mince pie out. And for others to not deliberately spoil that.

How does that affect you negatively?

I'm not quite sure why you feel so strongly. Do you have a need to 'put others right' on this? Does it benefit you to shout about the fact that Santa isn't real and make sure children who believe know this?

Maybe where you went, but not every faith school.

I don't see the harm and while I would agree with you if it was people being asked not to disagree with, for example, the religious views of adults, it does seem a bit mean when we're talking about little kids believing in Santa.

I wouldn't send a message out like this myself, but I don't see why you would roll your eyes. There's lots of things in life that 'aren't my job' but it greases the social wheels for us to do it. Just thinking of others type stuff.

And there it is, the inevitable personal attacks about what you assume I do about Santa.

Have you told your children that they must under no circumstances talk about their belief in Santa and if anyone raises it, they must be quiet in order not to offend anyone who doesn't believe in him? Or would you consider that unreasonable?

What personal attack?

Well here we have it, the calling of individuals as being weird for telling the truth. Then we have the blatant discriminatory thinking of you believe different or were raised differently you must not be from the UK🤦‍♀️

Shock horror they were raised and walk amongst ye!

I roll my eyes because they are pre-emptively angry and ready to be annoyed with any child that puts their toe over the line. Kids are kids and, while deliberate nasty harmful talking isn't, you can't control what they chat about at school. Asking children to adhere to the same level of sensitive respect of religion as adults can if asking too much of them when it's just general school Christmas chat.

'Just thinking of others' can apply when you know your kid has been maliciously doing something, not pre-emptively pulling them aside and trying to curtail what they might chat about at school.

The lovely list of assumptions about how I must take joy in running around "spoiling" Santa is pretty personal, and also ignorant, considering I've already said that I go along with Santa with my 4 yo.

You still haven't answered my question- have you told your child they aren't allowed to discuss their belief in Santa at school?

For real.

Unless you want to keep your child in a bubble, they're going to find out sooner or later!

@BunfightBetty Seriously? You don't see how the Santa show impact my family I would kindly suggest you're not reading the posts on here.

I have seen, expect your child to have no friends, the children telling the truth are being deliberately mean, spiteful, the veiled comments which are obviously intended to say we are not from here, tying culture to bring about othering etc

What delightful thoughts shared about a five year old. The same five year old they want to lie for them.

I would suggest engaging in some insight. Maybe have a reflection on why you expect us to be complicit in your lies and give a good head wobble.

Our class WhatsApp group had mums sending anxious messages to remind any non-believing kids not to say anything at school. I honestly just rolled my eyes – it's not my job to uphold your belief systems.

But you understand the concept of being a nice person though?