My town has really changed

[CatbellsOnTheSeashore]

In a confusing and not very pleasant way.

It was gradually changing for the worse before covid, but the pandemic seemed to accelerate it, and I am wondering if anyone else has noticed anything like this.

It became more insular whilst more populated, the population increased quite a bit over the past 5 yrs. More and more dereliction, low council maintenance and an influx of troubled people housed around the town centre, which is now a no-go zone. Areas surrounding have steadily grown worse also, as it seems to be spilling out.

What does feel really different is that there are now lots of groups of men, hanging around drinking or sat on pavements together (not begging). Drugs took over the local nature paths and canal walks so now there are large groups of people out of their heads lying on old sofas at the locks, it's really grim. Women who used to cycle and run in these areas have more or less moved elsewhere or stopped.

More and more standard sized houses in low to middle income areas are becoming HMO's, yet with poor refuse organisation and not enough parking. I'm not exaggerating when I say there are literally trails of dog shit in the streets in many areas, too, which pretty much hangs in the air and the place stinks. That, and skunk.

We live in a decent part of town but it is coming closer, and I only have that perk due to inheriting my parents bungalow. More and more people are moving out.

On a walk to Sainsbury's yesterday two guys were holding onto a sign pole hovering over a bin. As I passed by one of them vomited into the bin and then spat/gobbed an inch from my feet - he didn't notice me particularly, but it was quite sudden or I'd have given them a wide berth.
This isn't unusual now.

I know people usually blame the cost of living and covid, etc, but this was definitely on the rise before. There is far more noise pollution as more buildings go up, usually industrial, and the roads are a nightmare. Infrastructure for actual people is decreasing.
That said, I don't think most of these people were thriving before, so it isn't a sudden change. It is as if a new kind of culture is growing, that doesn't care a damn about anything. Everything is vandalised or shat on. More and more windows are broken in properties close to the town centre, and I doubt most of these people were thriving before the pandemic hit.

Is this bad luck or is anything like it happening elsewhere?
We are definitely looking to move away.

i don't think thats true though.

no one left or right thinks 900k a year legal immigration is ok, but to act as if that is the major reason for the long term massive break down in society is false.

there is rampant individualism, a desire to restrict anything good for other if you yourself didn't get it. consistent race to the bottom with pay across the country.

why hadn't the government planned for the employment needs of th country. why is there such an apparent gap of skills that so many work visas are required for low skilled work in this country.

So does anyone know why the government instigated more large scale immigration after Brexit?
I am confused by this.

Who actually profits from this and what was the intention?

People on this thread have mentioned 'foreign', 'middle east', etc, so what was the plan? Are they filling vital roles that we can't fill without help? Is this something to do with the falling birth rate?

I do feel that our society is starting to eat it's own tail in pursuit of money. Everything else is finally going out of the window.

@rockstarshoes I think it's fantastic that you've done that. Sadly I can't help but think one reason it's been successful is that you say the town centre is 1 km away. So the people who were causing problems have presumably just moved onto the town centre? Or do you see them around and find they've changed their behaviour? If that has happened, then your area would be a great place to research how we get out of this situation.

@CatbellsOnTheSeashore agree re money and eating own tail.

also. HOUSING HOUSING HOUSING.

i've been involved in a consultation exercise for local people in my area, we all want the best for the where we live There are volunteer litter pickers, people who run a weekly free hot meal service, and what is apparent is that the majority of people where I live want better but have been worn down by the past decade of cuts and austerity, There is a low energy due in part by the amount of effort it takes just to get by these days. I think people are really struggling not just with the financial cost of everything but with the emotional struggle of living in a grubby crime ridden area. Ages ago we had a hanging basket project, people were given the basics for making a hanging basket, the rationale being that if a street began to look brighter and more cared for then this would influence people to take more care of their environment. I put up a basket, it was torn down and vandalised, not stolen , just wrecked for the thrill of it. I replaced it and the same thing happened again. so i gave up. I cannot put a Christmas wreath on my door, it would meet the same fate. I want to hope, I want to be optimistic but it is hard

Not on the same scale as others are describing, but even relatively affluent Canterbury has really gone downhill in recent years. It's very noticeable.

From what I have read the Treasury wanted it to look like growth and immigration will always increase GDP. But GDP per capita is falling as most of the people coming in are a net cost - the govt spends £17k per person and most of the people coming in are not paying anything like that in taxes. At the same time there are record numbers of people on out of work benefits -£5m including sickness benefit and because of the state of the NHS alot of people can't get treatment which works allow them to work. But 1 million increase n population puts even more pressure on NHS (I read it is like providing GPs for 4 x Brightons - in one year!). Unlike most countries our health service and benefits are non-contributory and people have access to them straight away without having to make a contribution first.

its mad.

i do wonder if it was a plan to foment social tension and shore up the tory vote due to anti immigrant feeling.

As the increase in the past year has been noticeable and i liven a 50% ethnic minority part of the country.

That's a good question!

I think some of the dealers have actually been arrested! One 101 call won't get them off the streets but a barrage of calls with times & places have helped police build a full picture & actually make arrests!
Don't get me wrong there are still pockets where as soon as you remove one lot of fly tipping another lot appears, it isn't Utopia by any stretch of the imagination but it's getting better!

You can get a 3 bed semi in Wigan for 150k. That should be within reach of an average earner

Immigrants have to pay an annual fee towards the NHS. Can't remember the exact figure but it's over 2k for every person per year. Whether or not they actually use it.

I sometimes wonder what the heck the end game is supposed to be, or if there even is one.

The user rich striking out for Mars even starts to look realistic when you look round at the national and global chaos.

More prosaically, I wonder if there's a case for driving populations to such a desperate point of instability, any regime that gives an illusion of security woyld be welcomed. There's historical precedent for that of course, and sometimes there are hidden strings attached which by the time they become apparent, it's impossible to back track as an invested population.

I also wonder if fascism is actually corporatism/capitalism now. Everything, but everything, is judged by monetary value and humans are judged as economic units above all else. As automation increases, we're facing a future with little in the way of precedent.

I know people say that all progress / technology has caused upheaval and social adjustment but computing and AI are hardly comparable, nor is the speed of development, or our utter reliance on it for nearly every practical aspect of our lives.

Strange and interesting times indeed.

Why comment if you can't argue against my points?

Lots of people have made the point on the thread that it's not absolute poverty that's causing these issues. Lack of money does not cause vandalism or aggressive dog ownership or drug use or noisy car exhausts. Objectively hardly anyone in this country is as poor as 80% of people in developing countries.

Living off benefits is an accepted way of life for an awful lot of people, whether in or out of work. That is a trap and it disenfranchises people

Before covid I used to volunteer for lots of community groups. Now, I do nothing. I too feel worn down. I think a lot of people do.

@DinosaurMunch I think people can put up with an awful lot, if they think life will get better either for them, or their children. I think a lot of poor people in the UK do not have that hope.

It's a creeping malaise and it's way beyond economic. We are in spiritual decline.

I think it's been getting steadily worse since about 2018 in my town centre.
There's also a very visible divide in the local population with some portraying ever more right wing ideology.

This crossed my mind, only, in part, because nothing bloody surprises me anymore since politics has become so nasty.

Thanks for replying, @Menopausalsourpuss

I can agree with your point about poverty, as apart from the obviously damaged addicts and troubled groups most of the noisy car/dog poop people here are NOT poor.

oops double post.

Not sure how strictly that is policed tbh. This suggests GP practices are not allowed to turn down someone because of immigration status.https://www.gov.uk/guidance/nhs-entitlements-migrant-health-guide

Reading the replies one thing that stands out is the anti social behaviour that's all across the UK .How did we arrive at this point where empathy for others and a wee bit of pride in your surroundings for some are an alien concept.

I think the lack of policing is a big issue - people are like children, if they know they can get away with things they keep pushing. I really believe in the broken windows theory as demonstrated in New York. I absolutely don't think it's totally to do with money - the police get more than ever but are nowhere to be seen. But are scared to police without fear or favor as so many different groups willing to riot and alot of police quite unfit and lazy. And lack of eg social services to back them up.

There was a sharp decline in behaviours, graffiti anti social behaviour in Aberdeen when police Scotland announced there would be certain crimes they wouldn't be investigating and this was trialled and deemed to be a success..so was extended to the rest of Scotland...it's been a disaster funnily enough.

I actually live in one of the parts of Wigan listed by the OP as [chooses words] dubious. And yeah, there's truth in what she says. I can't say I suffer too much from dogshit, but general anti-social behaviour, sure. All that said, I'm happy here, and most Wigan folk are great, and I've never felt more welcome after moving than I do here. I wish I could have moved here twenty years earlier in Shaun Edwards' heyday.