Assisted Dying

[Nordione1]

I dont know what section to put this in. Im more upset about the vote for it than I thought I'd be. I feel like we have crossed a rubicon somehow.

@ThisAquaCrow

well, your misinterpreting it. People are saying that humans should be afforded the same level of compassion that dogs. You wouldn’t leave a dog suffering with no change of getting better would you? so why should humans have to endure that? Luckily we’re on the path to ensuring that those who don’t want to suffer don’t have to.

Having nursed my terminal mum for 11 weeks , I'd say the last 3 weeks for her were the worse, and she would have wanted to go before it had come to that .
I know if the same were to happen to me , I'd gladly say my goodbyes to family and choose when to go.

Being suicidally depressed is different to being depressed because you know you're going to die soon.

Who on earth has suggested good palliative care is taken away??

I honestly don’t understand the romanticising of assisted dying. The methods are to either to overdose on drugs you orally ingest or to push a button and have a lethal injection of the same sort that some countries still use to execute criminals.

There is no dignity in dying by overdose or lethal injection.

A few posters have mentioned parents ‘choking to death’ I don’t think they realise with the AD method of this bill of oral ingestion that aspirating on your own vomit while unconscious is a common side effect. So AD doesn’t avoid choking to death. You also shit and piss yourself while unconscious. Prior to falling unconscious there can be nausea, stomach cramps, tingling/pins and needles, spasms. Muscle relaxers and anti-emetics are added to the cocktail to reduce the risk of vomiting and to reduce the appearance of the writhing and spasming so attending relatives think the person dying isn’t feeling discomfort- they are they’re just artificially slightly paralysed.

A study done on the rates of PTSD, and negative feelings about how their relative died comparing assisted deaths to unassisted deaths found no difference. Both are equally traumatic.

There are numerous studies on just how inhumane lethal injection is by observing hundreds of executions.

It’s ok to be in favour of AD, what I really dislike is the romanticising of it through the use of language saying it’s dignified, painless, and avoids all suffering. The reality of it falls short of this.

If you are depressed and terminally ill and apply for AD due to the depression, that means you are suicidally depressed. Attitudes like yours will mean that the terminally ill will no longer have their mental health supported.

Only if you'd granted them the power to make those decisions on your behalf

A child can easily coerce a parent into consenting though. There was a case of this in Oregon.

Why should I not have a right to want to end my own life if I have a 6 months left to live and know that many of those months will not have any sense or quality of "life" in them?

I do not want the last months of my life to be in chronic pain, possiblly paralysed, unable to speak, swallow or support myself in any way. Why should my choice to bring forward a very unpleasant and very inevitable death be stopped?

I just don't understand?

Yes I also don’t know why there is this desperation to do anything to stop people from dying if that is what they want. A terminally ill person who is in pain and wants to die with dignity is in a completely different position to a young man who feels there is nothing to live for because his girlfriend left him. We shouldn’t lump them together. One person is suffering from a temporary mental illness and suicide deprives them of the ability to recover and have a good life. The other is doing it because they have weighed up the options and would prefer to die before they deteriorate further, lose control of their mind and body and their loved ones have to watch them suffer.
Not even the countries that allow euthanasia for some mental illnesses wouldn’t allow the vast vast majority of those who commit suicide to make use of assisted dying laws.

Interesting articles in the Times by Janice Turner who is just about in favour, and Hugo Rifkind who is against.

To me the key issues are choice and the ability of the patient to make that choice. If a person is terminally ill, in pain, suffering and wishes it to end earlier than it otherwise would if nature were left to its own devices, then that choice is a fundamental human right.

Luckily, I am not in that position, but if I were, I would want to be able to make that choice.

I'm delighted and relieved it was passed and look forward to it coming in to law in due course.

I watched alot of the debate again last night and the mp leila moran lib dem, said the ones that are against this bill no matter how much scrutiny will be done in the next 2 to 3 years. How much consultation and panels will now ho head and add amendments etc to bring the bill back. They need to be honest that be it because of religion they would never vote doe this bill. That's how I feel on mumsnet
Sure there are those that are against the bill as they don't feel it's watertight, which is fair enough, but as I have said, it's going to be another 2 to 3 years before it gets to come back to the house of parliament. But it's the other people that annoying me. They are not being honest that they would never ever vote for this. Anyway, or want it, and that's fine. You can look after your mortal soul all you want, but you don't get did it take to others.
Kit malthouse or david Davis, I can't remember which stated to the people that are saying we would get like Canada. That is such a bad thing to say because we have a Parliament. That is a thousand year old, and we are perfectly acceptable to make our own rules. As they stated, we have abortion in this country just because some other countries have it to near where you give birth.We would never do that in our country yet.That doesn't mean to say that we stop all abortion.In this country. I thought that was a really good argument.
Now, on channel four on youtube, it's said, but on the island of jersey, they're practically going to be doing it next year, they've done their discussions, the isle of man is near enough doing it soon. Plus scotland will be having this discussion soon.Too, so it's about right that this is done.
The other thing that's really annoying is that I saw the 2 sides of campaigns outside the house of Parliament yesterday, and it was disabled people saying, this is a bad day for disabled people. There is nothing absolutely nothing in this bill. That is saying, disabled people are going to be put down This is literally so hard you have to have six months to live, and yet you might even have a two year diagnosiss. I guess that means you're going to have to wait till you get to 6 months. I'm wondering if people are egging it on for these disabled people so they get worried because there is literally nothing.That is targeting the disabled people, so i'm trying to understand why they are so concerned when this legitimately has an act that says terminal illness only

Have you ever had to put a dog to sleep?

I wonder how many of the people against the bill will admit it's because of religion ?

My dog a few weeks ago 15 had this vertigo thing he developed very quickly and it was like he was spinning around and wobbly couldn't stand very well think being on a waltzer. The vet said it was a severe case and the poor thing was going mental couldn't eat for twenty four hours because he couldn't get to his bowl. His eyes were rolling head down yo one side that's a sign.
Vet said prob neurological as his age and other issues I had seen anyway he fell asleep wuth the Injection very calm in arms and it was just nice to see him not distressed as he was.
I honestly think he would have wanted that and I think we should all want to die in our sleep if we die as it seems peaceful

That's what leila moran said yesterday I don't think they will be honest knew my.mp Muslim mp wasn't gonna do it it annoys me

I’m very sorry to hear about your lovely old dog.

I’m sure it was not a decision you have taken easily but it sounds it was the right one for your dog.

Of course, but I am a firm believer, but I think people extend life when they don't need to I. Certainly. Don't know if I would put my dog through cancer treatment because they don't know that they've got cancer. Sometimes I question why people want people to live longer when they are really suffering. And I include that with pets as well

But you're not applying for it because of the depression in that situation, you're applying for it because of the terminal condition

And how long does this suffering go on? Months? Because if it's a few minutes then it really doesn't compare to the prolonged suffering some posters have described their loved ones having to endure.

Absolutely.
My Nana was depressed in her last few months of life and wanted to die.
She wanted to die because her disease had robbed her of everything in life except her mind.
Imagine your mind being completely intact, feeling the same way about everything you ever had but being stuck in a wheelchair, unable to move any part except your eyes, unable to eat, unable to communicate.
It isn’t depression that is making you want to die it’s the fact you’re body is essentially dead compared to what it was yet you are trapped in it.

There are numerous studies on just how inhumane lethal injection is by observing hundreds of executions.

That process is intended to be punitive.

There's no sane reason it couldn't be as painless as we do for animals when we 'put them to sleep'.

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not under the proposed legislation. The person themselves would have to make the request and would need to be adjudged competent to do so.