Second-homer wanting to be part of the community

[IMustConfess]

I live in a village on the coast in a semi-rural area. It's a place where people come to live for a relatively quiet life with great walks, fresh air and unspoiled beaches. Lots of artists and writers and gardeners.

Two years ago a couple from London bought the small detached property next door to me. It's a holiday home for them and their friends and family. They're in their 50s, clearly used to a busy lifestyle in London. Lots of talk of theatre and gigs and nice restaurants. They moved in and invited a few locals to dinner and said they wanted to get involved with whatever's going on. They clearly expected to be invited back to eat with everyone and were surprised when some didn't reciprocate. 'But we were told there was a great community here!' They went round knocking on lots of doors and introducing themselves and saying how much they wanted to be involved, but they're probably only here for 10 weeks of the year max. One of my neighbours was really pissed off by it. She said it was like they had an idea of country life they'd got from a TV drama.

When their families come down independently they knock on my door and introduce themselves and say how wonderful that we're all such good friends/ such a lovely community and seem to expect to be invited in and given tea and told what's on. If there's something happening they want me to take them along. They've clearly been told I'll be happy to include them.

This year the husband's been working away a lot and so the wife has been coming down on her own. She always messages me a day or two before she's due to arrive and announces she's coming and wants to know what's on in 'the community'. She messages me when she's arrived so I know she's arrived safely. 😱She expects to be included in anything I've got going on. I took her to my book group when she was down in the summer, and now she expects to be included and tries to get us to schedule our meet-ups for when she's here.

When I moved here I got to know people slowly and worked out who I got on with. My neighbours seem to think friendship comes on a plate and everyone loves them. We have friends who live next door to an AirBnB and say something similar: many of the people who rent the place want to talk to them as if they're friends and happy to spend half an hour telling them which coastal walk is most scenic or which local pub does the best beer. We live here: we're not tourist information or rent-a-mate.

Are we the unreasonable ones? What's going on with people that they think they can just waltz into a new area and everyone'll love them?

It's widened to second home owners in general though.

Again, you have no idea what you're speaking about.

Wanting locals, who perform important roles in their community, to be able to live in their community isn't small minded. Second home owners tend to take much more than they contribute. Most people don't need two houses.

I agree with your summation.

This is a typical secind home owner self serving justification. The second home won't be so appealing when that's all there is, because no existing locals can afford to live there, or run small businesses such as plumbers, joiners, cleaning services and so on, there.
Enjoy that.

To follow your argument to its natural conclusion: no one should move or purchase property where they didn’t grow up. What a fucking terribly boring world that would be… Equally, no one from your village should leave for university or accept a job in a city? Correct?

I think people can be rude, overstep boundaries, be selfish etc, whatever their housing situation. Second-homers, air BnB guests, new residents, or well-established neighbours. It’s too simplistic to say someone is being difficult because they are a second-homer. They may be a complete pain to live near in their own permanent city home too.

Much of that change must surely be down to change in agriculture, the way we shop (not local but via Amazon etc) and changes in demographics and the employment market rather than merely Seb and Belle from Islington buying old Tom's shack and turning it into a glass box.

My experience of people who sell houses in rural areas is that they are prepared to wait years for the highest price possible. On and around Exmoor properties come on at inflated prices (often in appalling condition) and the owners/families/estates are prepared to wait years to get that price before dropping. So many times I heard, 'Someone will come along and fall in love with it'. It is greed in many cases.

I sold my house on Exmoor for the going rate in a week. A neighbour who wanted top dollar still has hers on for about £75k more than it's worth three years later.

My experience in cities is not that. People are more realistic and if they're not getting an offer they drop the price.

If people in the country were more willing to accept a reasonable offer a) houses would not stand empty year on year and b)prices would not be driven up and more local people would be in with a shout.

My North London-based family purchased a house in a French village (30 years ago). Our neighbours did all things the OP had listed, they offered though, we took large gifts, took them out for meals and generally tried to pay them back in whatever way my parents could think of. They have been and remain our very best friends to this day, a lifetime of cultural exchange, friendship and love. What’s not to like about that?

People in villages could always choose to sell to another villager at a price they could afford? But no, it’s got to be the buyers fault. Again, if these villages held sufficient wealth; they wouldn’t require money from outsiders to prop up their house prices. No one forces a vendor to list a property for a certain amount… Presumably that should be seen as greed of locals not outsiders.

There are many people in villages who would like this.

Those that have any vim and vigour move away...they might return when they have made a bit of money, seen the world and then want to raise their children there.

This leaves a group of people who by definition are often insular and narrow and would say, "This is the best place on earth, I would never live anywhere else and I don't ever want it to change.'

Then there is another group....those who have 'blown in' and want the whole place preserved in aspic. They could be the most insular in my experience. I once heard one such person say, 'We don't want Bristol flushing its toilet of unmarried mothers on the village.' That's the attitude.

80smonster
The post is about Londoners owning second homes and inconveniencing locals.

Maybe don't sell to them then if it's so "inconvenient " @80smonster ?!

PS: you do realise people from OTHER places buy second homes right? Oh and Nimbys from the shires often have kids who move to London.... should this be outlawed too?

I’m sure if the neighbour got new neighbours herself in London she wouldn’t think she needed to furnish the person with a social life. Why should be different because they live somewhere else. Neighbour is on ‘holiday’ and OP is living her day to day life, they are different people living different lives.

OP I’m on your side. You sound like you are doing nice neighbourly things. Although they sound like they are taking the piss. It’s not your job to find this person friends and a life there. A lot of people might not want a friendship with someone who only occasionally visits or have members for a club who drops in odd time.
Sounds like she thought she was buying a ready made community/social life as well as a house.

Jesus actually wept. Is this 2024? I’m asking for a friend…
By that logic non-London natives shouldn’t be allowed to extract wealth/jobs/education/other opportunities from the city to reinvest in their villages. Surely these villagers don’t want money from outsiders tainting their lives? Totally insular and small-minded. I’m amazed anyone could be so naive and short-sighted.

You’ve completely misunderstood me, I’m totally with you. Or maybe you @‘d the wrong poster. I’m a London native and my family have always owned a second property.

Except that's not following a natural conclusion at all. Of course people can move and re-settle and contribute to their communities. The issue is the second home owners snapping up houses that people could live in full time.

Maybe the villagers need to create more wealth so they can pay their trades people? Schools, offices, factories should all need these services. Oddly enough, villagers seem to struggle to understand that online shopping is a major factor in failing high streets, that paired with the limited career opportunities that villages offer means you’re in the position you are. Generally second home owners are renovators and need all of these trades and crafts people and have higher refurbishment budgets too.

I return to my original point, the villagers selling these properties must be the greedy ones, they are pricing their own people out of property. Do you understand that a vendor can choose to sell to whoever they like?

Villagers want the house price rises and these come at a cost. I grew up in Crouch End (now an exclusive London enclave), my parents profited from prices rising there, such that they were able to help me buy property, but not in the area I had grown up in. This isn’t anyone’s fault, it’s the nature of house price rises and all the vendors who profit from this - be they city or village people.

I refer you back to my previous reply to this. This time I'm really not engaging further. Tschüss.

My young adult kids won’t be able to buy in our average London suburb. I am not blaming the wealthy people around me who can now buy here. Why would this be their fault as individuals? I would have to be a dick to resent them as people.

How lovely. With effort on both sides, these kind of relationships can have rewards. If one or both sides dig their heels in without compromise, there is no hope.

You’re basically decrying the entire housing market and all who are invested in it - up and down the country. Not sure a house market price crash would particularly help the country in its current dire state.

When my aunt and uncle sold my grandparents' house, which they'd inherited, they made sure they sold it to a family who were looking for a permanent home, rather than buying a house in the village as a second home or air bnb investment. It is possible to sell responsibly and to buy responsibly, so perhaps everyone concerned should be more aware and do what they can.