To think it is 100% this runner’s fault that I almost hit him?!

[AngeloMysterioso]

On my way to pick DS2 up from nursery with DS1 and DS3 up, around 20 past 5 so it’s already dark. There’s a queue to turn at a T junction and a small cul-de-sac on the left so I’d stopped just before the cul-de-sac to let people out/in. A few cars have pulled out so I’m slowly moving forward after checking mirrors when a runner goes diagonally across the road from behind my right, directly in front of another car going the other way and then in front of my car and I have to stamp on my brake so I don’t hit him. He is wearing:

• trainers- I didn’t see what colour but they definitely weren’t white or anything particularly bright or visible
• black running leggings and shorts
• a dark green long sleeved tshirt
• black gloves
• a dark grey beanie
• literally no bright or reflective items of clothing or accessories whatsoever.

After narrowly avoiding him I beeped my horn, at which point he turned around, swore at me and carried on running. I saw him running up and then around the corner, and further down that road I witnessed him running straight across a zebra crossing without pausing at all to make sure there were no cars approaching.

I didn’t hit him. But AIBU to think if I had, it would not have been my fault, given that he was wearing dark clothing and nothing reflective so he was barely visible, and ran straight in front of my car? I mean how fucking stupid can you be?

Don't be ridiculous, why should all pedestrians wear high-visibility clothing?
It is as much the drivers responsibility to be aware of all their surroundings, not just what is in front.

I don’t know what the world is coming to with all these “pedestrians” (people) thinking they are entitled to walk or run around their environment freely and I bet they don’t even have any special awareness raising education or licences so that they understand the difficulties of the poor car drivers.

No, it's ludicrous, the man wasn't in the wrong, you were driving a car , you need to be more careful. Many drivers are absolutely useless and oblivious of pedestrians

You were in the wrong. And doubly so for beeping. There’s a hierarchy of road users for this reason. Of course the runner is clearly an idiot not taking responsibility for his own safety but what if it had been a young teen? Would you say that to his parents? It’s his fault?

It is not too much to ask for pedestrians to make sure they're seen in the dark. It doesn't have to be high viz and lights. It can simply be not running in front of ruddy cars like they're not there, taking no responsibility at all.

There has to be some give and take.

It's scary how invisible people can be.

I was driving home last week on a country road (NSL) at about 4pm, so just getting dark, and there was a cyclist on the road in front - all in black, no lights or hi-vis gear and even with headlights on, you couldn't see him until you were about 10 metres away. He nearly got hit several times.

He didn't learn his lesson as I saw him again two days later! Crazy.

I do watch out for hazards. But if some bloke dresses in such a way that renders him practically invisible to anyone not wearing night vision googles, and then runs from behind me directly in front of my car, that’s on him.

Yeah, I would. The easiest way to not get hit by a car is to not run out in front of one. It’s pretty simple. Even my 5 year old knows you never ever ever run into the road.

I agree that drivers should be aware of their surroundings and take extra care in the dark or in wet conditions. I also agree that all pedestrians should not be made to wear high vis clothing.

However, I do think there should be some sort of awareness programme for pedestrians, particularly those who are non-drivers, so that they understand that if they wear all dark clothing they are practically invisible to drivers until the moment their headlights hit them full on. This is particularly the case on, for example, rural roads, tree-lined streets or badly lit side roads - which to be honest is a big chunk of the country.

Just a light coloured scarf or bag would help - and make sure your hood isn't obscuring your side vision. And please, please don't take chances like making a run for it to cross the road. It is terrifying when you are driving when someone appears out of nowhere from the side of you when you barely have time to stop, even if you are going very slowly. It puts other road users at risk if a driver swerves or stops suddenly as a reflex reaction.

That's all I'm asking. Just be a little more cautious on the understanding that it is more difficult to see you, however alert the driver is. We all need to work together.

I saw some pedestrians step out in front of a car turning at a junction yesterday. Total dicks for assuming the car would stop. Doesn't matter what the law says, I'm not going head to head with a ton of metal.

Would have. And no, she wouldn't

Yes, if a young teen ran in front of a car or would obviously be his fault. How would it not be?

If you run over a pedestrian it is your fault.

If you're so very sure about that, why did you need to ask mumsnet if you're being unreasonable?

That's not necessarily true.

Pedestrians do have an obligation to behave sensibly when crossing roads or being in the roads.

I was in the Tufty Club at primary school in the 70s and pedestrians absolutely WERE encouraged to wear or carry something light or white in winter.

We have an awful lot of dog walkers round here were the dog has a flashing collar (fab) but you can’t see its owner at all. We have a mix of narrow pavements / no pavements in our suburb and it’s ridiculous how many pedestrians just don’t help themselves be seen.

Not if they run out directly in front of you and there's no way to avoid them.
Then it's their fault. It's well.established in law

The Tufty Club! That brings back memories

Or just something light. Years ago there were govt. TV ads saying Wear Something Light At Night!

Or just eat ready break

Oh yes Tufty club

What has his age got to do with it ? And yes, it would have been a young teen’s fault - if they’re not old enough to appreciate the hazards of road use as a pedestrian then they shouldn’t be out alone should they ? This cyclist wasn’t in the line of visibility demanded by the DVLA for driving standards, he came from behind the car and ran in front of OP while she was moving. MN is utterly batshit sometimes. No-one is ever going to take responsibility for their own actions if we don’t change the mindset of ‘it’s always someone else fault’. Due care and attention while driving doesn’t cover those who simply don’t see it as their responsibility to keep themselves safe on the roads.

Oh and beeping should be to let the person know you are there. It was dark, he acted as though OP wasn’t there, so entirely appropriate.

Or, at the time, live near Sellafield !!

Possibly for the same reasons as most other people do. For validation. Or, on MN, mostly not.

Wow! Some people have forgotten basic physics. A car has a stopping distance that increases or decreases depending on the speed it’s travelling and the weight of the vehicle. Suddenly running out in front of a moving vehicle when you are old enough to know better is incredibly unintelligent. Also, include visibility, the reaction time of the driver. I would never run out onto the road even at a zebra crossing without making sure that the drivers on the road saw me, recognised that I was about to cross, had enough stopping distance to be able to stop in time and had started to slow down to stop. It’s just common sense.

I’d rather not be injured or killed by being hit by a car regardless of who had the right of way. I can’t imagine feeling pleased with myself that I was right while lying in a hospital bed or dead. Makes sense to take personal responsibility for my own safety rather than blindly trusting everyone else on the road.

Go back through OP’s posts, as I have just done, and point out where exactly she said she wasn’t looking at the road properly. She said she was slowly moving forward after checking mirrors, when he ran from the right hand rear of the car directly in front of another car going in the opposite direction, and then in front of her, while she was moving. In what world is this OP’s fault. He was well outside the line of vision. If either car had hit him, he would have been 100% to blame.