To think something has gone wrong in schools? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz0m2x30p4eo

[RebelBabybel]

From the BBC : school exclusions have doubled in the last 10 years.

I’ve worked in schools for 30 years : KS1/Early Years.

When I first started I was expected to do : hand written, detailed plans. Assessments. Handwritten reports. I had no TA. I had a blackboard. Children had books. I had to be firm with behaviour, schools had very clear behaviour policies in place, and the head would have an overview, was visible, check classes, be the ‘go to’ person if anything was difficult to manage.

Over the years, particularly in the Early Years things have changed massively.
My latest role has involved a manager who is mostly on the computer and rarely interacts with the children. No planning, no assessment. Resources are put out, but there is an ethos that it’s ‘wrong’ to show the children how to use them. Therefore children don’t use jigsaws as puzzles, they take the pieces out and transport them round the classroom. A doctors role play is set up, but with no input as to what the resources are there are for or how to role play ‘being a doctor’.

There is an expectation, a ‘box’ of what constitutes ‘normal’ behaviour : even with very young children. Any child who is outside this box, is often labelled ‘I think they’ve got autism, I think they’ve got ADHD’ without a formal assessment. These children - rather than getting to know them, or putting clear strategies in place, are quickly labelled as difficult : and fall into a stereotype that causes a negative cycle. There seems to be little ‘fault’ addressed to the teaching style, and the ‘fault??’ is centred on the child, I’d also argue that it is NOT a fault. It’s called being a child.

Children seem to be very readily excluded from schools without the adults fully questioning their teaching style and whether that might be at fault.

To be completely honest, teaching was far easier 30 years ago. Children were better behaved, and there was far better, stronger support from senior management. It felt more like a team, rather than:

an SLT who are in meetings, on a computer, off to conferences, in the staff room, pushing ‘new’ initiatives and criticising their staff.

The difficulty is that to get a place in a specialist provision that will meet the child's needs means the child having to be failed by mainstream.

Children with behaviour challenges make life difficult for the school and are more likely to get a specialist placement. Some children are failed as they can not cope in mainstream but are made to stay in this environment especially in instances where they cause little disruption.

The damage to the mental health and well-being of these children is huge.
I almost wished my child would have kicked off at school as then maybe they would have been placed into a school that would meet their needs.
Instead we have been forced to home educate

How do you manage to meet everyone needs.

Ie your teaching a yr 4 class
Most of the class are managing the work.
But child A is bored as they are working at yr 7 level and child B hasn't grasped reception level learning.

Or she was masking heavily and came home and exploded!

I agree with all your points apart from being socially conservative. The whole trans issue is like walking on a tight rope at our school, terrified to say anything deemed as wrong

I agree - our primary is the opposite of socially conservative. I hate the word 'woke' as a general rule, but feeding the children the latest right-on social justice themes often seems to take precedence over wider learning, well-being and creativity.

The academy secondary it feeds into, however, is the epitome of socially conservative - zero tolerance, focused on narrow academics, obsessed with petty uniform rules, little pastoral care, not remotely inclusive (they are notoriously brilliant at avoiding acceptjng pupils with SEND, even those with EHCPs).

I think it's about extremes - so many schools seem to have polarised into taking one ideological approach or the other, rather than finding a sensible middle way.

Were they all diagnosed though?

Many people are only diagnosed with ND from late teens onwards, and particularly if they are women it is more likely when they are much older when they have a child who has a diagnosis themselves.

@LittleBearPad I mean sure, if you are only interested in apportioning blame, then “bad parenting” can be a useful catch-all. But if you are interested in WHY the aforementioned bad parenting is on the uptick, my answer to that is that we have massive social problems that are being manifested through our children’s inability to cope in school. Stop at blaming the parents if you just want to stop having to think or do anything to change it.

Was there no need to exclude them though as they were allowed to be them selves and work at their level even if that meant colouring in the corner? Today those children are being forced to sit still and follow an impossible (to them) curriculum.

One change since the 1990s is the improvement in neonatal healthcare for very premature babies, and babies with other conditions. Many who wouldn't have survived now do, but with significant disabilities. I wonder if this could account for the greatly increased demand for special school places, for which there simply hasn't been enough special school expansion?

Wow this is crazy. When I was a teenager of course I had an attitude etc and wanted to be big in front of my mates but overarching feeling i knew the adults were in charge and were to be respected. If I was in trouble at school then my parents backed the teachers. They instilled with me even if I disagreed that in the world of work etc we have to respect the ‘boss’
Like you say, everyone thinks they’re an expert. They sit and watch TikTok and YouTube or podcasts and think they know better than for example a subject specialist, the kids and the parents. The kids behave poorly and don’t respect the rules and the parents back the child, it’s bonkers. If you don’t like the school and the rules then simply homeschool but no they want the free childcare!

There is better diagnosis of conditions - I spoke to a consultant paediatrician about this - and more parents are willing to allow their child to be diagnosed with ND conditions.

I've volunteered on and off with kids since I was a teen, and only in the last decade, give or take a few years, have children or their parents willing have come forward and said they/their child has x. There as before I had my suspicions but the parent has acted like their child was really badly behaved with everyone, when they weren't. I also know a couple of people who didn't get an official diagnosis at primary school as their parents didn't want them "labelled". They subsequently screwed up at secondary school where there was no help for them. Now everyone is trying to get their kids diagnosed asap and particularly before secondary school.

The consultant paediatrician when she just got her role with the team she was in approached primary schools in in the area she worked in to make it easier for them to get pupils get assessed. The schools refused to engage. (This was under Blair's government.) Over a decade later there were large waiting lists for children to see the team she worked in for any reason.

Exactly! My parents were the same! I wouldn’t even think the teacher would have marked it wrong. They are the expert not the kid

This is definitely the case, and has been known about by people working population/public health for years. I work in this area and years ago I worked on modelling the predicted growth in numbers of children with disabilities and additional needs.

However it seems that despite knowing this was going to happen there has been no preparation all by education, LAs and children's health services. Presumably it is difficult to prepare for anything under austerity when there's not enough funding for your current caseload, nevermind preparing for future caseloads.

If you read my PP you would see that some health services were looking at it before austerity but some schools refused to engage.

People forget stigmas against illness and disability were worse in the 00s then they are now.

Absolutely-yet, people post on here all the time with complaints about teachers making decisions they disagree with and want to go in and ‘kick off’ at them about it!

-the teacher shouted at my child.
-the teacher moved my child’s name onto the cloud.
-the teacher has suggested that my child plays with someone other than my friend’s daughter.
-the teacher has separated my child from his ‘best’ friend on the carpet.
-the teacher has given too much homework.
-the teacher hasn’t given enough homework.
-the teacher has dared get pregnant whilst my child is in their class.
-the teacher wouldn’t give out 28 party invitations for me.
-the teacher has left and now we have to get used to another teacher.

etc etc

An all too common response on here if a child is told off at school now is for the parent to go and put the teacher straight!

That still happens, again, in all the schools I'm familiar with.

Long term plans, medium term plans, weekly plans, overviews, assessments , learning journals.Book scrutinies, learning walks etc.

Your school sounds crap. It happens. It doesn't mean that it applies everywhere else .

I agree-this still happens in all schools I work with.

We don’t have to hand write planning any more though. Which is a good thing. Though I’m sure you still could if you wanted to, but it’s not somehow better 😂

@wellington77 sometimes teachers do get it wrong though.

DD had two questions marked wrong on her test. I encouraged her to POLITELY talk to the teacher and ask for clarification. She got the one mark and the other the teacher agreed that while technically right, it didn't match the scheme so she couldn't award it to her and explained how to get that particular answer. Now she knows for next time, whereas if she hadn't asked she would've kept getting it wrong.

Teachers are humans , they will make mistakes. They're not infallible and they don't actually know everything. No one does.It happens, it's not the end of the world. As for experts, given the cuts, you'll find the expert being a TA or the PE teacher teaching Maths or English or Science.

I'm not saying that there are parents out there who could not do a lot better- but school is supposed to intervene and break the chain of poverty/abuse/social problems etc. The last government turned them into a prosecutor instead and they see abuse everywhere instead of where the true fault lies.

How? How exactly are "schools" supposed to that?

I can't provide housing. I can't make mum dump the druggie boyfriend. I can't stop parents beating each other up or/and their kids. I can't pay for their bare necessities. I can't make the kids unlearn violent behaviour or aggressive language /swearing . I can't make a parent stop being an alcoholic or drug addict. I can't "heal" a parent of their learning disabilities or mental health issues or their personality disorders. I can't make a parent love their child. I can't make a parent care.

So instead I make dozens of reports that rarely go anywhere, I ring SS in my own time, I feed kids, I clean kids, I buy them stuff (from essentials like food and colouring pencils to little treats and rewards), I model good behaviour and conflict resolution, I am their safe space, I let them rant and rave and hold them when they cry and listen to their disclosures, I am their punching bag (emotionally and physically ) , I adapt to their needs, I try to teach them what I can and what they can , day in, day out and it's still not enough and it doesn't fucking work. But I'm still there the next day, ready to try again.

In fact, in Year 2 the year after Covid in 2021 we were told Covid was no excuse at all for children not making the same levels as previous years. Wilfully ignoring the 2 terms of school they have missed and the full term of 'bubbles' that had caused so much disruption. I'm still appalled at the stress that caused staff and children.

Hear hear.

I suspect it goes back to the change in early years settings. My oldest kids went to playgroup where activities were set up some of which had a clear outcome (think making a pirate hat or decorating one). By the time my youngest went five years later thiose activities were deemed "too directional". Play could happen in or out at any time so basically a gang of boys marouded in and out while the girls stayed inside. It was chaotic, nobody was helped to learn scissor or other skills and my DS hated it. His siblings had adored it. The playgroup said the change had been made in light of what ofsted wanted to see.

I definitely think more kids are diagnosed as ND but for all the ones I know, you can definitely also see it in their family. Doesn't mean they are all disruptive in class though. I run a beavers group in a school and you definitely get kids every year who are very disruptive. These are all middle class kids though of course no idea what happens at home. In my kids classes - there are always at least three who are permanently disruptive, plus a few more who are clearly behind their academics. No idea how the teachers manage.

This is quite interesting about being right but not the answer in the mark scheme. I was chatting to someone from and education think tank that said if you want all schools to be “good” (which I think means not “bad” in this context) then you need top down prescriptions on teaching etc. But if you want schools to be “great” then schools and teachers need more discretion. You want children to be able to think broadly and critically rather than to identify a specific outcome as those will be the kinds of skills that drive economic growth in future.

Sorry it’s a bit broader than your daughter (who sounds great btw) but it reminded me of the point.

Very emotional post.

You're a special person. Incredibly special.

On a sidenote, I was just thinking the other day that the age old question of 'what's the point of my learning about x,y,z', has been made even harder to answer, by children having a source of information about pretty much everything, in a small device in their hands...