To think something has gone wrong in schools? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz0m2x30p4eo

[RebelBabybel]

From the BBC : school exclusions have doubled in the last 10 years.

I’ve worked in schools for 30 years : KS1/Early Years.

When I first started I was expected to do : hand written, detailed plans. Assessments. Handwritten reports. I had no TA. I had a blackboard. Children had books. I had to be firm with behaviour, schools had very clear behaviour policies in place, and the head would have an overview, was visible, check classes, be the ‘go to’ person if anything was difficult to manage.

Over the years, particularly in the Early Years things have changed massively.
My latest role has involved a manager who is mostly on the computer and rarely interacts with the children. No planning, no assessment. Resources are put out, but there is an ethos that it’s ‘wrong’ to show the children how to use them. Therefore children don’t use jigsaws as puzzles, they take the pieces out and transport them round the classroom. A doctors role play is set up, but with no input as to what the resources are there are for or how to role play ‘being a doctor’.

There is an expectation, a ‘box’ of what constitutes ‘normal’ behaviour : even with very young children. Any child who is outside this box, is often labelled ‘I think they’ve got autism, I think they’ve got ADHD’ without a formal assessment. These children - rather than getting to know them, or putting clear strategies in place, are quickly labelled as difficult : and fall into a stereotype that causes a negative cycle. There seems to be little ‘fault’ addressed to the teaching style, and the ‘fault??’ is centred on the child, I’d also argue that it is NOT a fault. It’s called being a child.

Children seem to be very readily excluded from schools without the adults fully questioning their teaching style and whether that might be at fault.

To be completely honest, teaching was far easier 30 years ago. Children were better behaved, and there was far better, stronger support from senior management. It felt more like a team, rather than:

an SLT who are in meetings, on a computer, off to conferences, in the staff room, pushing ‘new’ initiatives and criticising their staff.

Except I don’t do that and even if I did - how does that change the problems I have outlined? How do you deal with the fact that there aren’t enough seats for people to sit where is best for them? How do you deal with the noise level that needs to be different for different pupils?

So you are only ever talking about your own exceptionally narrow position, but extrapolating as if it applies to the entirety of the education system?

None of the teachers I work with do this. They try their hardest to meet all children's needs and treat them fairly.

(Sorry, meant to quote: if I said a child has poor eyesight, and weak hearing, I would be negligent in not acknowledging their needs. Similarly, adapting work for a child with poor working memory or weak impulse control is not a ‘stereotype’, it us recognising and meeting a need)

I , if anything, significantly MORE positive in my approach to children who have learning and behavioural needs. It doesn’t make their needs magically go away.

I was with you until you said that teachers don’t bother getting to know kids or put strategies in place. That’s basically all we ever do - put endless strategies in place so kids can fit in.
I agree though there is a massive problem. Children don’t like school. Schools and parents have a difficult relationship. Heads are too concerned with avoiding complaints. Schools are chronically under funded and staff are exhausted and undervalued.

You are putting the whole onus onto teachers though.

1 teacher in front of 30 pupils with a hugely wide cross section of needs can only do so much, when they are given inadequate funding and a broken curriciulum. If you add incredibly stressful testing and inspection pressures, it’s a perfect storm.

The situation we are in now, is massively different to the classes we taught in the 90s.

You’re still missing the point of what I’m saying though. I’m not disagreeing with you that some knowledge is important. I’m pro-learning and pro-education. I’m not suggesting there is NO value in Romeo and Juliet or in learning about history.
I am talking about intrinsic motivation and your students are in fact communicating that to you when they say ‘but miss I can just put this into my calculator which I happen to carry around in my pocket’. It’s true! They can! Unfortunately a lot of stuff has become meaningless for this generation because of our technological advancement. The world has moved on and school hasn’t and this is why so many kids are disengaged with it.

You might be able to deal with the question but it doesn’t alter the fact that learning huge amounts of academic information and regurgitating it onto a test paper is demotivating for today’s youth. Yes for a very small number of kids who might want to go into a very academic field or who might want to read law perhaps the old ways still work. But there is no doubt in my mind that for a large proportion of young people today the curriculum and the qualifications system is outdated. It is singularly focused on academic ability. It doesn’t take into account skills needed for the modern world such as critical thinking skills, communication and interpersonal skills, teamwork, conflict management, reasoning ability, resilience, problem solving etc etc. It doesn’t account for the fact that information is literally at our fingertips 24/7/365. And is unfairly balanced towards academic achievement and not creativity, original thought or enterprise.

There needs to be a shift in what is important and how we measure it and honestly I am surprised that as a teacher you don’t see this ( I am an ex teacher by the way so do have first hand experience too) but please know that I am not criticising teachers. I know how dedicated and unbelievably hardworking they are.

Pray for our generation who will be elderly and needy when they are grown up 😬😬😬

It is singularly focused on academic ability. It doesn’t take into account skills needed for the modern world such as critical thinking skills, communication and interpersonal skills, teamwork, conflict management, reasoning ability, resilience, problem solving etc etc

This 'skills versus knowledge' debate has been going on in education for decades. You cannot teach critical thinking without knowledge to think critically about etc etc. The great IT revolution in teaching has yet to come. Lockdown was the biggest killer of that. The idea that kids can sit in front of a computer and absorb knowledge without the need for a teacher was comprehensively put to bed when vast swathes of them failed to do that during remote learning.

The model of imparting knowledge to children via an expert adult teaching to a group hasn't changed for thousands of years, and it's not because we're stuck in the mud, but because it works.

So no real solution then. Because that's just wishy washy word soup and something that a lot of teachers do anyway.

You can't love or monkey dance a child's needs away.

We’ll have to agree to disagree 😊

What i do agree with is that the model hasn’t changed for many many years (more like decades, it’s not that old) but I absolutely do not agree that it still works. I think it could potentially work if it was modernised but until it is I foresee more and more problems such as the ever growing number of teachers and pupils leaving and the continuation of 1 in 5 of all school leavers leaving without qualifications.

I encourage all those things and lots more, but when, out of a class of 30, you have

1 non verbal pupil with severe ASD, in nappies with an EHCP that doesn’t fund anywhere near full-time support.

4 pupils who almost certainly have ADHD but are too young for a referral in our LA.

5 pupils receiving SaLT, all of whom have therapy programs that should be implemented daily.

1 child with significant physics needs (PEG/hoist) again with funding for very little support.

The usual distribution of children needing interventions for fine motor skills, social interaction support and literacy/maths catch up.

The usual distribution of children whose parents are divorcing, who don’t get enough to eat at dinner time, whose shoes are a bit small, whose coat has too many holes in, who don’t get read to at home.

Plus a phonics screener to get through in June, an Ofsted lurking, and a curriculum that is narrow, boring and over-inflated.

There is only so much one teacher can do.

I would absolutely love to love my job again. It’s all I’ve wanted to do since I was tiny. I can’t do it alone with no resources or funding, whilst simultaneously being slated as a profession for being ‘snippy and negative’.

What i do agree with is that the model hasn’t changed for many many years (more like decades, it’s not that old) but I absolutely do not agree that it still works.

I’ve taught enough classes to know that it works. I know that when it doesn’t work there are kids that it doesn’t work with who it would never have worked with. However now, as opposed to previously, we’re actually expected to get to learn stuff and it is deemed our fault when they do not. Accountability is much higher.

That's exactly my experience in primary too.
Two P7 boys running wild and climbing on the canteen roof so the rest of the school couldn't get in to have their lunches.
This standoff ensued for over an hour.

Ridiculous.

To challenge assumptions made about children, to stop constraining them by stereotypes

Given your later example of poor and weak, do you mean that we should assume that every child is able to access the content every lesson? If so, you're a bit late to the party, "teach to the top" has been around for ages (and can, in many cases, be harmful when I need to address complex vector calculations with student who still struggle with recognising vectors over scalars in the first place).

to encourage positivity

Again, a bit late to the party. "Building relationships" is the new get out of jail free card for useless SLT as it, once again, pushes blame for any issues a child has in a class onto the teacher. For some, positivity absolutely works, but those children really need a whole lot of nurturing that just doesn't happen when you barely have an hour to teach several abstract scientific concepts, but Johnny decides to spend the first 25mins of the lesson walking around the room asking every single student whether they had chewing gum, singing songs with swear words in them at the top of his voice, while ignoring my presence altogether (yes, this has happened, repeatedly, in the last year. I was told to build positive relationships with the child - oh, and that results for everyone needed to stay good). We do our utmost to be positive, we really do, but some children need a dose of realism before they enter the world of work and see that the real world doesn't give them a hot chocolate for not kicking the door in on their way out.

self reflection

I don't actually think a teacher would deny that this happens. From self-assessment with next steps, to PSHE lessons with literal self-reflective content, to sodding restorative conversations, schools are all about self-reflection.

fun, love

Is all very well and good, but with a huge curriculum to get through in a tight time frame, the fun part has been well and truly removed. When I frequently have to seriously think about whether I have time to do this practical, which will take 2 lessons to do properly, or just show a video and do the data analysis the kids actually need from this in the space of 1 lesson (meaning I can actually cover the content before the next assessment is through) then the fun has been taken out of learning, especially with all the new fads being required (mini-whiteboards and their associated time-consuming issues are the bane of my life).

I love my job, I really do, but even with a can-do mindset, great work ethic and high organisational skills I am now at breaking point due to the constant demands of me as one person in a classroom and school full of people with no time to actually do the job well.

@Appuskidu

My DC starting reception would be one on your list there though.

He had a PECS book, non-verbal etc. Could use the toilet, but would hold in all day unless told to use the toilet. His best friend was in pull ups.

He - and his friend - are amazing. The ‘non verbal/don’t get close or he’ll hit you’ child I interacted with last week - is amazing.

The solution isn’t to push to exclude them. For my DC that would have meant a school far away, and a long waiting list and out of education while we waited.

He is now doing so well in Year 1 - ditto his friend.

Yet last year I felt we were at a crossroads. Thankfully the right decision was made.

But without pushing, fighting etc it could have been a very different outcome for DC.

One of the most inspirational films I’ve ever watched is ‘Life is Beautiful’. That Dad that made things fun despite the situation they were in.

All children are amazing. I'm glad your son is doing well. You've given examples of two children who with the right TA support can thrive in mainstream. Inclusion works in this set up. Many children would thrive in a specialist set up. I've supported many families move to specialist and they have thrived there.

Try looking outside your own experiences and reading some of the very honest posts from teachers on here.

This is a Year 1/2 class. I’m not suggesting any sort of push to exclude children with additional needs, but mainstream classes need appropriate funding to enable additional adults in the class. One teacher cannot do this alone.

The children I work with are amazing. That doesn't mean we can meet their needs in their mainstream classrooms. One eats everything in sight. One bites his peers and staff. One loves throwing objects around the classroom. One has physical difficulties that require the use of hoists and two adults to support changing. One has no concept of how to compromise with other children. One has no concept that other children exist. One is in nappies. One was toilet trained but is regressing. One is jumping on tables and throwing chairs. One is blind. One is deaf, with a cochlear implant, but has significant language delay. One is struggling to come in to school in the morning without hurting his caregiver. One is not coming in at all. One is working at least 5 years behind his peers in academic subjects. Many have no language to tell adults when something is wrong. They are all amazing. We care about each and every one of them dearly. They are making progress. But their competing needs and the lack of suitable break-out spaces in our mainstream school means that their needs cannot all be met in our mainstream school at the same time. No amount of wishful thinking would allow us to meet the needs of all of these children in the space available, with the staff available, with the funding available. We won't be excluding any of them, unless there are valid grounds. But we absolutely will be encouraging their parents to consider if we are a suitable setting for their child.

*Note that those "Ones" were mostly representative of a lot more than one child...

Children in mainstream still in pull ups need an adult to change them. The class teacher can't do that and teach maths at the same time.

Half the class sizes, split them by ability. Howls of horror about this always but it works. Then double the number of TAs so teachers can focus on teaching and the TAs can ensure the needs of children within each class are met. Ensure schools have sufficient sensory and breakout rooms.

I.e. fund education properly. Miraculously lots of the problems would be vastly reduced because the children would be engaged, feel they were supported and given the help they need to learn, and far less anxious because the environment wouldn't be so loud and overwhelming and chaotic.

None of it is rocket science. If the UK economy and fiscal decisions had been managed competently and then services would not all be failing.

Oh ffs. If only life was a movie eh?
Or maybe not, as the dad dies at the end...

Two of the most inspirational films I watched about teaching were Sister Act 2 and School of Rock.

And yet Delores would have been out on her arse over student safety, and seemed to have no curriculum to teach. There was base respect there from the kids (and every kid in that class seemed to be able to sing). Try the nails on blackboard or the no-shit-taking attitude with kids nowadays and see whether they really do fall quiet.

And Jack Black's kids would have failed their state-mandated tests, he would have failed every book look, every observation, and it's completely unrealistic that none of the kids in the classroom rebelled and/ or blabbed about their secret project.

They are great films that show how talented kids are, how teachers can inspire passion if left to their own devices, but the reality is that it never happens in UK schools because everything is micromanaged.