To think I can't do anything about aunt's violent marriage?

[NoisyDenimShaker]

My aunt is about my age, and we've always been close. Her husband is violent and abusive in other ways too (verbally and emotionally) and has been for years. Their DC are now teens.

DA appears to have no intention of ever leaving him. They're not short of money and she had a good career before giving it up, one she could go back to. So I don't think it's finances that make her stay.

I'm right in thinking there's nothing I can do if she doesn't want to leave him, right? Sometimes I've thought about sending the police round and calling social services, but I still don't think she'd leave him.

I'm just wondering if anyone else has dealt with long-term DV in the family, how you handled it, and what the upshot was? They've been married approaching 20 years and I do worry about what will happen to her when the DC have gone to uni.

As above.

Anyone know how the police would view recorded phone calls? Would they act on those?

FFS that's no reason not to report it

Did you think baby P was the only case CS were involved in? What about the thousands of others that had good outcomes but don't make it into the news. Report it FFS. She'll probably stay with him, that's what happens sadly. At least the kids will have some grown ups in their life who are giving the message that their dad's behaviour isn't ok.

They might not witness the violence but I'm sure they witness the contempt your aunt is treated with and try hard not to do anything to make it aimed at them.

Call the social FFS

This Is incredibly rude and dismissive of social workers who work incredibly hard every single day keeping children safe. How dare you bring up one failing from many years ago to disparage an entire workforce when you have no idea and have sat there knowing that children are being abused for years and taken no steps to protect them. You don't know how it would have gone if you had referred them to children's services but at least you would have tried. As is it you're the bystander who hasn't done anything.

I'm afraid you can't dress this up any other way. Making your children live in a violent household IS abuse. Just because they're not being hit doesn't mean they're not being traumatised.
And it's not up to any of us to second guess what social services may or may not do. We all have a duty to report.

“As is it you're the bystander who hasn't done anything.”

OP, you’re “As is it you're the bystander who hasn't done anything” but have also come here to justify your lack of action, and actually blamed professionals who have not been told about the family.

I left my abusive ex. He has unsupervised contact as I lost the court battle. I managed to prove he was abusive to me but the family court doesn't think that should stop fathers having contact. Now my kids get abused without me there to protect them, he has a new partner now so things are better but for a couple years without a partner to abuse he abused the kids to hurt me. I left him because he had escalated and hurt our dd, so I don't regret leaving him but I do regret leaving without proof he was dangerous to the kids. I like most in MN assumed social services and family court would protect my kids. My experience is not uncommon it's the most likely outcome of leaving an abusive man who fights you for contact. If the abuse had not escalated to the kids then without a doubt my kids would have been better off me staying with him and waiting till they adult to leave. He never did any childcare never looked after them just spent his whole time gaming and watching tv, now he has contact without me he is much more involved and they suffer. Things are much better now but for a couple years I had them scared and begging not to go and not understanding why if I loved them I would send them to him. They didn't understand that if I didn't follow the court order then they would end up living with him not me.

Social services come down hard on women who don't leave abusers. They use this to have concerns about the woman's ability to protect her children. This would be rightly so but then when the woman leaves family court orders the kids to spend time with that abuser without the mum there to protect them and SS when begged for help tell the mum to go back to court nothing they can do

I hate seeing posts like this because people honestly don't understand the reality of our family court or child protection services. People assume those who say the system failed them somehow are poor parents and brought it in themselves. I used to think the same until it happened to me

I wish I could give you a simple answer but I don’t really know. I think it was a combination of:

-Therapy and working through some previous experiences.

-love and support from my friends and family

-professional support. My kids are school age and the safeguarding lead reached out to me after she saw me crying in my car a couple of times.

-reading about coercive control and recognising some patterns.

-the fact that I felt absolutely no pressure at all to leave him. Professionals were worried about me but there weren’t any concerns about my kids so they were absolutely happy to let me take as long as I needed. I know it’s hard especially with kids involved, but I really believe that’s crucial. Your aunt has had all of her power and all of her self confidence stripped away. She won’t be able to leave (and definitely not permanently) unless she feels empowered and trusted to make the decision herself.

In the end it wasn’t the ‘big’ things that made me leave. I think because they were too hard for me to get hold of. There was one day when my phone pinged on the table and he picked it up, read the message and then put it back down again. I watched him and thought ‘that’s not ok. I’m not happy about that’. Then over a few weeks I started to notice other things and beginning to recognise them from the stuff I’d read about coercive control. One day we watching TV and I looked at him and thought ‘I don’t love him. I don’t want to grow old with him’. It was only once I’d made that choice in my mind that I was able to see how serious the other stuff was. It was too overwhelming before that.

I hope that’s helpful in some way. I’m sorry that you and your family are going through this.

I broke her confidence and told her family exactly what her husband was doing. Her adult sons and her mother were all ready to rescue her, pay for her lawyers, everything.

It's not just me who hasn't called social services, it's all of them, too. I don't feel it's my place to call them. I blew the whistle on the abuse within the family and hoped they would take appropriate action. She won't leave him, and what will happen to her behind closed doors once the services are involved and he knows she's told at least one person?

FGS, I broke her confidence and told her entire family exactly what was going on.

And what happened after that? Did they leave? How did your relationship with the person pan out?

To be honest I'm not sure this is terribly fair on you either, OP. It's great that you're willing to support her of course, but while it's all very well using you as an emotional punchbag what the hell are you supposed to do about it if she absolutely refuses to leave?

The only thing I can suggest which might just make a difference is pointing out that she may lose the children too - not through SS intervention, but by their own free choice when they're old enough to escape from this horror

If the children have witnessed incidents @NoisyDenimShaker its not just your word.

SS would surely speak to the children (if you reported). Your DA husband may be barred from the home pending investigation.

Yeah, exactly. I think the most likely outcome of calling social services would be to make things worse. Thanks for sharing your story. I'm sorry all that happened to you.

"Social services come down hard on women who don't leave abusers. They use this to have concerns about the woman's ability to protect her children. This would be rightly so but then when the woman leaves family court orders the kids to spend time with that abuser without the mum there to protect them and SS when begged for help tell the mum to go back to court nothing they can do."

I'm pretty sure that some version of this is what would happen.

Thanks for sharing; that's very helpful.

I'm so glad you got out!!

Yes, it's been distressing at times. And I do feel helpless, since she seems to have no intention of trying to leave. If I call SS, what will he do to her then? There seems to be no solution.

And then he'd come back, and what would happen to her then?

I don’t know why you started this thread. What do you hope to get out of it?

There are a number of things social services do when violent abusers are arrested and removed from the home. Including but not limited to;

• apply for a DVDS disclosure and share information with the victim
• support the victim to apply for an occupation order or non molestation order
• refer the victim to DA counselling and support services who provide intensive support to safety plan and also develop insight and understanding about the impact of DA on children
• support the victim to secure safe alternative housing if necessary
• if the victim rejects all offers of support and help they can escalate the case to child protection, PLO or even care proceedings which at least will be a step towards protecting the children from him even if she doesn't want to be protected
• refer the perpetrator to a DA programme to support him to develop insight and change his behaviour
• liaise with police to support safety planning and appropriate police action
• liaise with schools to ensure children have pastoral support that they need
• refer children to therapy or counselling services

but sure, it would be pointless, baby P, blah blah

Oh for goodness sake @TheSilkWorm dont be coming on this thread with your knowledge, your information and realistic attitude!

Blimey, you’ll be saying the kids should be supported next!

😁

From the original post:

"I'm just wondering if anyone else has dealt with long-term DV in the family, how you handled it, and what the upshot was?"

Well, I'm glad you find the situation funny. You've clearly never dealt with anything like this in your own family, ie a violent situation where the victim won't leave. And none of what Silkworm says prevents DA's husband from coming home and treating her even worse, at which point she'll tell no one.

SHE needs to be the one to rescue herself and the kids. I told her adult sons, her mother, and the other cousins, because I will not keep DV quiet, and none of them have called the authorities either.

These days children living in a home where there is domestic abuse are also considered victims of that abuse.

So although you are worried about your aunt, the children need to be your focus here.

I would suggest you make a disclosure to the safeguarding lead at the children's school.

You can't do nothing, as awful as it is, your aunt has put you in a no win situation and you can't ignore the information.

But none of this protects her from him if she doesn't want to leave, correct? She would have to leave to actually be protected from him. I find it very frustrating that she doesn't, but don't want to pile on her as she's vulnerable.

All the help you've outlined, she would have to be accepting of it to have it, right? They wouldn't force her into counselling. And can they force him into a DV programme if there are no current injuries? (It's a horrible mix of coercive control and occasional violence, think Sleeping with the Enemy.) I think she would slam the door in their faces and not accept the counselling or anything. In your para about child protection and PLO, wouldn't they only do that where there's proof - ie visible injuries? I don't know when the last incident of violence was.

As long as she doesn't want to leave, doesn't want to split up with him, and doesn't want to press charges, and if there are no recent incidents (there might be but she hasn't told me), wouldn't it be pretty hard to get all the help you outline?

The idea of him being arrested and turfed out of the home is truly beautiful though...

SHE needs to rescue herself but you won't refer them to the services who can support her!
Addutionally I forgot to add that in cases of DA if the victim is wanting to separate they can if appropriate support her without even telling the perpetrator. Having a visit from a social worker often galvanises women into finally taking action and that's especially so if they feel hopeless and don't know where to start without help. But sure, you've done all you can.