Wrap around care for those who don't work??

[Raisinsandweetabix]

Free breakfast clubs, afterschool clubs. Why would you need this if you are at home all day anyway? Another kick in the teeth to working parents. Obviously not including those in dire need of this care.

@StandingSideBySide so you begrudge unwell and disabled parents more respite by accessing before/after school care?

I'm not referring to picking up kids from the same school I'm referring to parents of send children with children in multiple schools.

The decline in the number of childminders really is terrible. Sector has halved in the last decade!

@SoiledMyselfDuringSomeTurbulence It’s terrible, same across social care, TAs - women's work’ across the board. A huge cultural shift is needed. It seems this thread is split between those who feel the state needs to step in (tax payer burden and all that goes with that) and those who feel that parents* are responsible for their children and the state should not be providing as much as it does.

*Let’s be honest here, when we say parents it’s mothers. A generalisation to which many can give examples of exceptions, but really they are that, exceptions. We are talking about women’s work here whether we are paid money to do the work of care or we are provided for by a man in paid work.

edit to say - bloody love the user name 😆

Yes but again, and I'm not sure how to word this in a simpler way, it isn't a perk for the parents. It is to give children who are statistically more likely to struggle and less likely to thrive a bit of a leg up.

It isn't childcare. It isn't to do the parents a favour. It's to ensure children are sufficiently supported and provided for.

I can see why it feels like a favour to the parents and it probably does have some benefit to them, but that’s a by product of helping the children.

Agree. My DH knows one of the SLT at my children’s school and he complains about the schools afterschool provision. I view it as supervision rather than enrichment, my kids are happy to go for a few hours a week but complain if they have to stay until 5:30.

The snack is biscuits then either a hot dog/pizza or wrap with ham at 4.45 when the others have gone home. If they have that they won’t eat tea and I do begrudge the UPF shovelled into them. I’d be happy to pack a snack but of course they wouldn’t chose that over pigs ears, eyes and arseholes which they both love.

If I use breakfast club I give them breakfast first as it’s all sugary cereal and more UPF.

I don’t dislike the club - but it’s not ideal. It’s to fill a gap in childcare for me, if that’s your child’s lifeline things are far from optimal at home.

I’m an old bint. Things that we might call wrap around care now were just that @SunQueen24. Enough supervision that we didn’t break ourselves/someone else/stuff, connect 4 and some scrap paper and felt tips, no particular developmental activities. Mum worked, we had to go. And I loved it, had a hoot with the other pre-latchkey kids, chatting, making our own entertainment. No mums should give themeselves a kicking about using such basic services. For many (most?) kids it’s more than OK.

Quite. I just mean it’s not something to envy/begrudge another child.

I’m a disabled single parent to a five year old who has severe autism. I cannot work because of how severe my own chronic pain is and being the sole carer for an autistic child who has meltdowns and lashes out at me 24/7 (he’s only in part time school) is a struggle to say the least.

also, I don’t know what you mean about wrap around childcare? Because if I was to put my child in breakfast or afterschool club for me to attend a hospital appointment, I would have to pay.

not all of us on benefits are the stereotype of not working because we don’t want to and raking in the perks and benefits. I WANT to work, I physically CANNOT - but it doesn’t mean I shouldn’t be entitled to access financial support for childcare

Not against it but I think rolling out free lunches for all past the infant age would have been more helpful to all families we both work snd struggle to afford the 180 a month for lunch.
i live in a very deprived area and there are loads of free holiday clubs here only for people on benefits even if you want to pay you can’t the places rarely get filled it’s crazy when there’s people desperate for the services.

This is so true - I'm perfectly happy with our ASC but it's not aiming to be educational- it's playing in the playground, toys or a kids' film. Breakfast club I imagine would be cheap cereal and minimal adult supervision. Interestingly Labour have stipulated that if private providers offer educational support in wrap around care they are liable for VAT, but not if it's childcare only and no education.

I’d never have used breakfast club as I had 3 children to get to different schools / split site schools and had to leave early as it was , running all over the place to get them there on time .
I would have liked the opportunity to use a free after school club on a certain day/ days because once again I was running from one place to another.
My children had some paid for extra curricular activities after school not necessarily linked to the school .
I was a SAHM at that time , mainly because the youngest had disabilities .
The disabled child needed to be picked up during school hours x 2 per week be taken for therapy sessions elsewhere.
On top of that Friday school was morning only stopped before lunch.
So no , I did not have 9 am to 3pm Mon to Friday “to myself “ 🙄

The proposal is for ALL children so I don’t understand your issue at all? It’s not prioritising parents that don’t work over those that do ? Do you think your nieces and nephews should be deprived of it just because you don’t like your SIL’s lifestyle ? How about enjoying your own life and stop counting other peoples pockets ? Incidentally , how much do you think she would need to earn to pay for full time child care for 6 children ? And where would she find employment that would pay that given you’ve said she has no work experience whatsoever ?

In many cases where families are struggling to feed their children, or have mental health issues wraparound care is a good plan essential actually!
however, I do understand what OP is trying to say that if it’s a stay at home parent without any of the above why should everybody else subsidise it difficult one?

This.
Save the kids from the feckless / awful parents.

We need to pay £7.50 for breakfast club, and £17.50 for after school club each day. Who is getting this for free?

Any activity clubs are paid for separately on top of this.

Labour have all these grand childcare plans for schools and nurseries, except one tiny problem. They can't actually bloody staff them...

Maybe there are circumstances that all parents using these services live under.

Focussing on others will drive you mad.

I have paid through the teeth for wraparound childcare, earnt ok but nowhere near able to afford the rates charged and we have really struggled financially. However I don’t then think everyone behind me has to suffer the same.
My (huge) main concern is who will staff it, the numbers are likely to be huge and they will probably want 1-2 TA’s to do this, they struggle to employ / keep TA’s on minimum wage with a demanding and physical job and this won’t help. Teachers don’t have the time and trying to employ staff to just work early and late in the day is as rare as hens teeth. The only ones I know who have staff employ 6th form students.

It’s a great idea, but staffing it with correct ratio numbers could well prove very difficult.

Probably the sister of the neighbour… 🤣

My (huge) main concern is who will staff it, the numbers are likely to be huge and they will probably want 1-2 TA’s to do this, they struggle to employ / keep TA’s on minimum wage

I agree. The government hasn’t addressed this at all. We struggle to recruit TAs as it is on minimum wage and that’s working during school hours where their own children are at school (our TAs are entirely mums from the local school community-nobody else applies).

I can’t see anyone wanting to do the job from 7/7.30 or 3.30-6 when their own children won’t be in school. If they are expected to have a ratio of 1:30 of tired cranky children in a noisy hall at the end of a long school day, I can’t imagine they will stay for long either.

I was about to say the same. UC requires a minimum earning per month of more than that. So I likely many working will qualify soon. Mostly those who started work after qualifying as you keep your free school meal entitlement until the end of a key stage. I’m a single working parent and have never been eligible even though the school seemed to think I was

Sometimes there is a numbers limit on these, so maybe they should be for those in most need. Hard to decide how this would be allocated.

Most likely they'd have to throw money at it. Not sure that's realistic.

Also without counting the awful parents, for the lone parents. I mean, get as much social and nice people around kids is always a good idea no?

what worries me isn’t that…oh and again we have to pay for that…but more…how on earth is there no family/friends/people!!! That can provide that without the school?? It is worrying that everything that was family is now given by the government…a way to own the children na?

In France, they pushed even more and bam. School for 3+ years is mandatory. There. For Perspective, in Australia it is 7 years old.
🤷🏼‍♀️